To wonder (thinking about this awful French rape case) if humans are just rotten

[OptimismvsRealism]

It wasn't just the husband - at least 80 men went along with this. Guys with ordinary lives drawn out of nowhere.

I wonder if it would be better if we were to just wind things up as a species.

Convicted of sexual assault, not rape

If you want to go by the letter of the law, yes. What she did was just as vile as what a man can do with a penis.

I didn't say women went to war raping men. I said woman have raped.

NO. NO THEY HAVE NOT. The man raped.

She wasn’t convicted of rape though - you said she was

Oh right, you've read the yougov website. You are an expert.
I was on the defence team of a woman charged with rape in the 1990s. She pleaded guilty and went to prison.
Or perhaps I am just making it up for a laugh.
Read the rest of the thread to make up the rest of your law degree. Not answering any more questions about this.

But the letter of the law is the definition of rape. That's not diminishing what she did but rape can only be completed with a penis.

https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/rape-and-sexual-offences-chapter-7-key-legislation-and-offences

So did you not adhere to the CPS guidance then?

Why would you be in the defence team for someone who has already pled guilty?

There’s only a handful of joint enterprise rape cases involving women and I can’t find any online where the woman pled guilty in the 1990s

You also said you’re a retired barrister but didn’t know the definition of rape lol

Oh, for goodness sake, I'm not making it up.
Here's another case from 2001. The law may have changed since then, I'm not up to date

If you can google an ancient Guardian article, then you should be able to google the Sexual
Offences Act, which you'll discover was updated in 2003 to define rape as the penetration of vagina, mouth or anus with a penis.

Most men.

How many men do you think we're asked and didn't report it over those years? Because the police found this in another investigation. Not one single man reported it.

Not one.

Oh you want examples but not including most of the examples? Catch yourself on. Rape by a woman in the UK is alway joint enterprise. Doesn't that count for you?

I was on the defence team of a woman charged with rape in the 1990s. She pleaded guilty and went to prison

How were you defending her if she'd pleaded guilty? There would have been no trial.

She doesn't even need to Google I've shared the legislation twice on this thread.

Oh you want examples but not including most of the examples? Catch yourself on. Rape by a woman in the UK is alway joint enterprise. Doesn't that count for you?

It's the MAN raping. FFS.

But you said women raped when they went to war? Are you meaning that they rape by joint enterprise at war? What wars are you talking about??

The whataboutery attempts to deflect the horror of this by making "women do terrible things too" are despicable but that's not correct.

Woman guilty of rape NI
found guilty of towpath rape https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2001/mar/17/sarahhall?CMP=sharebtnurl Woman guilty of rape England

Here however it's 100% men. It's not the human race who are at fault. Gisèle Pélicot's bravery and dignity is astonishing.

Because people on here are saying a woman can be found guilty of rape when she can't.

She can be found guilty of rape as joint enterprise but not as individual. People have said women go to war and rape.

Fact is, it seems anything will be used to excuse men and minimise their behaviour by insisting women are just as bad.

No, she can't rape as in insert her penis, but she can be guilty of rape as a matter of joint enterprise. Not just aiding and abetting but actually guilty of rape. Or she could up to at least 2001. As I've said, I am not up to date now.

@AngelicKaty, because the case she defended was in the 1990s. Rape got a specific definition in 2003.

Oh you want examples but not including most of the examples?

You won't have any other examples as rape in this country is a man's crime, very occasionally with female accomplices. Women don't have a penis, so they cannot rape anyone themselves.

Or their fathers? 🙄

No, she can't rape as in insert her penis, but she can be guilty of rape as a matter of joint enterprise.

But the point is that no woman can be guilty of rape without a man being present. What are you not getting?!?

What have their Dads done to teach them?

At what point will men be held accountable rather than blaming women for everything and everyone?