Feminists against sex segregation in sports

[Tandora]

AIBU to share a different perspective on a subject that seems to be almost entirely taken for granted on mumsnet? This is not something I have a definite opinion on myself (although I am against sex testing and I fully support the rights of trans women and women with differences in sex development to compete alongside other women in sporting competitions at all levels).

However I have found it really upsetting the degrading way that people have been speaking recently about top/ elite female athletes; denigrating their sporting prowess, and portraying them as weak, feeble and helpless, particularly in the wake of this boxing match controversy.

I started looking into opinions on the issue, starting with a search on “feminists against sex segregation in sport”. I came across this really interesting article.

AIBU to share?

journals.library.wustl.edu/lawreview/article/3150/galley/19983/view/

but people have suggested height, weight, hormones…

You missed the most important part. Surprisingly 😃. Here you are-
And btw.... screenshot everything, not just random parts. You know, just honesty

Ooh it's good this copying one sentence and not having to bother adding a comment isn't it?! Might take it up!

OP please copy the above!!!

Oh gosh. Sorry. I missed this post too. This thread is moving so fast that I am buzzing back and forth.

I have also been pointing out that you support and actively celebrate abusive posters and you, yourself, have crossed over to abusiveness of others. You have been complaining that MNHQ won’t let you keep posting abusive name calling and negative generalisations.

I have been posting to you reasons why your posts and why the posters you support get deleted when they cross over to abusive behaviour.

What is remarkable is that you don’t see your own behaviour as abusive. Just righteous.

You seem to be upset that MNHQ won’t allow your abusive posts to stand. Because to you, name calling doesn’t seem abusive when you do it.

It'll be something to do with migratory waterfowl.

@Tandora Pound for pound a man of the same height and weight as a woman is stronger and more powerful. This is due to body composition (muscle/fat ratio), bone density, skeletal differences, heart size, lung capacity.... and so on.

Penis pandering isn’t feminism - hope that helps OP

sadly I think a lot of people think that: isn’t that why it gets less attention?
that women are paid less etc?

on the other thread people kept comparing the top female althletes to “crap” and “mediocre” men. Yes, the top female athletes are out performed by male elite athletes , but they are still more athletic than the overwhelming majority of average men. I don’t think comparing them to a “crap man” is really fair.

Why don't you organise a local event for charity and put the theory to the test?

Start small with a few events. I suggest running, weightlifting and cycling.

Live stream it for us and lets see how it works out. Take a nice group photo of all the winners from every category and we'll play a game of spot the penis.

A video of you explaining kindly to all the women who took part that they just didn't try hard enough to win and this is what feminism looks like will be the icing on the cake.

A video of you explaining kindly to all the women who took part that they just didn't try hard enough to win and this is what feminism looks like will be the icing on the cake.

😂😂

I haven't RTFT. But my opinion is that we need to examine what sport is for. I think elite sport showcases and pushes the limits of what the human body can do. The thing about "the human body" though is that it comes in two varieties, male and female. I'm not interested in pretending male and females have identical bodies. I am interested in seeing what women (and men) can achieve with their bodies.

It's nothing to do with women being worse or weaker. People who love sport are interested to see what a woman's body can do, and celebrate new milestones, precisely because we see women as a way of being human. Female bodies aren't shit and weak male bodies. Why should we pretend they are?

Actually NonPlayer, it has been so hot that have not slept myself.

If you're too immature to actually engage with questions that are asked, preferring instead to just copy and paste selected sentences, perhaps you may need to acknowledge that it's way past your bedtime?

I have also been pointing out that you support and actively celebrate abusive posters and you, yourself, have crossed over to abusiveness of others

Also when you quote something we can see it again, you don't need to quote it and also repeat it under in bold

When we talk about 'mediocre' male athletes we are comparing them to their male peers not to women. Nobody here thinks that top female athletes are crap.

You really are hard of understanding or very obtuse.

@Tandora so the way to challenge those attitudes is not to have mixed sex competitions, because women would never be seen in elite competition again. We need to challenge the media to report on women's sport equally, especially state broadcasters like the BBC/C4. We need to support women's sport ourselves and promote it to other people. We need to talk about women sports stars to our children, male and female.

I watched Simone Biles with my son today, and explained about her excellence and her physical prowess, for example.

So many ways to make change, but not this nonsense idea of removing women's sporting categories.

Your typing is normal and your posts are lucid, intelligent, well reasoned and substantiated as always, though, so there isn't the same cause for concern.

People who love sport are interested to see what a woman's body can do, and celebrate new milestones, precisely because we see women as a way of being human. Female bodies aren't shit and weak male bodies. Why should we pretend they are?

I know, I'm at a loss to understand who thinks they are, except OP? Literally nobody has posted that.

I’m engaging with the people who are participqting in the topic!

im copy-pasting the very numerous posts that are just nasty, gratuitous personal attacks for reasons expalined above. I think it’s really important to draw attention to the sheer volume of these and their character.

Oh Tandora, really?

I fully support the rights of trans women and women with differences in sex development to compete alongside other women in sporting competitions at all levels

You say you don't know much about sport, but everyone (except you perhaps) realises that men are on average bigger, stronger and faster, and therefore better at nearly every sport. And that includes things like darts and pool, where as well as arm reach and muscle advantages, socialisation is a factor, alongside menstruation/pregnancy, enabling more practice for men comared to women. And yes, transwomen are on the side with the advantages.

You don't need to be an expert to know this stuff. You don't even need to follow sport. It's that basic.

I'm starting to think you are just playing devil's advocate in your posts.

💯 agree.

Male and female bodies are different and elite sport test the limits of thise bodies.

Mens bodies are faster and stronger - that doesn’t make women weak or inferior, just biologically different but to be celebrated equally.

Genetic men competing against when us cheating and that’s totally unacceptable in sport.

So perfectly put.

You really are hard of understanding or very obtuse