To think we should go as a family to lunch with my boss

[OopsyDaisie]

I'm the breadwinner in the family and have 2 small DC. Upper management in a small-ish company.
I'm quite friendly with my boss (although wouldnt class us as friends), who has a small DC and a DP. We work together foe many years, wish happy birthday to each other kids etc
Boss has invited me and my family for lunch at their house in a couple of weeks, another colleague (who is single and no DC) will also be going.
My DH doesn't want to go, says he can't stand it and it's fake and there's always an ulterior motive (ti gauge how commitment I am to the company, how happy, to try to convince said colleague to join our department etc).
He told me I should go with the kids and come up with an excuse for him not joining. I said that's OK if he doesn't want to go, that's fine its his decision. He plays a sport on Sunday morning (not every Sunday), so I would just say he i doing that. He then said I actually should go alone and not take the kids either, but then "oh but then we will have nowhere to leave the kids if I'm playing" (we have no family around) and O just said then he couldnt play that day if that's the case.
I'm not TOO happy about being told not to take the kids, we were invited as a family and I would like us to go as one. I think these social interactions do help careers and I could use that!
But also wouldn't terribly mind to have a nice lunch and some wine without being called Mummy-mummy every 2 mins, although I would have to lie as I wouldn't want to say simply my DH wanted me to come by myself. So:
YABU - its your job and should be kept separate from family life. Your DH is right to want you to go alone
YANBU - Your DH should understand the impact of these (very rare) social interactions in your career and should want to go in your support.

I would find this behaviour very unattractive OP. I am sorry he behaves this way.

@Screenshotted

The MN introverts and antisocial misanthropes are all over this thread! How dare someone invite a family over for lunch?!

I know. What an outrageous imposition. Doesn’t she know families should live in a hermetically sealed family bubble?

OP, have only read your responses — not time to read all contributions — but several things strike me:
First, that your DH is at home all day while the children are at school but from what you say doesn't do much housework, leaving you to do most of it. Which isn't anyone's idea of a fair and equitable way of sharing responsibilities — and it's not being sexist to say so, it's just being accurate.
Second that occasionally, as adults, we have to do things we'd rather not do because... well, various reasons but sometimes the way the world works requires us to do so. This is one of those times and a supportive spouse would be prepared to at least consider going and making the best of the situation. It sounds as if it'll be a relatively short event and something the children might enjoy. One might wonder why your DH is behaving like a teenage boy and refusing point blank to go. He is, after all, reaping the rewards of your good relationship with your boss. Is this the way he exerts his power — in a negative way, not doing the housework, sniping at your work and your boss?
Thirdly, I think that exposing children to all sorts of events and circumstances in a positive way helps build confidence and flexibility in later life. Taking them along, expecting a certain level of behaviour from them, having them comfortable meeting new people (not sure if they will have met everyone there before) and having lunch will be a good thing for them.
Fourthly, have you considered the possibility that your unemployed DH may be struggling with his self-esteem and one of his reasons for not wanting to go, and writing off your boss as 'fake', is that he doesn't want to spend his time around men with successful careers? I had an aunt whose husband came from an ordinary background but rose to the top in one of the big oil companies in the 1980s. She refused to be involved in any corporate events or even to meet his colleagues because of her social anxiety. I think when one side of a partnership gets stuck in negativity and a 'can't do/ won't do' position it can make a marriage very difficult.

Good luck with your career. Wish I felt quite as positive about your marriage...

Thank goodness you've said this. I guess daytime MN is inevitably dominated by the antisocial/ introverted people who don't talk to neighbours, don't answer a knock on their front door and don't have lunch with anyone but their closest relatives. Most of the rest of us are off doing something interesting.

I'm wfh today but the project I was due to be working on has been delayed and so I'm twiddling my thumbs this morning.

Quite. It’s not work. Work is work. My eyes roll so much when I see that crap being churned out.

Quite recently went to for a Sunday lunch with my DH’s boss and his family. We had a lovely time. Why assume it will be dull or boring.

I'm the SAHP - honestly I ma furious on your behalf. Quite frankly I think he should suck all of it up - after all its your job which allows him to be a SAHP. But the fact he is refusing to allow you to take the kids...wow - I foresee more problems with this man in the future unfortunately. Is he jealous of your boss? I can not see why he would care whether the kids are going or not.

