Labour Corruption?

[Zebedee999]

Labour took donations from the unions pre-election and are now giving pay rises to those same union's members with limited or no negotiations. Is this corruption?

YABU = Not corruption
YANBU = Corruption of sorts

They paid them what the pay review boards recommended.

One of the first posts I responded to was from @pointythings ..

British people want asylum seekers removed

So it seems there is acknowledgement of public sentiment. I know Labour voters will deflect from the issue but I still think Labour face this growing problem, and they know it. Hence the deportation headlines.

As much as people think its fabrication by previous gov it won't go away now Labour are in. If they can't 'smash the gangs' and numbers continue to go up each summer they'll have a problem.

Lol including you?

Thats the problem with posters heavily invested in Labour/Starmer - they will accept no criticism or questioning so come out with bitchy remarks instead.

Cooper will not get a returns agree with many countries where asylum seekers come from, they aren't "friendly" or they simply do not want them back ie France.

Voluntary is great, though why would anyone spend a fortune & risk personal harm only to pack up and go home?

Labour along with all of the EU have no idea how to stop migration into the UK EU.

The only way it will stop is by using force and events that have happened here and in the EU will eventually lead to this happening, public pressure and not wanting the extreme right to get into power will guarantee it, just as Australia ended up doing.

You did indeed. But I note that you have not answered question 2) that I just asked you, which is whether or not you acknowledge that the British public's desire to see asylum seekers removed, and its place high on the political agenda, is due to the rhetoric of the previous government and the right wing press.

I also did not, just for clarity, say that I in any way agree with the British public's sentiments. As I said before, I have no problem with people being removed when their claim is judged to not be justified, but it's not my top priority politically. I'm more interested in the state of education, the NHS, housing and finally the implementation of buffer zones for abortion clinics.

The only way to stop this being an issue for the electorate is to suppress numbers being reported and since the gov updates weekly it's unlikely that will happen.

And if they do stop updating weekly then other parties will share the information

This isn't going away and will increase due to climate and volatility. Labour might choose to focus on the reactions of the public to the problem rather than the issue itself but that won't work over time

Using force

Can you explain what you mean with this? What kind of force?

There doesn’t seem to be a story

The Guardian
Sunday 25 August 2024

A Labour donor has stepped down from his role as a civil servant at the Treasury, while the party comes under fire for granting a No 10 pass to another, as ministers deny they are giving preferential treatment to their funders.

Ian Corfield has resigned as an official to the chancellor, Rachel Reeves, the Sunday Times reported this weekend, becoming a temporary unpaid adviser instead after days of controversy over his role.

The paper also revealed, that Waheed Alli, one of Labour’s biggest fundraisers, had been given full access to Downing Street, where he organised a post-election garden reception for others who contributed to the party’s campaign.

Pat McFadden, the Cabinet Office minister, said on Sunday he did not think Lord Alli still held a pass, but could not say why he had been granted one in the first place.

The government is also under fire for having appointed Jess Sargeant, who used to work for the Starmer-aligned thinktank Labour Together, as a deputy director in the Cabinet Office’s propriety and constitution unit – a role usually given to a civil servant.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/aug/25/labour-donor-quits-treasury-role-amid-cronyism-claims

Towing back to North Africa, taking migrants to a remote place, similar to what Australia has done.

It will happen, the public pressure to deal with migration is huge and growing.

With wars and climate change, combined with shrinking foreign aid budgets, numbers leaving their home countries is only going to increase.

How many migrants crossing the Med and the Channel can EU UK accommodate? 100k? 1m? 10m? 50m?

If we do curb numbers, then the electorate will vote in extremist parties who will do far worse.

Taking migrants to a remote place

Where do you have in mind?

They are refugees rather than migrants.

I disagree. Changing the narrative of the media and government so that people understand the reality would help the British public change their perspective. It would be a long hard job though because the Tories did such a good job of blaming asylum seekers for pretty much everything.

Also I don't want Labour to focus on the perception of the public. I want them to deal properly with asylum seekers in a sane and healthy way.

Look you re trying to get a gotcha moment, it wont happen, use your imagination?

How about answering how many people you think the EU UK can accommodate?

btw these aren't policies i want to see enacted, i just think they will be.

Cameron destroyed Libya, yes he got a tyrant killed but in doing so he turned that country into a marshalling yard for migrants to come into Europe, now run by crim gangs and warlords.

We failed to deal with Syria as we should have, allowed the Russians embed themselves there and ensure millions of people left, we then failed to support the local countries who took in these refugees, so where have now come?

& thats before we get to Africa and its troubles, again cutting FA has consequences.

What number crossing the channel do you think you could persuade the electorate to be ok with?

80k, 150k

Just a ball park

And how many deaths per year?

It's not a gotcha, I am trying to understand how it would work.

But I am glad that it's not something you would support, I won't either.

How do you deal with mainly economic migrants crossing the channel in a sane and healthy way?

Remember its migrants in the EU (and continue to come into the EU) that provide a huge number of people who will try to get here.

The EU is toughening its stance on granting asylum, especially as they fight to avoid far right wing parties getting into power, so the pressure to leave the EU and come to the UK will only grow & where can we continue to house and provide work for 50 or 60k people each year, plus any dependants? on top of the 600k people who come here via work student visas.

cardibach
Yvette Cooper is currently focusing on deportations of failed asylum seekers and has overseen the largest single deportation flight the UK has managed.
'The approach is designed to restore the numbers of returns to what they were when Labour was last in power — from 46,000 a year to almost 27,000 last year'

When did Labour last reach the 46,000 target? According to The Migration Observatory it was the Conservatives who reached that target (all returns) in 2012 and 2013. There were 45,690 returns in 2010 but Labour were only in power for the first four months of that year - total returns for 2008 and 2009 were 37,789 and 42,272.

https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/deportation-and-voluntary-departure-from-the-uk/

YANBU
LP is at least equivalent to Tories in terms of corruption.

Interesting article in the Times this am about a big donor to LP seeming to have unbridled levels of power, influence and access at downing St. However, if you're a leftie this is desperately inconvenient as it's nice to imagine that Left = righteous, everything else = evil.

They are mainly refugees, not economic migrants, and the majority gets granted asylum.

Zonder
Changing the narrative of the media and government so that people understand the reality would help the British public change their perspective.

What is the reality? What percentage of asylum seekers are in full-time employment 5 years after being granted asylum? In Germany around 50% are in employment after 5 years although that figure includes part-time work. What percentage are receiving housing benefit after 5 years?

seeming to have unbridled levels of power, influence and access at downing St.

The article I read, which is the one you’re referring to, says he had a pass, ie access. It didn’t mention power or influence. It appears uncertain whether he still has it.

I am not playing your numbers game. It's not about the numbers.

You are deflecting from the actual point of how people in the UK ended up being poisoned with hate for foreigners.

If the government can get to a point where they are processing the asylum seekers they will see which are here for the money and which are here for safety. Let's see how this government move forward in dealing with the people who arrive here.

I was very happy for EU migrants to come here and voted remain so we could continue this two way relationship. I was a EU migrant myself for a number of years. It's a great loss to our country that we don't have this freedom of movement.

Might be worth reading back on this thread - that article has already been discussed.

Blossomtoes gives a good response.

No labour has always been about improving conditions for workers

Hope that helps

Still no answers to the simple questions I asked you. I wonder why that is?

That wasn't to you and I did answer

But while we're at it any answer to whether you would take a male entering via channel crossing as a carer for your dc?

As asked ages ago when you said they had been scrutinised enough