solo day out - unwanted company

[FrescoeDay]

I actually know I'm not being unreasonable but my reaction may be out of proportion and I need help wording my response for my desired outcome - solitude.

I'm on a sort of retreat in Italy. Tomorrow I arranged to go on a day trip away from the base to look at some art. I'd arranged for the car to the station, bought my train ticket and was looking forward to it. I told my next door room mate who told someone else who over dinner tonight said he was coming along 'if I didn't mind.' Of course I don't mind him going to the town and looking at the art. If he is here a week it is his opportunity. Of course I don't mind if he catches the same train - although, honestly, I don't want to chat and be friendly and 'on' for an hour plus on the train there (and back?!) Why should I?

I do not want to spend 6 hours going around museums galleries, churches, having lunch, with a stranger. I prefer to look at art alone at my own pace and have my own responses. But over dinner I could hardly say that. The prick (pardon me) cornered me. I am so angry I'm finding it hard to relax. This may be disproportionate. The thing is I am quite able to be cold and freeze people if I feel like it - but I don't want to introduce awkwardness let alone animosity. I am meeting the driver of the retreat tomorrow morning and this other unwanted guest. I don't want to stop him if this is his one chance to go to the town. But I refuse to have my day stolen from me because I end up being polite to this man. I need a healthy middle ground. I am 46. I can't believe I am still being imposed on like this. I don't want to snap but I may.

Thanks for hearing me out. Perspective needed. This has touched a nerve you can tell. I would just never ever do this.

I do think it is reasonable to be angry in this case because it wasn't just an innocent request for her company made in good faith (his reaction at being turned down made that obvious. It looked like it was calculated to manipulate the OP into a 'date' - and while she was on a retreat. Anger is an entirely reasonable response to feeling manipulated and most people can sense when this is happening.

So many of these men recall Shirley Valentine and fantasise.....the sting in the tail of that movie for women (pardon the phrase) is the message that a woman abroad will quickly put aside any desire to be alone, enjoy her own space etc once a man comes along. What most of these men don't understand however, is that they are not Tom Conti.

I was at the pub once with two other colleagues for a quick drink after work.

We were sitting at our own table just enjoying our chat when a random man walked up to us and said "excuse me, can I ask you a question?"

Before either of my colleagues could reply I just said "No". He was taken aback and asked why not. I said because we simply weren't interested in whatever it was he wanted to say.

To be fair to him, he didn't get aggressive or unpleasant, but the look on his face was priceless. He simply could not believe that we would say no to him and that we didn't give a fuck about whatever his stupid question was going to be.

We didn't owe him a second of our time and he didn't get it.

The other part about this situation which I thnk is relevent is that the OP did not share her plans with him at all - anotr woman on the retreat told him about OPs plans and then he just zoomed in - it must have been shocking and unsettling for this to happen out of the blue.

I wonder even if the other woman (who this creep had asked if she wanted company in the middle of the night to watch the US presidential debate ???!!!) - had unconsciously palmed him off onto OP by sharing her plans....

well handles I think. I wonder how he got on? Probably had a long lunch and did not look at many frescoes.

I’m off now to google Italian retreats though..

Doo people never read updates?
It's the See All option
Or colour code the OP's posts?

He was very persistent.
@FrescoeDay was not wrong with her instincts

Just one of many many anecdotes:

I was sat at an outdoor cafe table reading a book and drinking my coffee, enjoying the sunshine & my own company.

Random man sits down at the next table, starts prattling about the lovely weather, how much he loves live etc. I smile slightly & then carry on with the book.

Random man: 'What are you reading?'
Me (focusing on my book) 'A book'.
Long pause, random man staring at me.
Random man: Well you're not very friendly are you?'.
Me: 'No'.

Random man looks very angry, sits at his table glaring at me. I carry on looking at the book but of course can't really read or concentrate any more, my quiet time is spoiled and I don't actually feel safe. No choice but to pay up, drink up & leave.

OP - all I can say is that I’ve been in very similar situations to this MANY times and totally empathise - your feelings of anger are completely justified imo.

I also sound like generally more of a people pleaser than you describe yourself so I’ve been in this situation very often

Well done, OP. You handled that superbly.

So he’s booked to a week on a retreat and instead of prayer and contemplation is spending his time coming up with various pretexts to get the women’s phone numbers and expecting them to spend time entertaining him.

Almost makes you wonder if he should be reported to the organisers? It's quite predatory

Well done, just don’t tell anyone your plans for tomorrow 😉

High Five @FrescoeDay !

Enjoy your solo day tomorrow.

