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DH’s attitude re riots etc upsetting and angering me

1000 replies

Pinkycloud · 07/08/2024 13:55

I feel so sick. Every time we talk about the riots, DH comes out with ‘well people are angry, etc’. He says he doesn’t condone violence, but there’s always a ‘but’. He voted Reform, I voted Lib Dem. I tell him he sounds racist in some of the comments he makes, which he vehemently denies.

He’s a loving, hardworking husband and father but… this! He is honestly a good man. I don’t know how to deal with it other than banning the subject. Has anyone else got very different political views from their spouse or partner?

OP posts:
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17
samarrange · 08/08/2024 10:59

Lovelysausagedogscrumpy · 08/08/2024 10:03

Except that they are not false stories. Possibly the reason they’re not coming up on google is that they were only reported in the local area press. In my own area the council wanted to do something similar and in the end local opposition stopped them from scrapping the Christmas tree, but as a compromise, they rebranded the local Christmas market as a ‘winter market’ so as not to cause ‘offence’. A few similar stories can still be found on google from last year and a couple of years ago.

l read that post and found some of what was posted quite concerning - not least because l live quite close to a hotel housing asylum seekers and there have been several disturbing instances here. One involved a 13 year old girl being followed by a young man offering to pay her for sex. Just because it doesn’t show up on google, doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen.

A few similar stories can still be found on google from last year and a couple of years ago.

Please tell me what search string you are putting into Google to find them. 🙏

mrshoho · 08/08/2024 11:01

Lentilweaver · 08/08/2024 10:52

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/southport-stabbings-know-suspect-axel-152108540.html

His parents were heavily involved in the church. That is an Indy report.

As to whether he was a practicing Christian, that is a bit of semantics. If people with Muslim parents are considered Muslim, I guess he can be considered Christian. He was also part of a Dr Who promotion featured on the BBC.

I do not consider that article you posted as proving as a fact that he is a Christian.

Lentilweaver · 08/08/2024 11:04

Ok then🙄If your parents are involved in the Church, you must of course be a Muslim or a Hindu or a Jew.

Shakeoffyourchains · 08/08/2024 11:08

ATenShun · 07/08/2024 21:22

All appaling crimes and each and every person involved in them are scum.

But to start throwing about figures about who has produced more sex offending scum like them, you need to factor in population percentages. A quick google shows the 2021 census saying that British Pakistanis accounted for 2.7% of the population. Is that ethnic group guilty of only 3% of similar crimes or are they over-represented in grooming sex crimes?

Most recent data I can find shows that it is actual white British who are over-represented when it comes to sexually abusing children.

83% of defendants were white British despite accounting for only 75% of the population over the age of criminal responsibility. 2% of that population is British Pakistani and 2% were offenders (pg 38 of below report).

https://www.csacentre.org.uk/research-resources/research-evidence/scale-nature-of-abuse/trends-in-official-data/

I'm struggling to find any recent government released datasets, with the most recent one I can see relating to data from 2016. But that too shows that 92% of people convicted of sexual activity with a child under 16 were white vs 4.6% as Asian (those stats don't go as granular as British Pakistani).

Maybe we need to start having a serious conversation about how we deal with this white British cultural characteristic of child abuse?

DH’s attitude re riots etc upsetting and angering me
DodoTired · 08/08/2024 11:12

mrshoho · 08/08/2024 10:42

Has that been confirmed? I think you stating as fact he is a Christian is as bad as those who said he is a Muslim. As far as I see it nothing has been confirmed as yet.

Yes it has.

DodoTired · 08/08/2024 11:15

murasaki · 08/08/2024 10:45

For the millionth time, it was SOUTHPORT not Stockport. Stockport residents are getting quite cross about this.....

Sorry!

alldayeveryday247 · 08/08/2024 11:16

@mrshoho

Has that been confirmed? I think you stating as fact he is a Christian is as bad as those who said he is a Muslim. As far as I see it nothing has been confirmed as yet.

What have you googled that leads you to believe it's not been confirmed? His family are Christian and 'deeply involved' in their local
Christian community.

You said 'as far as you can see nothing has been confirmed as yet' but a quick google of his name and either 'religion' or 'Christian' pulls up multiple articles from six days ago onwards confirming his religion as Christian...

When you said 'as far as I can see' did you actually mean that you hadn't looked at all?