"What if the boss's children are unpleasant to the OPs children, but the boss thinks a lovely time was had by all, so next month let's go for a weekend away together! Do OPs children get told to suck that up for mummy's career?"

I think those who see this as potentially the start of a friendship are misunderstanding. In my line of work it is very normal to have extremely occasional dinners at colleagues' houses - it is part of building a collegial atmosphere but it's very clear it's not the overture to a family friendship and there's no possibility of us all deciding to go camping together. The boundaries are subtle but clear to all involved (as they seem to be to the OP as well).

Of course you can, and do. However, OP has been invited to a social event and she clearly thinks it will help. Meeting someone’s family in their home obviously promotes and signals a different relationship than just being friendly by the water cooler.

I agree - I think if you don’t work in this type of environment it’s probably not clear but the OPs boss is not trying to be her friend.

As the SAHP, I knew it was important to DH's career, and by extension to our wellbeing as a family to really provide the support and family background at events like this. Also, I was interested in his career, the company and the people. It was part of my 'job' if you like. It was also good for the kids to learn how to behave and be comfortable at work events.

Whatever your DH's motivations, it sounds like he has been enabled to opt out of a fair amount of what he should be doing to support your job as the main earner. Sadly, this is very much in keeping with far too many SAHP's I have known, particularly the male ones.

@GustyFinknottle

Thank goodness you've said this. I guess daytime MN is inevitably dominated by the antisocial/ introverted people who don't talk to neighbours, don't answer a knock on their front door and don't have lunch with anyone but their closest relatives. Most of the rest of us are off doing something interesting.

Yep. I find it slightly disturbing to be reminded how many people regard any kind of social contact outside of the family as a source of fear and a gross imposition. There are so many scared and socially isolated people.

People are sometimes required to come into contact with others outside their family. Yes sometimes it’s a pain in the arse but it’s part of life. Anyone who regards this as unreasonable is going to seriously struggle with their lives and will also pass this paranoid and intransigent behaviour onto their children.

No one is obliged to socialise with their spouse’s colleagues obviously. You won’t go to prison if you don’t. But it costs you nothing and it just might be really helpful for your family in the long term. Plus, God forbid, if you relaxed a bit you might even find it passably enjoyable.

Also the idea that people should be able to ring fence their family life like is really unhealthy. No one ever reached middle age thinking: “Thank God I shut the world out when I had kids! Imagine how awful my life would be if I had more friends!”

Covid made being antisocial fashionable. It is all over social media, ‘introverts’ bragging about how much they hate other people. Very few people are true introverts.

There are however many socially anxious people who are fiercely protective about their own tiny lives. They don’t want to share their time with anyone. it becomes a problem when that includes the children they have. Every weekend is spent glued to each other and nobody is allowed a look-in, even family. It feels like a very claustrophobic existence to me.

When I look at my elderly parents and their friends, the ones who are doing well are the ones who have always led busy and sociable lives. They now have a network of friends to turn to. Their adult kids may be in different countries or they may not have had children. However the friendships they have invested in doing their adult lives have paid off.

You never know when you might meet someone new whom you like and who might enrich your life. I met my best friend aged 40! Why close yourself off?

I look at some people on here do not envy the way they choose to live their lives.And I feel sorry for the kids.

"What if the boss's children are unpleasant to the OPs children, but the boss thinks a lovely time was had by all, so next month let's go for a weekend away together! Do OPs children get told to suck that up for mummy's career?"

This is so telling, this automatic assumption that it will all be horrible and people will be nasty. I guess it comes from a place of fear. I do hope the poster who wrote that isn't bringing up children or grandchildren in this spirit. No wonder so many young people seem to have difficulty with basic social skills and resilience.

There are times in every adult's life when, actually, the wise and adult thing to do is to suck it up. Teaching your children that sometimes they have to just get on with stuff and show them how to make the best of it is one of the most valuable lessons you can offer them.

You have a cleaner and the kids are at school and he still expects you to do the housework. Him hassling you to come home from work dinners is just jealousy. I think SAHP title is pushing it and I'd love to know what he'll be doing in 10 years time. Probably not a lot!

Why can't you build relationships at work, or at events in work time?

Sometimes to progress in your career you need to be flexible and willing to build relationships by doing things outside of the traditional 9-5.

It's always been the case but in the past it was male orientated activities such as golf, bars and strip clubs.

