Dil trying to ruin my relationship with my dd

[worldlyweather]

When my son met his now wife he was still living at home as was my dd.
Dil used to spend a lot of time at our house with ds but admittedly my dd didn't take to her straight away and while my dd didn't realise she was here dd came in mocking her and she overheard.
Ds and dil then moved to their own house and have since married and had a child, I didn't go to the wedding as dd was excluded.

Dil wants nothing to do with my dd and ds has backed her decision, this means our dd has never even met her nephew and misses her brother and is utterly heartbroken by all this.
I haven't met him either as I have been instructed not to come with my dd but have decided not to exclude her knowing this is so hurtful and have explained my reasons to ds and dil.
I have tried to get my ds to put things right with his sister but he's not interested and is refusing to see me at my home because she might be there and I will not turn her away because they don't want to be friendly.
Ds says I should be on their side as dd did wrong and I shouldn't protect her but I feel this is an overreaction and needs to be addressed, while I agree that she was perhaps unkind she didn't deserve to be cut off.

The family have been invited to visit but again this is to be with the exclusion of my dd who is devastated and so far we've stayed away until she's included, unfortunately this doesn't look like it's ever going to happen and I miss my son and I'm missing out on my first grandchild.
They have never made any ultimatum but it feels like there's an invisible ultimatum that if I want a part in their life it's to be at the exclusion of dd or I lose the relationship with them altogether.
I feel in an impossible position as in my mind I'm standing by my dd over dil but my son sees it that I'm standing by my dd over him and that I'm choosing not to see them by choosing her.

Dd hasn't apologised but she didn't deliberately say it for her to hear, she was just pretending to be her and having a laugh with it as she didn't particularly take to her she thought only we could see/hear.

She still needs to apologise @worldlyweather .

However, the exclusion exercised by your DS and DiLaw is excessive. Four years! Your DiL & DS are starting to move into childish territory.

And your DiL needs to get over herself, and realise that just because her husband loves her, her husband's sibling (your DD) has no obligation to like her. Your DD should appreciate her sister-in-law because she's someone her brother loves, but it's a sad fact that not all our in-laws are to our taste.

For example, my brother's wife is a perfectly nice person, but she's not someone I have anything in common with except that she & my brother love each other & are married. So I make sure I get on with her, for the sake of my brother & because she loves him & appreciates him, so I honour that in her. If they were to separate (and goodness knows, my brother has reasons not to stay married to her, but that's another story) I would probably see her very rarely, and I wouldn't seek her out.

But if I had been rude about her and she'd overheard, I would be mortified and would offer a sincere apology for upsetting her.

But not for not "taking to" her. I can't apologise for my personal feelings about her. We can't all be liked or "taken to" by everyone we meet - we can hope that those who don't much like us don't let us hear that, or tell us to our face.

I think it's quite the opposite. Women will often put up with too much because they are taught to always be nice, easy and compliant. It's only later in life that many learn they don't have to take crap.

I think a better title for this thread would be “DD has ruined my relationship with DIL DS and GS”

If I mocked my sister in law, even just in front of my parents, I'd be told to stop straight away. It's rude and childish. The fact you see nothing wrong with it shows how you actually feel about your daughter in law.

At 24 she was an adult not a child, she has to accept the consequences and so do you.

I can't believe you are standing by your DD through all of this when she hasn't even apologised.

Don't try to make out that she hasn't had the chance - she's had four years!! Imo to apologise now would be too little too late. She's made her bed, but for whatever reason you are choosing to lie in it with her. You've made the choice to exclude yourself from your son and dil's life. Seems like your daughter is your favourite and can do no wrong in your eyes, and your son is supposed to just suck it up.

You and your daughter are both BU.

I love the fact that this has gone on for 17 pages (on my screen at least!), yet nada from the OP since AD 1479.
Another firework post; light the blue touch-paper and retire...

I hope the OP is feeling embarrassed after being told by several hundred posters that her daughter needs to apologise, even if she has only read the first few replies.

I find it staggering that she doesn't think the way she and her daughter have behaved is wrong though.

Well then, you reap what you sow. ⬆️

So @worldlyweather, do you now see that it’s not your DIL that’s the problem, or do you still think it was right to stand by your daughter much to your son’s detriment?

So YOUR daughter, a fully grown adult, got caught mocking (bullying btw!) your DIL, hasn’t apologised, yet it’s your DIL that’s trying to ruin your relationship? Jesus Christ, you’re literally the MIL everybody fears getting! Your DD needs to apologise for a start. You are CHOOSING not to see your grand children because you cannot admit your daughter was wrong and now you’re saying the DIL is trying to ruin the relationship?! I’m with your son and DIL on this one!

Why do you assume it is the DIL holding a grudge? Could be that daughter has form and her brother had enough. Some people really want to pretend that a man has little control in a relationship and are so easily led,

Considering the first thing OP says is that her daughter hadn’t taken well to her DIL, it is likely this was not the first time her daughter has been rude about her brother’s girlfriend now wife. This could have easily been the last straw for OP’s son about his sister. True, the sister doesn’t have to like her, but not even being able to apologise when caught speaks volume and still does since she has never apologised at all and doesn’t read like she has ever tried and why would she when she has her mum supporting her in her behaviour.