Here's just one:

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/inside-religious-family-southport-suspect-104003839.html?guccounter=1&gucereferrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvLnVrLw&guceereferrersig=AQAAAGNbtWTrjWVDU78pOAgAJF7sG-21jOCduICpjr2jUka8piZK7UzN5HQ6hYI7ZmLqgwGOOD8nc0XuWwwvs7kFKuvv5tolQtPYtkWVjtrzqEfzHOsPbuM-fm2pTzvxvNkoIF2QjvPgcpXqwBdHb_I0QArQVFninqkBW0PRLovcr6SY

DodoTired · 08/08/2024 11:16

RoastChickenForDinner · 08/08/2024 10:49

He was a practicing Christian. Or raised by Christian parents? Or from a country where Catholicism is the main religion?

They're all different. As far as I know only the latter has been confirmed

He was a choir boy! Do you think he was Muslim choir boy??

mrshoho · 08/08/2024 11:53

alldayeveryday247 · 08/08/2024 11:16

@mrshoho

Has that been confirmed? I think you stating as fact he is a Christian is as bad as those who said he is a Muslim. As far as I see it nothing has been confirmed as yet.

What have you googled that leads you to believe it's not been confirmed? His family are Christian and 'deeply involved' in their local
Christian community.

You said 'as far as you can see nothing has been confirmed as yet' but a quick google of his name and either 'religion' or 'Christian' pulls up multiple articles from six days ago onwards confirming his religion as Christian...

When you said 'as far as I can see' did you actually mean that you hadn't looked at all?

Here's just one:

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/inside-religious-family-southport-suspect-104003839.html?guccounter=1&gucereferrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvLnVrLw&guceereferrersig=AQAAAGNbtWTrjWVDU78pOAgAJF7sG-21jOCduICpjr2jUka8piZK7UzN5HQ6hYI7ZmLqgwGOOD8nc0XuWwwvs7kFKuvv5tolQtPYtkWVjtrzqEfzHOsPbuM-fm2pTzvxvNkoIF2QjvPgcpXqwBdHb_I0QArQVFninqkBW0PRLovcr6SY

I'd rather not add to any speculation and will wait for official reports.

TheNuthatch · 08/08/2024 11:55

Shakeoffyourchains · 08/08/2024 11:08

Most recent data I can find shows that it is actual white British who are over-represented when it comes to sexually abusing children.

83% of defendants were white British despite accounting for only 75% of the population over the age of criminal responsibility. 2% of that population is British Pakistani and 2% were offenders (pg 38 of below report).

https://www.csacentre.org.uk/research-resources/research-evidence/scale-nature-of-abuse/trends-in-official-data/

I'm struggling to find any recent government released datasets, with the most recent one I can see relating to data from 2016. But that too shows that 92% of people convicted of sexual activity with a child under 16 were white vs 4.6% as Asian (those stats don't go as granular as British Pakistani).

Maybe we need to start having a serious conversation about how we deal with this white British cultural characteristic of child abuse?

I don't think you understand what the grooming gangs scandal is actually about. It's about fairness and two tier policing. These men were rarely convicted because authorities turned a blind eye because they were asian. They wouldn't appear on your charts if they were never charged or convicted. To this day, very few of them have been convicted. Please google the greater manchester grooming gangs report from Jan 24. Also see some of the things Maggie Oliver has written on the subject.
As I said in my previous post, we had election candidates campaigning on this issue, promising to hold the authorities to account. I'm really surprised that anyone can defend this, and whether you agree or not, I can promise you that it absolutely has caused a rise in racial tensions in some areas. I am not defending anyone going out on the streets rioting, it's abhorrent, but to pretend that there are no issues will just make things worse.

Fatmary · 08/08/2024 12:09

If you listened to everyone on Mumsnet, no bugger would be married. I wonder what kind of marriage all the people who are saying "leave him" have.

Grammarnut · 08/08/2024 12:11

User7171 · 07/08/2024 17:16

He is a chartered surveyor so works in building for a large company across the North of England and says there are numerous areas in Lancashire and West Yorkshire where white British people are in the minority and he thinks the customs and traditions of English life have disappeared in those areas.

This is utter bollocks @LuluBlakey1

You seem to be star struck by this wet-behind-the ears young man.

He's no better than the rest of the racists, regardless of his career or anything else.

I mean, you've said he lives in Newcastle but you're claiming he's some sort of expert on Yorkshire and Lancashire demographics because he works for a building company that does work there?

Have you listened to yourself?

