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To be horrified by fire attack on Jewish synagogue in France by pro Palestinian terrorist

204 replies

Helpabojttown · 25/08/2024 14:02

This is awful, my thoughts are with the French and worldwide Jewish community.

French police arrest synagogue blast suspect https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c5y3d4v43gjo

A CCTV image purportedly showing a suspected attacker at the synagogue in La Grande-Motte

French police arrest synagogue blast suspect

The man was shot and injured by police after he opened fire on the officers in southern France, reports say.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c5y3d4v43gjo

OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
SensibleSigma · 26/08/2024 14:04

I think people who marched for peace alongside people carrying such appalling slogans should consider whether they have inadvertently supported attacks such as this.

The impression I’ve been given from the marches I’ve seen reported has been that the antisemitism present- if not the purpose- was not in anyway hidden.

I’m desperately sad about the plight of Palestinians, but think marching among antisemites is counter productive and will lead inevitably to further hardline militarisation of Israel. Were you marching when Israel was routinely under attack?

It seems to me that the people best placed to help Palestinians are reluctant to do so for political reasons of their own.

alittleprivacy · 26/08/2024 14:18

Sassy31 · 25/08/2024 19:40

Sorry the Republic of Ireland - as Northern Ireland is part of the Uk
so it is commonly referred to as southern Ireland by the Irish people of the south .

It definitely isn't. No-one in Ireland calls Ireland, Southern Ireland, especially when the most northern parts are in the republic.

blackcherryconserve · 26/08/2024 14:28

Flibflobflibflob · 26/08/2024 09:00

I hope for Jewish people though it some comfort to know that vast majority of people who voted think this was awful.

I'd feel more reassured if fewer people attended pro Palestinian marches, whether in good faith or not, that inevitably increases the antisemitism in this country. Too many attendees appear oblivious to this fact.

blackcherryconserve · 26/08/2024 14:29

SensibleSigma · 26/08/2024 14:04

I think people who marched for peace alongside people carrying such appalling slogans should consider whether they have inadvertently supported attacks such as this.

The impression I’ve been given from the marches I’ve seen reported has been that the antisemitism present- if not the purpose- was not in anyway hidden.

I’m desperately sad about the plight of Palestinians, but think marching among antisemites is counter productive and will lead inevitably to further hardline militarisation of Israel. Were you marching when Israel was routinely under attack?

It seems to me that the people best placed to help Palestinians are reluctant to do so for political reasons of their own.

Absolutely this. Thank you.

blackcherryconserve · 26/08/2024 14:34

Humdingerydoo I feel the same as you.

YOYOK · 26/08/2024 22:40

@Bullbreedbliss is a hypocrite, she has posted a few threads about very minor issues. I have half a mind to post replies on them about actual tragedies that occur.

Kendodd · 27/08/2024 18:04

pigletinthewoods · 26/08/2024 11:07

Imo, everyone taking part in a march with people holding placards saying ‘globalise the intifada’ and chanting ‘from the river to the sea’ (Hamas’ slogan) has been marching for this. Ignorance is not a defence, sorry.

Anyone who cares about the Palestinian people should be opposing Hamas. They use children as shields and steal international aid so that people starve.

Out of curiosity, have you also marched in any of the counter demonstrations?

Edited

I attended a small local demo, there were no 'river to sea' chants or anti Israel placards or none that I saw in the maybe, 250 people there. Out of interest, how do you feel about 'river to sea' use by Israeli people? There were Palestinian flags, I know these were banned for some time by the Israeli government (this led to the birth of the watermelon symbol) I don't know if you would find them offensive or not.

Did I attend a pro Israel march, no, I did not (I didn't knowof any locally). I did go to my nearest synagogue as I wanted to show some support. Nobody was there though and to be honest I felt a bit awkward about being there (even though we are a part Jewish family). I didn't want my presence to suggest that I attached them in any way at all to the actions of the Israeli government in Gaza, so actually, I'm glad nobody was there, as what would I have said anyway apart from I hope everyone is OK.

I have said before on these threads that I wish I could wear a Palestinian flag badge without it being read as support for Hamas. Likewise, I would like to wear an Israeli flag without it being read as support for the Israeli government.
I have been called antisemitic multiple times on these threads for wanting the Israeli assault on Gaza to end. I've learnt to add every time that I also want to see the hostages freed and Hamas gone to try to reduce the chance of name calling.

JaneDoeHere · 27/08/2024 18:26

@Kendodd pretty sure you would have been called antisemitic for saying or alluding to something antisemitic.

25milesfromhome · 27/08/2024 18:30

I have been called antisemitic multiple times on these threads for wanting the Israeli assault on Gaza to end.

This seems unlikely.

