Did women used to enjoy being catcalled?

[Gofastboatsmojito]

Hi,

Filtering a recent discussion with my stepmum I just wanted to survey the 55+ year olds of mumsnet to check whether I'm way off.

She is absolutely insistent that in her youth women (most? all?) enjoyed being whistled or shouted appreciatively at when waking past a building site.

She thinks women's perception of this has changed in the last 20 years. All her friends enjoyed it in the 70s and 80s apparently.

For context she has been the subject of male violence including sexual violence and does not equate the two.

I find it hard to believe everyone enjoyed it and assume that women felt a lot less able to say they didn't like it due to fear of being called frigid, uptight etc.

I'm sure the answer might lie somewhere between the two extremes but just wondering what an AIBU poll might say.

V grateful if women of age 55+ only vote

YABU = in my youth the majority of women I knew considered a wolf whistle as a cheeky but welcome compliment

YANBU = I didn't enjoy this even in the 70s

It never bothered me, I felt indifferent to it. I’m 53.

I'm over 55
I was never given any attention from men at all ( not that pretty , not that confident etc) and once I did hear a whistle from a building site in the distance ( might not even have been for me) and it did give me a moments ' oh, someone does think I'm ok' but it didn't upset me or faze me ( this must have been around 1983?) i just carried on walking. Busy area so didn't feel threatened or anything.
Never happened before or since though.
I can see why it doesn't happen now, but there are much worse things happen to people than this years ago and today I would probably be offended on someone else's behalf if I heard them being cat called or whistled at.
I've never experienced any kind of sexual harassment at work , but start a thread on it on here and the stories are awful, so I know I've been lucky not to have had any of this either :(

Although it didn't happen often it wasn't really very nice.

The considerate contractor scheme helped to some degree.

I'm actually finding it quite depressing the amount of women who find it a compliment.

A compliment is 'l like your dress' or 'you're really funny' or 'your new haircut looks great' - it is not getting heckled by complete strangers in the street. Those men don't give two shits what you look like, it's not intended to be flattering or a reflection of how attractive you are, it's intended to be aggressive and intimidating.

The reason they do it to younger women more than older ones is because it's easier to intimidate a young women on her own, it's not just because young women are better looking. Bloody hell.

I was a teenager in the 60's and no I didn't enjoy the behaviour but it didn't bother me or even notice it particularly. If its just whistling or yelling from a building site then on a busy street it was kind of part of the background noise. My parents taught us that we were entitled to our space in the world and didn't have to put up with the bad manners of others but I do agree that we also had to be streetwise. What i do remember is when the "Good Manners" building sites came into being. Construction companies signed up to a charter of no swearing, no loud music, no whistles and cat calls and care over dust and dirt, vehicle parking and so on. From some quarters the no swearing and catcalls thing was seen as a fuss about nothing.

I’m not quite 55 but I am old enough to remember when cat calling was normal.

From my perspective there was usually a bit of cognitive dissonance going on with it. Personally it made me feel uncomfortable at a really instinctive level but because a lot of women wore it as a badge of honour you sort of felt it was something you ought to want.

The corollary to cat calling is this horrible afterburn which a lot of men used to do whereby if you didn’t smile or if you responded negatively they would shout: “.Youre ugly anyway.” I remember when I was about 18 being told in front of a big group of people that I wasn’t good looking enough to be a Page 3 girl (by a bloke who was no oil painting himself). Because I had been talking about how sexist Page 3 was.

I remember the feeling of shame and embarrassment that came over me and I just blustered and giggled in order not to look like an angry feminist. After he left there was a creeping sense of fury at myself and the fact that I hadn’t called him on it.

The worst thing about cat calling for me is that it denied you your ability to have a comeback or to put your own side of the story on record. I never felt frightened by it, it just made me feel like I was something that existed purely for men to project their primitive instincts onto.

I’m so glad it’s no longer acceptable.

