To be so fucking angry. How many more women and children must die?

[Kianai]

I'd almost become numb to it, with all the news so far this year.

Murder after murder of women and their children. Noone ever seeming to link the common denominator. NAMALT.

This latest one today, I feel like something is beginning to snap inside me. Three babies and a young woman dead, because of a fucking man. Again. And again.

news.sky.com/story/police-launch-murder-investigation-after-woman-and-three-children-die-in-house-fire-in-bradford-13200678

Yeah I'm not really scared of anyone.

I'm generally of the opinion of:

"if its my time to go, it's my time. There's no point worrying"

I have not seen any of this as it's not on my radar and I would not wish to, but I keep reading about how violent and abusive a lot of porn is now, with choking, insistence on anal sex, a constant theme of male dominant and controlling/ female passive and so on. And that is really easily accessible, viewed from a young age, etc. Of course it is far more complex than just that and there has always, always been domestic abuse and violence. But this hatred, contempt, instant lack of respect for women (like the bus driver incident cited) must be fuelled by something. Porn used to just be static, in magazines and pictures, but now terrifying scenarios are acted out and consumed freely by men, even on trains and in public.

I read of a high school teacher in the US concerned that HALF the girls in her class identified as trans gender, which statistically is beyond bizarre. But it's one way to keep yourself as safe as you can from a sex life and place in society that looks terrifying

On the subject, has anyone read the Trevor Noah biography, ‘born a crime’? I couldn’t recommend it highly enough.

The news stories are horrendous and any murder is terrible, whoever dies. We must remember that sometimes its our perception that crime rates have increased because of the sensational coverage of the media, not necessarily the reality ( in case anyone is panicking and anxious). If we look at the statistics, there are actually fewer domestic homicides this year than last. The numbers have been fairly steady but there was an uptick during lockdown. Around 100 women and 30 men are killed in a domestic homicide each year. Homicide in general is different: of the around 600 murdered people in the UK, around 70 per cent are men. Men are more often victims of fatal violence by strangers (usually other men) than women, who will die at the hands of someone they know more often. My mother was a battered wife and she was able to get away before he took her life (my stepdad) so I am always supportive of efforts to address this problem. But I also think it is important to get our facts straight.

@Honourthyname7

I recently got a load of nasty verbal from some teen school boy's, I think they thought I was younger than I was and when they realised I was a middle aged woman they turned from judging me in a sexual way to de-humanising me in another. I remember feeling so upset and like women aren’t even safe from harm on the streets from boys now as-well (since Andrew Tate)

I also remember thinking I bet their mothers think they’re lovely boys.

This is how misogyny starts, it’s not all about violence. It’s about making women/girls feel de-humanised, it’s about making them question themselves when they are just going about their normal day. Its the insidious nature of men/boys entitlement to make women/girls feel less than or just reduced to a body for them to do/say what they will.

I dread to think how those boys are treating girls their own age. And getting away with it. When will it end.

I'm sorry to hear this, and this has put me in mind of an experience a neighbour had of mine last week. She was walking across the back end of a supermarket car park (with a plan to walk along the footpaths - into the high street some 10 minutes walk away.) She is 63.

As she exited the car park and attempted to walk through the little alleyway, onto the footpath along the main road, 4 lads (around 14-16,) were walking towards her. One of them said 'what a lovely day today, I'll stab a woman sometime today,' and elbowed her - making her stumble into the bushes. Him and his mates walked off howling with laughter.

First of all, what the fuck?! Why would he say he wants to stab a woman sometime today?! And why would he say this to a woman in the alleyway alone, who is clearly old enough to be his grandmother? Why does he think it's OK to physically assault her/knock her into the bushes? What kind of things is he hearing or seeing at home to threaten to stab a woman? What is he viewing online? She said he is a budding Andrew Tate, and that she is never going to walk that pathway/alleyway again.

As you say, some males - men AND boys, have such contempt for females (women AND girls,) that they feel entitled to reduce them to an object to mock and deride, and take great joy in upsetting them and making them feel scared and worried.

Absolutely vile. As you say, I bet their mothers and aunts and grannies etc think they're lovely lads!

This is just horrifically sad. And the question - how many more women and children have to die is so relevant. When I was going through the family court system following my divorce from ExH, I was terrified that he would become a ‘family annihilator’. He had threatened suicide. He was mentally unstable. He had taken himself off his prescribed medication. I wasn’t listened to at all. I was painted as a bitter woman determined to alienate a loving Father … thankfully my DDs simply refused to see him. They sensed his fury and instability and they haven’t seen him for six years. He always asks to meet up with them when they speak on the phone but I will never trust him not to harm my DDs to destroy me…

And so that makes it OK? They're physically stronger so we should just accept this and let them get on with it? That's not really an argument.

Mental health for men…

I think in our society a lot of the men attributes are pointed at in a negative way (and for good reason) and so men do not really know how to deal with all of it. They are not taught how simply because their dads don’t know how.

Teach, teach, teach. Of course there is an element of choice on their side so it isn’t a simple truth.

Also,

teach our daughters. How to preserve themselves. What a man is and should be from the beginning. Not accepting ourselves what we wouldn’t want them to endure.

it takes one bad meeting but if the woman is strongly embedded into the « the man should…(fill with positive else than bring the money home) », that would avoid a lot I believe.

Indeed terrible.

On an international level, you have Gaza, the continuance of which is down to just 1 man.

Shall we do a protest?

Mumsnet could be a good place to organise lots of women

I’d join.

I said this to my husband the other day. It is a societal problem but it is a man problem and until that’s recognised nothing is going to change. Every negative news story.

Where is everyone based. Are you near London?

YANBU-it's an absolute outrage. There is an epidemic of violence against women, and children in this country. If any other group of citizens was being murdered in the sheer numbers that women and children are, there would be special investigations, task forces, and money thrown at stopping the horror of it. If any woman is in doubt that we are second class citizens she only needs to look at the numbers of women killed each week, month, year in this country compared to the arrest/conviction rates and the totally inadequate prison sentences handed out to male offenders. The Police don't take male on female violence seriously - especially not domestic violence, sexual assault, stalking etc - and the media reporting of cases is riddled with misogynistic assumptions and stereotypes. It is male dominated culture and society which is unreasonable, not those of us women who call it out.

Let's protest!!!

Yes. I'd join. The murder of women & children should never be allowed to become normalised.

Nottingham but more than happy to travel.

This. 100%. Every single word of it is true.

Scotland.

We could get regional protests going then. Maybe in different locations on the same date

Nothing new to add but male privilege definitely needs a change

If they’re not, it’s definitely not because they’re racist eye roll

I'm up for protesting too.
To the poster who ridiculed the idea that we go out every day expecting to be assaulted, harassed, insulted or demeaned, it's not that we EXPECT it every day it's that we have to be braced against it.
It could happen once a month, a year, or several times a day, we just never know, but we always have to be prepared that it will happen at some point. And it's exhausting.
Off to make a banner .....

Maybe if anyone wants to protest we could give people a week to get ready.

And we could arrange a protest for Saturday next week?

Design a few signs and bring them along.