To wonder (thinking about this awful French rape case) if humans are just rotten

[OptimismvsRealism]

It wasn't just the husband - at least 80 men went along with this. Guys with ordinary lives drawn out of nowhere.

I wonder if it would be better if we were to just wind things up as a species.

This one fucked me up when I first read about it last year. I actually ended up having some sort of psychotic episode. This woman had been married to the man for decades,it's unfathomable.

No one comes into someone's house and randomly bullies them. Rarely do they come into someone's house and rape them, either. Things just don't tend to happen that way (people, men and women, tend to choose their victims) but if you'd like to see the world as black and white, on you go.

I hate the men who abused me, I hate that they used the physical/psychological power they held over me to abuse me. But I equally hate the girls who abused me, I hate the psychological power they held over me. I hate that they did that every day for 5 years.

Should my sons suffer for any of the above? No.

When you say 2 - 3 men and some women have been "utterly vile" to you, do you mean they've raped or assaulted you? Assuming you don't mean this, which of these two groups of people do you think would be most likely to rape or assault you?

Fuck me. The whatabouttery on this thread is fucking unbelievable.

Tell you what - give us some men's names too.

I Donvt care if I sound angry and disrespectful.
I AM FUCKING LIVID

The nsmalters are the trult disrespectful ones. Tedious.

They. Won t. Pick. You.

@Lizzie67384 In her experience, women have had a more profound impact on her than men. Yes even in the case of being raped. We don't know the specifics of this but I don't for one mini believe that the ongoing torment she experienced has not had an absolutely profound impact on her.

The reason why we get so angry and enraged about this, as I said in another post, is because men can really at any point totally overpower us and strip us of everything and we can't do a thing about it. Women can't really do that. I believe a large proportion of people don't acknowledge this fact in their mind( that we could turn into Afghanistan if enough men so wished). It does not mean that another person's own experience is not valid.
And no nothing compared to this case. I don't feel that's what the poster was doing.

You actually said that you only heard the voices of the women in your head ‘twenty years later’.

How can you possibly compare rape to someone being mean to you?????? I mean I’m actually baffled by this?

The trauma you have suffered sounds horrendous.

I am interested in how you perceive your sons will suffer ?

Well they won't suffer if you keep apologising and justifying the abhorrent actions of men and insisting women are just as bad. If anything you will be bolstering their safety and security.

How about teach them how to be decent?

Point out all shitty male behaviour and call them out if they show it, don't just laugh and say boys will be boys and that girls are just as bad.

‘No nothing compared to this case’; so gang rape is abhorrent and doesn’t compare to a woman being mean to another woman but one man raping one woman you can see that the PP has a point about women being mean being worse than rape???

Can we just stop saying ' As a mother of 2 sons blah blah". Nobody is saying that your sons are rapists. Neither is mine.

They are saying that as a class, your sons are more likely to rape or assault than your daughters, however mean and bitchy your daughters may be. I don't know why this is so difficult to understand or why you need to be so defensive.

I think the thing that sums this up for me is that this man was able to recruit, with relative ease, at least 70 men who were willing to rape a vulnerable, drugged woman. In a supposedly civilised country.

You try finding 70 women who are willing to do something similar. You'll be waiting a very long time.

@CappuccinoChocolate I feel the poster is concerned her sons will be perceived as potential rapists, by the mere fact they're male.

She's already said she was raped by a man, abused by a male and bullied by 3 females which was worse and proves women are just as bad.

I honestly think it can’t be a real account? Surely no one could possible think this?!

Instead of bringing up Myra Hindley and Rose West what about some examples of female violence and sexual violence in the last 12 months?

It seems to me every single week now there's at least one story in the news where a woman and/or children have been seriously harmed at the hands of a man/men.

Sometimes I think about that man who murdered his ex girlfriend, her mum and her sister with a cross bow. Tortured them to death. Because he was upset at being dumped. It was headline news for a day or so. Couple of week later came the horrific murder of young girls at a dance class - only targeting girls. Oh - and the growing cases of men who like to set their house on fire and kill their own kids to punish their ex.

Oh but...hang on "women are bitchy"?!?

Give me fucking strength.

@Lizzie67384 if this post is genuine - I do believe some people can and do feel this way. What is important is to understand the details and to explore why. Is it due to the circumstance or is there more to it.

She obviously does, she has said it multiple times. She's also concerned that her two sons will be considered rapists hence her saying it's women too as opposed to teaching her sons how not to be.

Just to clarify to anyone to whom it may concern, I was not only called 'a man in a dress' once and think that is worth a lifetime of suffering. I don't genuinely believe anyone is that simplistic as to believe that. That was one small example of a prolonged campaign of bullying.

I also don't think it's logical to believe that my original response was a response to the horrific crimes committed in France. My original comment was in response to all the generalised comments against men/boys.

If a lone woman saw my 6 ft tall, powerful son coming down a dark alley and prefers to avoid him because he might be a rapist, so what? Can't say it bothers me one bit. Doesn't bother him either.

All this yammering about men's feelings being hurt when women are being literally torn to pieces.

Yeah but it just feels like not a genuine post, I fail to see how you could be raped by a man, abused by another man and then say a woman being bitchy to you is worse than that?

I would be very surprised if any rape survivor felt that way

The mental gymnastics even some women will perform to prop up the patriarchy!

@WeakWeakWeak many people are not aware of the true prevalence of these stories and it informs ones world view. Many women and maybe men will have no interest or these stories won't feature in their algorithms etc. Our views will be informed by our own direct experiences or what we are consuming.

That's because you've taught your son to be respectful and aware of his physical advantage over women. Not because you've taught your son shame in being a man.