A family lunch is the modern equivalent.

"Whatever your DH's motivations, it sounds like he has been enabled to opt out of a fair amount of what he should be doing to support your job as the main earner. Sadly, this is very much in keeping with far too many SAHP's I have known, particularly the male ones".

I don't think a sahp 'owes' this kind of support tbh. No partner does, regardless of whether they woh or not. A sahp supports by taking care of the children, so the wohp has an easier work life, without the stress of nursery pick ups, school holiday care, having to be home when dc are unwell etc. Having a sahp saves on childcare costs and means the dc have a parent who is on hand. That's the sahp's job, and to keep on top of house stuff if the kids are at school/nursery for part of the day.
It's the woh persons job to manage their work and expectations around it.

Personally I don't like the bleed into personal time - the relationship between OP and boss can't be a true friendship because there's an imbalance of power. I totally get why the dh wants to opt out, but also why OP feels obliged to go.

But the dh sounds problematic outside of this issue tbh - he shouldn't be badgering OP while she is at work events and he really ought to be doing more of the house stuff.

Take dc to the lunch and enjoy yourselves. Is dh is concerned that he will be somehow lesser perdon because you are top family earner... its his self esteem thats the problem here

Yes, it's his self-esteem. He's terrified that someone will smile across the table at him and say 'And Tom, what's your line of work?'

Actually, I'm beginning to think that given that he's a 'to the point' sort of person perhaps it's best if he doesn't go with you, OP.

Maybe the weekend should be for the whole family to be together and this sort of event is where you need to draw the line and say to your boss, “Sorry, no can do. Let’s have coffee or even quick bite after work on X day. But can’t do weekend, we have plans.”

There are 51 other weekends in the year. I’m sure OP’s husband can suck it up once.

He doesn’t seem that bothered about the whole family being together on the other weekends when he’s playing sport. I’m not saying parents shouldn’t have hobbies - but it’s a bit pathetic to take time out to do that, but then get all po-faced saying “But the weekend is family time!” when expected to put yourself out in a very minor manner for your spouse.

Nobody should be 'smooching' their boss. The only people who do this or need to, are brown-noser types who are not good at their jobs.

Take your children if you want to, OP, but I'm in agreement with your husband on this one. My view is that if I were asked to do this I would politely decline citing prior commitments. But then I'm very good at my job.

Just a quick point on your husband 'not working'. He doesn't work outside the home as he's the stay at home parent. You work outside the home because he facilitates this. Your salary covers your family. I would be incensed to be thought of and disregard as 'not working' if I were a stay at home parent.

I’ve just re-read this post and can’t work out how to edit it so my apologies for the autocorrects 🥹
really sorry
your career aspirations
whether we like

What if one of OPs children has an accident at the bosses house then op feels uncomfortable working there so has to leave?

What if they get food poisoning?

What if op chokes on a chicken bone?

What if the boss only has fizzy drinks and ops children only drink water?

What if op is running late and gets a speeding ticket?

What if lightening strikes as they are walking from the car?

What if they have a great time so they get invited back?

Yea, best off not going op. Too many things can go wrong at a lunch.

I only read the OP's first post but reading further then she has a decision to make. If a parent is staying at home then it's up to them to run the home and take on the lion's share of tasks, whether they are male or female.

If OP's husband isn't pulling his weight then he needs to start doing that - or go out to work and the pair will pay childcare as needed.

@Screenshotted

Covid made being antisocial fashionable. It is all over social media, ‘introverts’ bragging about how much they hate other people. Very few people are true introverts.

I agree and it’s my absolute number one bugbear. Apart from the fact it’s an inaccurate characterisation of being an “introvert” it’s just really really negative and self sabotaging.

If you look at all the data, people who age well are people who maintain a healthy degree of contact with the world outside their families. There’s evidence that maintaining a social life is a protective factor against dementia among other things. Particularly for women, who tend to have fewer opportunities to socialise anyway.

That doesn’t mean having to be a bon viveur out drinking every night of the week or a professional networker. It just means keeping a healthy perspective, keeping your social skills alive and having more to talk about than your family’s immediate needs and priorities.

It depresses and frustrates me beyond belief that people celebrate this awful retreat into the family bubble. Having watched my mum disappear into this bubble of loneliness because she didn’t keep her networks up, it makes me want to shake people when they see non family life as a negative.