In fact, he is right, in several parts of the counry this is so. For example, all the ruling Labour councillors in a northern town resigned because of Labour's stance over Gaza i.e. that the Labour Party is backing Israel. These councillors belong to an ethnic minority. In the city where I reside the (high profile) Labour candidate lost to a Pro-Gaza candidate who did not bother to campaign in 'white' areas, getting his votes from one section of the constituency only.
The problem is not so much different cultures but that some non-ethnic communities are still tied to the politics and social attitudes of the places they originate rather than joining the UK 'ship' as it were, and these boil over sometimes, e.g. in the city where I live in 2022 - the dispute was over a game not even happening in the UK.
It's a problem with having 'communities of communities'.

mm81736 · 08/08/2024 12:25

Being anti mass immigration is not racism
Mass immigration tends to be good for those in society with most and worst for those with least.
Your party got 12% of the vote and 76 seats, your dh's party got 14% of the vote and 5 seats.Do you understand How this might make people angry, and that they are not listened to via legitimate means?

Temushopper · 08/08/2024 12:54

Bumblebeestiltskin · 07/08/2024 14:48

He's not a good man if he votes reform. And for anyone who wants to say voting reform doesn't make someone a bad person - YOU'RE a bad person, too.

Edited

I mean I know no one I know voted reform but I don’t believe everyone who did can be classified as a bad person. It’s a very narrow mindset and I can’t see it being in any way helpful to resolving any of the issues we have with division in the U.K. currently.

Summerflames · 08/08/2024 12:55

Livelovebehappy · 08/08/2024 08:42

It depends though on the context of being 'racist'. You can be accused of racism just because you have concerns about immigration, or if you call-out a celeb of colour for being an arse. The word gets shouted out so often these days, usually by people who do it for effect if someone voices a concern that they dont like. Its a way of shutting people down when someone's losing an argument.

The opposite is true too. Many people don't see/understand micro aggressions cos they will never experience it themselves, and when racism gets called out, these people turn a blind eye.

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 08/08/2024 13:19

Fatmary · 08/08/2024 12:09

If you listened to everyone on Mumsnet, no bugger would be married. I wonder what kind of marriage all the people who are saying "leave him" have.

We have marriages in which values are aligned and we have similar ideas about right and wrong. Marriages in which we have standards below which we would not stoop. Marriages in which neither partner feels that they need to compromise their self respect in order to stay married.

I wonder more about what kind of marriages people have when they feel compelled to stay in a relationship with someone who they cannot respect and with whom they do not share basic common values.

I realise that some people are trapped and have no choice, and I'm truly sorry for the women who are stuck in shitty relationships for whatever reason. It must be unbearable.

samarrange · 08/08/2024 13:25

mm81736 · 08/08/2024 12:25

Being anti mass immigration is not racism
Mass immigration tends to be good for those in society with most and worst for those with least.
Your party got 12% of the vote and 76 seats, your dh's party got 14% of the vote and 5 seats.Do you understand How this might make people angry, and that they are not listened to via legitimate means?

Apparently we all missed hearing the chants of "Electoral reform now", in between "No surrender" and "Who the fuck is Allah".

Summerflames · 08/08/2024 13:29

mm81736 · 08/08/2024 12:25

Being anti mass immigration is not racism
Mass immigration tends to be good for those in society with most and worst for those with least.
Your party got 12% of the vote and 76 seats, your dh's party got 14% of the vote and 5 seats.Do you understand How this might make people angry, and that they are not listened to via legitimate means?

So push to get rid of fptp then??

Sounreasonable · 08/08/2024 13:32

DodoTired · 08/08/2024 11:16

He was a choir boy! Do you think he was Muslim choir boy??

A choir boy? As in a child in the church choir?

That just means his parents are Christian. He might consider himself/have beliefs based on any religion, or none.

I was in the church choir, a church bell ringer, went to church youth group and church primary and secondary school. I was baptised and confirmed, went to Sunday school, brownies and guides etc- I was the child of Christians, not a Christian myself.

I was just sent to these things the way kids are sent to football training or swimming lessons.

DotAndCarryOne2 · 08/08/2024 13:40

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 08/08/2024 13:19

We have marriages in which values are aligned and we have similar ideas about right and wrong. Marriages in which we have standards below which we would not stoop. Marriages in which neither partner feels that they need to compromise their self respect in order to stay married.

I wonder more about what kind of marriages people have when they feel compelled to stay in a relationship with someone who they cannot respect and with whom they do not share basic common values.

I realise that some people are trapped and have no choice, and I'm truly sorry for the women who are stuck in shitty relationships for whatever reason. It must be unbearable.

