DH’s attitude re riots etc upsetting and angering me

[Pinkycloud]

I feel so sick. Every time we talk about the riots, DH comes out with ‘well people are angry, etc’. He says he doesn’t condone violence, but there’s always a ‘but’. He voted Reform, I voted Lib Dem. I tell him he sounds racist in some of the comments he makes, which he vehemently denies.

He’s a loving, hardworking husband and father but… this! He is honestly a good man. I don’t know how to deal with it other than banning the subject. Has anyone else got very different political views from their spouse or partner?

If people blame the politicians, why are so many on here blaming immigrants? Why are rioters attacking immigrants?
We don’t have uncontrolled immigration.

Well there you are, you see you haven't experienced the rise of HMOs in your area. How very lucky and privileged you are. I'm not making it up. This has become the normal way of life for many Immigrants who are working legitimately. I live in greater London, i own my home and feel very privileged. Some of my neighbours pay ridiculous rents and live in overcrowded accommodation. An ad I saw recently was a family of 3 requesting 1 room to rent and pleading as they had to leave their current accommodation as the Landlord had increased their rent.

But there has been opportunity to build the housing! Tories said they would then didn’t. It’s not the immigrants.

There is a difference. It is not the fault of the Immigrants but the cause is due to the increase of our population that happened too fast. Both past Labour and Conservative governments are to blame.

This thread is about blaming immigrants though. And you’ve supported it. Also define ‘too fast’. It could have been handled effectively.

I've supported the importance of acknowledging the negative results of immigration on people's living standards. I have never said it is ok to riot or target Immigrants. These problems are not going away and I am fearful of the growing resentment and fractured communities. I worry about the outcomes of future elections if the next 4 years is a continuation of pretending there is nothing to see here.

I can't answer that question about how fast. We were reassured by successive governments that everything was fine and told to pipe down with our concerns. I can see with my own eyes and my own lived experience that living standards have not been improved by recent immigration.

A net migration of 700,000 annually. You would need to be building the infrastructure to support the equivalent of the entire population of Leeds EVERY year just to keep up. Where do you suppose that infrastructure is built? Who pays for the initial building of it? Where do the materials come from to build it? Where are all the excess tradesmen to do the job?

Immigrants haven’t impacted people’s lives! Government incompetence has!

Many of those are replacing the falling birth rate though. It’s definitely possible. And most of those are on visas, so someone has decided they need to be here. They aren’t in asylum hotels.

I agree the primary issue is infrastructure not keeping up with growth but given you can’t start producing hundreds of thousands of affordable new homes year on year without significant changes then your other solution is to look at options for slowing growth. We should be looking at both for the time being

& it’s not just homes it’s also other infrastructure and it’s not always that straightforward to provide it (particularly to do so in the places where you have an immediate need for it)

It would be fine with appropriate investment. Austerity and government incompetence over the last 14 years have caused the issue.

So it just continues. OK i can't really say anymore. Well done proving my point.

It what?
No, you can’t say more, because it’s a fact that it’s government decisions and incompetence which have brought us to this point.

So as a result no one should have any concerns about infrastructure not being sufficient to support the current level of immigration? I really don’t see how you can’t understand that given the lack of investment and the level of intervention now needed to fix it people have concerns about this. It doesn’t impact me or my immediate area at all but I totally get why someone in an area with rapid population growth fuelled by immigration has concerns. How can you not see they would?

Of course they should have concerns. They should just place the blame where it belongs - the last 14 years of Tory government.

Yes they should but it’s very understandable as well that people blame the thing that’s very visible to them (many new people arriving in their area, extra competition for housing, services etc) particularly when politicians and media are laying the blame there.

& in fairness I think it started being an issue even before that. The matching new provision of services to where you have rapid population growth is always going to be a challenge and was problematic even when funding was better.

Yes, those aiming to blame them take some responsibility, but in a democracy it’s everyone’s responsibility to be better informed.

People had these concerns going back well before 2010. The major turning point was the introduction of free movement from European countries with totally different economic states than ours. When people did point this out around 20 years ago they were shouted down as racists.
Any attempt by our government to do something about it were shut down by liberals such as yourself again shouting how insular and racist that is. We then ended up with brexit.

But anyway lets move on from who did what and why the Country is now in the state it is. How do you propose we improve it?

I couldn’t be married to someone who knows so little about politics that they would vote Reform.

I’m not a liberal. It has a particular meaning in the U.K. - are you even from here? Because what you say seems to indicate not, being riddled with inaccuracies.

How would I improve it @ATenShun ?
The way the new government has said. Process asylum seekers so they can start contributing. Work against criminal gangs exploiting them. Put investment into housing, health and education. Let’s just give it more than 4 weeks, shall we?

All exceptionally good things to do. But at present as I say before we need the infrastructure equivalent to Leeds to be built today just to support last years net migration.
So next year at the same rate, we need to do the same, same the year after. Is that sustainable?

Most immigration is via visa, so someone thinks so…
It’s not just net migration to consider. It needs to be set against falling birthrate and how many have died too.how many extra people are there than would have been without them but with the old birthrate, and after deaths have been accounted for. Do you have that figure?