The very least the sister could have done is apologise and be polite like an adult. Many of us have dealt with family members we don’t like and can still remain polite. If her brother really mattered to her, she would have apologised the first week, not let it become four years and crying to her enabling mum because she can’t be bothered to apologised. She chose not to apologise therefore she chose to be on the outside.

So you think if something is said privately it's ok?

So if you overheard your DP/DH saying he thinks you are a stupid cow and he wishes he'd never met you, then that would be ok? Because he didn't say it to you?

She missed her own son’s wedding over the matter. She hasn’t met her grandchild. And her OP was about DIL driving a wedge between OP and DD, with no mention of the wedge between OP and her son.

Seeing as she’s been so stubborn and so blind, I highly doubt she will feel embarrassed or realise shes screwed up and instead will keep blaming her DIL for everything.

In days gone by this would be hot topic for Jeremy Kyle.

Your DD was a dick. She has never apologised for her nasty behaviour. You are taking her side by choosing not to go to your own son's wedding and choosing not to be a part of their lives.

If you want to repair it the first step is to tell your DD she has to be accountable for what she did. She has to apologise. And you should apologise for blatantly taking your DD's side. Then see where it goes from there. Because it is their choice how she is in their lives, not yours.

What a complete bs post! So in 4 years your daughter “hasn’t had the chance to apologise”?!!! She doesn’t even own a phone?! Or has the hood Grace to visit? You said they were living with you so maybe your daughter should have been aware the dil was around?
How would you feel if you walked in on your dil mocking YOU? Would you still feel if it wasn’t intended for your ears it’s ok? Wow, glad you’re not my mum

I agree with PP that the mocking was probably the last straw in a series of unpleasantnesses, not an isolated incident. After all, they “never took to” the DIL. Given OPs penchant for extreme minimising, I should think a lot more went on.

Some have wondered if the mocking was accent, race, weight etc. Possibly. But seeing as there was resentment from the outset theres possibly some jealousy going on. DIL is perhaps very very attractive.

What a stupid immature family!

The title of your post says it all. Your DD was rude and mocking. Yet she is the one trying to ruin your relationship with your DD? And she is devastated? And the fact that you allowed your daughter yo mock someone who was a guest in your home and didn't make her immediately apologise seems like the rest of you don't like her either. Did uou pull her up on it ir laugh along?

Your DD did wrong with mocking her, but my word this is a massive over reaction from you all.
Why did any of you let it get to this point? Surely you would have sat DD and SDiL down and worked it out- namely DD giving a sincere apology and taking some accountability for her actions. And missing your own sons wedding is massive.
Your DD was 24 years old when she did this - I thought you'd say she was 16. A 24 year old woman can take accountability for her actions and she should have apologised and made it right, but you also have all let your family be separated over something that could have been fixed.

This reads as if you’re blaming your DIL because of your own daughters mean girl actions. You’re choosing to not be a part of your son’s life. You’ve made that decision, nobody else.

Your daughter sounds old enough to be responsible for her own actions and to grow up and apologise.

If my Mum didn’t come to my wedding because she was siding with my sibling over them being a nasty person, I’d be going no contact with you. But then again, my sibling is a nice person and my Mum doesn’t play favourites.

Your daughter needs to accept accountability and apologise, as do you. Or you can just deal with your daughter’s strop if you go and see your other child and Grandson.

But that is partly what frustrates me about MN. We only have the OP's post to go on, she says there was only one incident. Yet some people are making vile comments on the assumption that it was much more than that and then the MN pile on starts.
You can pretty much gauge how a thread is going to go by the first few posts.
There have been plenty of threads in the past about bridezillas and daughter in laws (and tbf son in laws) driving a wedge between their partner and their family. Yet posters here have automatically leapt to the assumption of it being the MiL's fault.
I assume the OP chose the title because she feels the DiL is at fault. But we have no more facts to go on.

I replied based on the ops posts only.

Turns out I was saying the same as many posters.

Ever think the pile on happens because of what the op wrote, and everyone else seeing it the same way? Plenty of posts get a lot of conflicting replies...

Yes, there's always a whole other side to things we read here. When I opened the post my expectation was that it was going to be another blaming the DIL for the failings of the son. Odds are this is going to be much more complicated than one incident though.

Your title says 'my dil is trying to ruin my relationship with my dd' and I think that its really telling....

This title suggests what you really see as the issue here, not the fact that you are losing time with your grandchild. You should have pulled your dd into line and made her apologise sincerely at the time.

I say this as someone who love my own MIL dearly. There has been some animosity between dh and his siblings over the years and never had that impacted their relationship with their mother, nor my relationship or any of her grandchildren's relationships with her.

You need to fix this. YOU