OP says he’s a good man. Doesn’t sound like a shitty unbearable relationship to me. They just don’t see eye to eye on politics. Neither to myself and my partner. Doesn’t mean I want to leave him. Doesn’t mean I don’t respect him. Nothing wrong with acknowledging that people are angry and don’t feel listened to.

Shakeoffyourchains · 08/08/2024 13:41

TheNuthatch · 08/08/2024 11:55

I don't think you understand what the grooming gangs scandal is actually about. It's about fairness and two tier policing. These men were rarely convicted because authorities turned a blind eye because they were asian. They wouldn't appear on your charts if they were never charged or convicted. To this day, very few of them have been convicted. Please google the greater manchester grooming gangs report from Jan 24. Also see some of the things Maggie Oliver has written on the subject.
As I said in my previous post, we had election candidates campaigning on this issue, promising to hold the authorities to account. I'm really surprised that anyone can defend this, and whether you agree or not, I can promise you that it absolutely has caused a rise in racial tensions in some areas. I am not defending anyone going out on the streets rioting, it's abhorrent, but to pretend that there are no issues will just make things worse.

My first response was to someone who said there were no white grooming gangs, I gave them a list of white grooming gangs.

That obviously offended some on here and they wanted stats on the proportion of offenders by ethnicity vs the ethnicity % of the UK, presumably show that Asian men were over-represented. I gave them the stats.

But the fact those stats actually showed that white brits were over-represented obviously offends you, and so we're moving the goal posts once again to two tier policing.

So tell me, was it two tier police when Canadian authorities handed over a list of hundreds of suspected british paedophile to the NCA, who then promptly ignored it?

Was it two-tier policing when they ignored several warnings about Ian Watkins over four years, or turned a blinde eye to the Westminster paedophile dossier, or dismissed the accusations against Saville, John Allen, the Anglican Church, Tam Paton and so on.

Why was there no protests about any of the above when it came to light? Why don't we see people highlighting these cases as examples of police turning a blind eye to white paedophilia?

I'm not defending anything here. The police's reluctance to investigate sexual abuse accusations is well documented, and a stain on their profession, but it's not specifically race related.

The Independent Inquiry into Child Abuse itself said it found evidence of gang-based abuse across the six cities it investiaged that hadn't had a high profile abuse case in the media. It also found widespread failures by the police to record the ethnicity of perpetrators which "makes it impossible to know whether any particular ethnic group is over-represented as perpetrators of child sexual exploitation by networks," but that won't stop those on the right pointing to Rotherham and Rochadale and using those abhorrent cases as a justification to hate all Muslims. People who do that are either racist or ignorant of the truth (often both I would guess).

DotAndCarryOne2 · 08/08/2024 13:45

samarrange · 08/08/2024 10:59

A few similar stories can still be found on google from last year and a couple of years ago.

Please tell me what search string you are putting into Google to find them. 🙏

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12823071/Christmas-spirit-cancelled-renamed-markets-council-light-scrapped-woke-offence-pigs-blanket-cards.html

Not the one in my area but one of several reported last year as having been name changed to winter markets to be more inclusive.

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 08/08/2024 13:47

DotAndCarryOne2 · 08/08/2024 13:40

OP says he’s a good man. Doesn’t sound like a shitty unbearable relationship to me. They just don’t see eye to eye on politics. Neither to myself and my partner. Doesn’t mean I want to leave him. Doesn’t mean I don’t respect him. Nothing wrong with acknowledging that people are angry and don’t feel listened to.

I was responding to the previous poster rather than the OP, as per the post that I quoted. Obviously, it is a personal choice as to whether the OP decides to stay with him, and it will depend on the OP's personal values.

Personally, I wouldn't be willing to stay in a relationship with someone that held far right views, and I would not ever consider someone with such views to be a "good person". But of course, if the OP doesn't find far right views intolerable, then that's her call.

As for whether or not she is trapped, that's not for me to say. I was merely acknowledging the fact that some women may end up staying with far right knobheads (or indeed knobheads of any particular persuasion) because they feel they have no choice. And we should not judge them for that in the same way that we might judge another woman for choosing to stay with a far right partner of her own free will.

Grammarnut · 08/08/2024 14:05

Marseillaise · 07/08/2024 19:33

Tell me, would you listen to me if I put a brick through your window? Or would you call the police and expect me to be locked up?

Obviously, I would want to know why the brick had come through my window. I'd also call the police. I was not suggesting that those taking part in the disturbances should not face consequences, only that it might be a good idea if we got to the root cause, in order to prevent repeat performances.

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