To ask if you think the Olympic boxers are male?

[ArabellaScott]

The finals for both boxers are tonight and tomorrow.

I'm curious to hear whether people think they are females with a DSD, or males with a DSD.

YABU - they're female
YANBU - they're male

Her credentials: Dr Emma Hilton is a developmental biologist at the University of Manchester, studying aspects of human genetic disease. For her PhD from the University of Warwick she researched early events in the embryogenesis of vertebrate embryos, and she has extensive research experience in the field of developmental genetics. Her career has focused on the genetic and molecular mechanisms underpinning inherited genetic disorders in humans, including those that differently affect males and females, and that affect nerve or muscle development during embryogenesis. She has authored over 20 peer-reviewed publications in clinical genetics and development journals, received over 1,100 citations and contributed to key medical textbooks.

Emma Hilton is an incredible source of information

My DH has boobs, well moobs.

Thank you!!!

I think we should all watch this.

@TomatoSandwiches Try reading it again. You appear to be confused.

Please accept my apologies.

MessinaBloom · Today 02:43

The laboratory results are not clear, no. What is required is a chromosomal test completely independent of the IBA and its affliates (and possibly the IOC).

Of course the tests are clear, as attested to by the experts who've seen and analysed them.

They were chromosome tests, which the IBA, WBO and EBU referred to as "gender" tests, what else could they possibly be? They mean sex, rather than gender, of course.

The two independent laboratories are independent of both organisations, accredited by the CAS and by the international standards people, the ISO.

Please stop grasping for straws that were washed away ages ago.

If the lab isn't good enough for sex testing, I presume you also think all of the athletes tested for PEDs using the same company also need to be retested?

PED?

Doping I think.

Performance Enhancing Drugs?

Yeah performance enhancing drugs - getting used to the app and I keep typing in shorthand, sorry 🤣

Dr Hilton is speaking about this now. Some great information about this situation and DSDs in general. I am sure the link will probably work after too ?

Otherwise go to the Gold Report on YouTube and find the recording of 'The BBC is lying'.

Here is an informative Media briefing from Sex Matters including Developmental Biologist Professor/Dr Emma Hilton, plus the real life experience of competing with people with testosterone derived advantages, Olympians Mara Yamauchi and Sharron Davies.

The latter two giving the other side of the 'emotional plea' of 'what about Khelif who would be disadvantaged / upset / etc at being excluded'. Want to know what the female athletes feel like when they lose their opportunities? Those that are supposed to be protected by Human Rights by the IOC....

As Emma says, to overcome the physical advantage that Khelif has, the female people that Khelif would have to fight would be the equivalent of the heavyweight category. Ie. the female would be heavyweight and Khelif in the category they are now - light welterweight (I believe). She has done the sums.

To those declaring that that Khelif should be allowed to compete with the female athletes, do you support a heavyweight male boxer punching a significantly lighter male in the face? I don't give a fuck that you don't like boxing. That is another distractive irrelevance.

If you can recognise that it is fucking dangerous for that differential in the boxing ring, why would you ever support female athletes facing that level of risk?

Mara Yamauchi raised a great point on the 'inclusive' nature of the IOC policy.

If the female boxing ended up being all male, because of their ridiculous parameters of 'passport' allowed this, how is that inclusive at all for female people? Let alone being completely unfair. I have always said that this was a form of illegitimate discrimination against female people.

And it reminds me of the Labour party blinding affirming that a board that was supposed to be 'sex' balanced to give female people equal representation was to be 'gender balanced' because of inclusion. The board was at one time 75% male. How the fuck is that inclusive? How the fuck is that giving female people, with their unique needs that male people cannot even fucking comprehend, an equal voice to get their own needs recognised and acted on?

There is inclusion. And then there is male inclusion that simply continues the discrimination, and oppression, of female people. All because some male people have emotional needs that people prioritise over female people.

I think the Fact attack has scared some people off. I enjoyed Emma's interview.

It often does when people realise just how the inconsistency in what they are supporting starts to be highlighted and all they have is the emoting.

But people are still voting. Maybe they will be reading and hopefully watching the vids etc.

to overcome the physical advantage that Khelif has, the female people that Khelif would have to fight would be the equivalent of the heavyweight category. Ie. the female would be heavyweight and Khelif in the category they are now - light welterweight

Every time I know these boxers are facing women it gives me a horrible feeling in the pit of my stomach. I actually cannot quite believe the IOC are colluding in risking women's lives like this.

I wonder if these two boxers will quietly retire after the Olympics? The IOC won't test them, they have made that clear so it looks like they are going to get away with it.

Will they disappear?

Don't know . Khelif is a UNICEF ambassador. Supposedly to empower young girls.

If they are barred by the international boxing bodies they won't have much choice. But they will be able to slink away without anyone being called to account and a large chunk of the population adamant that they are women.
I wish there was something the women they had to fight could do to push them to prove it one way or the other.

Don’t forget the $50,000 they’ll each walk away with if they win Gold.

Runningupthecurtains · Today 21:45

If they are barred by the international boxing bodies they won't have much choice. But they will be able to slink away without anyone being called to account and a large chunk of the population adamant that they are women.

We can only hope so, it's doubtful that they'll get anywhere as professionals, after the IBA ruling and the concurrence of the WBO and EBU.

Will the female athletes who lost opportunities ever get those opportunities back?

NO

Will the female athletes who have been injured have that damage erased?

Probably not. A broken nose can easily result in breathing issues, who knows about the punches to the head. I mean, Lin got away with a punch to the back of the head while Kahraman's neck was against the ropes FFS. Who knows what the cumulative impact is.

But hey ho....