Bullbreedbliss · 27/08/2024 18:31

@JaneDoeHere is it antisemitic to think the Israeli government are despicable?

Bullbreedbliss · 27/08/2024 18:34

YOYOK · 26/08/2024 22:40

@Bullbreedbliss is a hypocrite, she has posted a few threads about very minor issues. I have half a mind to post replies on them about actual tragedies that occur.

I never actually described any of those things as horrific though, did I? Btw, searching for my username is abit weird and stalker-ish.

JaneDoeHere · 27/08/2024 18:34

Whats more is the context of how things are used. A Palestinian flag being waved at a march (we’ll call it a peaceful march for the sake of the argument), not really a problem in itself.

Now, after the October 7th attack, where I live, which is a Jewish area, men ferociously drove through the high street, blasting music and shouting from the cars (about 3 separate cars but seemed to be connected with one another) with a huge Palestinian flag flying along with them.

There was no demo or march, it was a weekday shortly after the terror attack, they chose a Jewish area. Same near my synagogue with people revving up and driving by shouting and having the Palestinian flag flying on a normal Shabbat. This is not where city centre protests are taking place. So maybe that clears things up a bit for you @Kendodd

JaneDoeHere · 27/08/2024 18:35

Bullbreedbliss · 27/08/2024 18:31

@JaneDoeHere is it antisemitic to think the Israeli government are despicable?

Well, it is a bit xenophobic to say the least.

SababaToo · 27/08/2024 18:45

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines - previously banned poster.

tumbletonion · 27/08/2024 19:32

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

Kendodd · 27/08/2024 19:34

One awful thing about this whole conflict, wider antisemitism and all the threads it has given birth to is the way people are constantly pushed to pick a side. If you support Palestinian people and their ambition for statehood, you must hate Jews and want the destruction of Israel. If you support the right of Israel to exist and Jewish people generally, you must hate Palestinians and support the bombing of Gaza.
It's exhausting.

Kendodd · 27/08/2024 19:37

JaneDoeHere · 27/08/2024 18:35

Well, it is a bit xenophobic to say the least.

I think the current Israeli government are despicable. Likewise the Trump administration and the Tories/Reform.

JaneDoeHere · 27/08/2024 19:39

To be honest it seems most threads where a Jewish community is mentioned, it comes full circle of something antisemitic, bringing up Gaza, talking of Palestine and Israel and the governments… because in a way they connect and in a way they don’t. This attack in France was carried out by a terroist who was pro Palestine. So to an extent I can see why topics are covered and conversations move round.

But back to France, how are the community coping in the aftermath? I don’t expect many Jews feel safe there. I remember seeing quite a few years ago now some French Jews on the news talking about leaving France over antisemitism fears.

Kendodd · 27/08/2024 19:45

JaneDoeHere · 27/08/2024 19:39

To be honest it seems most threads where a Jewish community is mentioned, it comes full circle of something antisemitic, bringing up Gaza, talking of Palestine and Israel and the governments… because in a way they connect and in a way they don’t. This attack in France was carried out by a terroist who was pro Palestine. So to an extent I can see why topics are covered and conversations move round.

But back to France, how are the community coping in the aftermath? I don’t expect many Jews feel safe there. I remember seeing quite a few years ago now some French Jews on the news talking about leaving France over antisemitism fears.

Well said for pointing out the French attacks and bringing the thread back to that.
I remember seeing that on TV as well a couple of years ago.

Comedycook · 27/08/2024 19:54

I have been called antisemitic multiple times on these threads for wanting the Israeli assault on Gaza to end

And I have been told many times that I have called posters anti semetic when I haven't.... it's pretty bizarre. First time it happened I actually went back and re read all my posts and nope, hadn't at all.

79Helene · 27/08/2024 19:56

This is the full article.

The attempted attack on a synagogue in southern France on Saturday, August 24, marks a turning point in the long series of anti-Semitic acts recorded in France since the attack − accompanied by massacres and numerous acts of violence − by Hamas against Israel on October 7, 2023, followed by the Israeli army's destruction of the Gaza Strip in retaliation. These anti-Semitic acts have increased not only in number but also in severity. For the first time, it appears that the intention of El Hussein K., the 33-year-old Algerian suspected of this attack, was to kill Jews.

The number of anti-Semitic acts has increased significantly since October 7: In 2023, 1,676 such acts were recorded, four times as many as in 2022, and 887 in the first half of this year, compared with 304 in the same period in 2023. The increase is not just in numbers, it is also marked by an increase in the violence of these acts. They recently went from tagging the walls of synagogues and businesses run by members of the Jewish community, to physical assaults, such as the one suffered by 62-year-old Marco S. outside a synagogue in Paris' 20th arrondissement. On May 17, an arson attack was committed on a synagogue in Normandy and on Saturday, an attack was planned against the Grand-Motte synagogue, in southern France.