I did enjoy it up til I was about 17, which says a lot about the men doing it.

If it happened I hated it.

Yes! I have women in my family (of a certain age) say they miss it. Maybe it was done tongue in cheek back in the day? It was more playful? No clue

But whenever it happens to me I am genuinely uncomfortable. It happened to me recently outside Waitrose in Camden - it felt aggressive and was mortifying.

But I’ve had a bad encounter in the past where a old-ish man exclaimed something about my looks and started walking towards me only to be physically restrained by his two younger companions. It was outside King’s X, my first week of university and I was terrified. So detest men acting this way.

I’m in my 40’s.
Hated it.
Made me feel uncomfortable at best, unsafe at worst

@Whysler - no, it was not "more playful or tongue in cheek, back in the day". At all.

Grew up in Poland where boys are cold and do not show any appreciation. At 15, me and friends were delighted on a school trip to Italy that boys were cat calling. We felt really attractive. 🤦🏻‍♀️ Now I'm grown up, I feel a tinge of danger when it happens...

My mum is in her 80s and she said she absolutely loved it when she was younger. I had it a few times in my late teens/early 20s and have to say I liked it too. Nearly always made me smile.

Totally agree. It was about belittling women. Urgh.

No, I hated it & dreaded having to walk past a building site or groups of workmen. If you didn't respond or said anything to reject the comments, it only made it worse with their comments. I think it was so acceptable at the time, part of the culture. They couldn't grasp that many women didn't enjoy it & felt degraded by it. It went along with page 3, Pirrelli calenders, Miss World & the like.

I’m 62 and the first time I was catcalled, it was a neighbour who knew my age. I was 12.

This tells you all you need to know about guys who do it.

Exactly this. We put up with all manner of shite. Some of it irritating. Some of it embarrassing. Some of it terrifying.

It used to make me smile. There was a difference then to how men leer at woman now.

I didn't mind just a whistle.
Actual comments were horrible.

However when pp's start on about the 70's being sexist I agree it was but it was a lot less dangerous imo.
Online porn, choking during sex, stalking and spiked drinks. I'm a lot more scared of men now.

Like a few of the responses on here, I had utterly shit self esteem related to my looks (still do, tbh) and yeah, I used to be embarrassed but flattered if I got wolf whistled at. I would take it as a signal that I wasn't completely, irredeemably ugly.

Mid 40s.
Having grown up being told how hideously ugly I was by kids in school, being whistled at or ogled from 15 did feel flattering. I wanted to be seen;I wanted to be sexy. I knew I was clever and ambitious etc, etc, but I didn't want to be seen like that- I wanted to feel desired, because that seemed much harder to achieve.

It wasn't a lot less dangerous in the 70s.

I won't vote on their behalf but my mum (70s) and recently late grandma (would be 100) were happy to be approached and asked say to dance or offered a drink in an 'appropriate' place such as a dance hall (DGM) or disco (mum), or pub, as long as a 'no thank you' was taken on the chin. My mum still remembers a hurtful comment along the lines of 'well I don't fancy girls in glasses anyway'. She recalls feeling embarrassed at whistling etc and had to report a flasher in the park.

DGM talked a lot about the war. She was quite happy with the compliments etc from young soldiers in public places etc, when polite (I imagine she got a lot, she was gorgeous). I think as they were identifiable in uniform and she had a job related to the war effort too, they felt quite safe at a strange time.
However it was interesting talking to her as the other side of that were a lot of intimidating incidents with older men, when walking through parks alone, going places at night, she certainly didn't enjoy that attention during the blackout especially. She didn't go into details but later pertained to some kind of sexual assault around that time.

It sounds like a similar thing. Happy to be approached as humans, but not as objects. If someone is age appropriate, mindful of place and friendly with no expectations then that sounds like it was different from bothering women, leering or with the capacity to turn nasty and I think most women can tell the difference.

Oh also mid 40s.

Perhaps not but it felt so to me.