I very much enjoyed reading your update He was persistent wasn't he? PP mentioned sales, and he was definitely using 'the assumptive close'

I bet he was furious to effectively be steered to a destination he never really wanted to go to all by himself. I'm thinking he'll be back early saying it was too hot or some other excuse.

Sounds like you dealt with this really well @FrescoeDay

Tbh, I didn’t think the idea of watching the presidential debate was outrageous. I probably would have been ok with that suggestion - especially as the offer was made if the American guest “was still up”. Easy enough to ignore/fob off if you don’t want the company.

And then I read OP’s update. Just shows that your spidey senses were correct @FrescoeDay . What an awful, odious man!! Trying to control your day out and corner you into meeting up, even after you’d made it clear you wanted solo time. This is why you had that instinctive reaction to him - your subconscious had picked up cues on his behaviour already, I’d wager.

If you get the chance to update and are inclined to do so, I’d be curious whether he came back early and whether he copped an attitude with you…..not that it matters, you were right. I was just wondering. There’s something entertaining about the idea about him wandering around a place that he didn’t actually want to go to 😂 I hope you get the chance to enjoy your solo trip tomorrow- and I hope he doesn’t randomly turn up!!!!

Absolutely. The OP already said no several times and he still wouldnt take the hint so she was 100% right from her first reaction.

Women should trust their instincts and I dont know why other people always try to talk them out of it, it's a really important skill.

I'm actually surprised noone trotted out the usual "aw poor man, he might be ever so lonely- go with him, he might need a chat/to offload his woes/ a pseudo therapist/ he might have dementia blah blah blah" Those are usually the responses when some random man targets a woman to relive his "loneliness". Note that they never target other men though do they?- strange that.....

I'm actually surprised noone trotted out the usual "aw poor man, he might be ever so lonely- go with him, he might need a chat/to offload his woes/ a pseudo therapist/ he might have dementia blah blah blah" Those are usually the responses when some random man targets a woman to relive his "loneliness". Note that they never target other men though do they?- strange that....

Lol. Yes, poor man. Maybe he's depressed?

Hope you have a great day tomorrow OP.

Echoing what other posters have said, the woman in the next room is a blabbermouth. Don't share too much with her!

Having read a later update I agree.

Ugh.

So well done OP! You handled that beautifully.

I've been in this scenario more times than I can count, it's so depressing and aggravating. I love doing stuff alone, its the only me time I get.

I remember one time sitting in a pub drinking a nice glass of wine, reading my book and some bloke sat down at my table and tried to start up a conversation. I gave very minimal one word answers and hoped he'd get the hint but he didnt. He just kept on and on and on blathering on about himself and trying to ask me questions about myself. In the end I said "thank you, but I'm just enjoying some time to myself and I really just wanted to have a quiet drink alone". He then muttered that I was a "nasty bitch" and got up and huffed away. I had been perfectly polite to him and he reacted with anger and utter incredulity that I wasnt desperate for his pathetic attention. Its also happened to me at the gym, at cafes, on public transport etc

I dont know why men do this- are their egos really that huge that they think any woman alone is desperate for their company?- it baffles me. I dont know of any women that would behave like that, it's always men who do this. The entitlement is off the scale.

Tbh in my experience women can also be extremely shitty when they don’t get the attention they want or feel they deserve!

Tbh in my experience women can also be extremely shitty when they don’t get the attention they want or feel they deserve!

I'm sure some can be of course. But men dont have the fear of women becoming aggressive and violent or a threat to their safety in the same way that women do when men do it. So, whilst it might be irritating for them, I dont think the two are comparable. Now, I get quite nervous at saying no to men because of the angry way they've reacted in the past and thats not ok.

Can we have one discussion about shitty behaviour that many men exhibit without someone coming along and saying ‘well women are shitty too!!’. Women in general do not intrude on the space of men who are strangers to them. They wouldn’t plonk themselves down next to an unknown man, ask what they’re reading and try and stare out a conversation with them. Women don’t live with the mindset that a man by himself at any given time is some poor soul who’s simply waiting for her to come along and save him from some sad* future of cats and wine.

*see: being threatened with a good time.

You would think that reading a book with a drink beside you would be enough of a hint that you are not interested in talking to anyone, but oh no.

Women are entirely justified in responding with anger to intrusions like this. Such stories are as old as time: read Nicholas Nickleby for an anecdote of a man harassing a woman who is reading. I have always had a soft spot for Dickens as he really seemed to get what it is like.

Oh shut up, I was only saying what I'd do. I'm sorry but I have a thing called a life and don't have time or inclination to read every post. Just ignore my post if you don't like it.

Rude. You don't need to read every post, just the OPs