According to outgoing Interior Minister Gérald Darmanin, the alleged perpetrator of Saturday's attack was seeking to set fire to the seaside town's synagogue, where five worshippers, including the rabbi, were present. The attacker, wearing a Palestinian flag around his waist and a keffiyeh on his head, also planned to attack those who tried to escape the flames with an axe, which was found nearby, and a pistol. As seen on a CCTV image, he was wearing the pistol on his belt and used it against the police officers who came to arrest him.

The French National Anti-Terrorist Prosecutor's Office has taken up this case, the first involving anti-Semitic violence since October 7, 2023. This incident represents a significant increase in violence since the arson attack against the Rouen synagogue in Normandy, which was empty at the time. The perpetrator was an undocumented Algerian national who was shot dead by law enforcement officers when he advanced toward them with a knife and an iron bar.
'Not just another anti-Semitic act'

Between these two events, a tragedy was narrowly averted. During the police custody hearings of Dereck R., reported by Le Parisien, it was revealed that this radicalized former common law prisoner had nearly killed a cab driver with a butcher's leaf near Le Mans, western France, in July. He had intended to massacre Jews "for what they have done to our brothers and sisters..."
For Yonathan Arfi, president of the Representative Council of French Jewish Institutions (CRIF), the failed attack at La Grande-Motte was "not just arson, but a planned attack. It's not just another anti-Semitic act. Since October 7, I feel a particular emotion linked to the fact that we've passed a stage in terms of seriousness compared to what we've experienced in recent months. This time, the aim was to kill."

The president of the Israelite Consistory, Elie Korchia, blames the radical-left party La France Insoumise (LFI), without naming it, for contributing to a poisonous climate: "This anti-Semitic climate under the guise of anti-Zionism has only grown. We can criticize the state of Israel, but since October 7, part of the political class has campaigned in the European elections and then in the legislative elections on a hatred of Israel, when that wasn't the issue at all, turning Jews, yesterday's victims of the Shoah, into the new Nazis, and completely obscuring the terrorist pogrom of October 7."

"I don't believe in the sincerity of Jean-Luc Mélenchon [the leader of the LFI] when he condemns this anti-Semitic act," echoed Yonathan Arfi, on French radio channel RMC on Monday. "He's a pyromaniac firefighter. He has contributed to this poisonous climate which puts Jews in danger. And then he comes to pity the fate, not of the Jews who are collectively designated, but simply of the believers, the faithful," he continued.

On Saturday, Mélenchon has posted on X: "Arson attack on La Grande-Motte synagogue. Intolerable crime. Thoughts to the faithful and believers thus attacked. Secularism and freedom of conscience are the offspring of freedom of worship. We never forget that."

"It's not secularism that was attacked at La Grande-Motte on Saturday morning," retorted the CRIF president. It was Jews who were targeted personally, in the name of their supposed convictions in relation to a conflict 4,000 kilometers away."

On the LFI side, Paris MP Danièle Obono denied any form of anti-Semitism: there is "no ambiguity" within the party, she asserted on Franceinfo broadcaster, denouncing in passing a "crude and dangerous political instrumentalization" on the part of her political opponents.

« Je serais tombé sur un mec du Crif, je l’aurais tué » : révélations sur le projet d’attentat de Dereck Riant

EXCLUSIF. Interpellé fin juillet au terme d’une traque haletante, cet ex-délinquant radicalisé cherchait à commettre un attentat au nom de D

https://www.leparisien.fr/faits-divers/je-voulais-aller-a-la-synagogue-ou-dans-un-cinema-revelations-sur-le-projet-dattentat-de-dereck-riant-15-08-2024-4EJF5GSMYZARVOT675KQASOWD4.php

Comedycook · 27/08/2024 20:10

Bullbreedbliss · 27/08/2024 18:31

@JaneDoeHere is it antisemitic to think the Israeli government are despicable?

Well it certainly seems a bit odd to post those views on a thread where we're discussing anti semetism within Europe.

Kendodd · 27/08/2024 20:14

JaneDoeHere · 27/08/2024 18:26

@Kendodd pretty sure you would have been called antisemitic for saying or alluding to something antisemitic.

One poster, very graciously, came back and apologised to me for it. I wrote on that thread that I had really searched my sole about it (I stop, and listen, and think, if someone calls me racist). I said that I had found an element of racism within me, but it wasn't antisemitism, it was Islamphobia. I explained all this on the other thread.

JaneDoeHere · 27/08/2024 20:19

@79Helene I’ve just read the article you posted. So awful, I just don’t have better words to express right now.

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