to say women don't have XY chromosomes?

[taylorswift1989]

Seeing a lot of posts on social media with people admitting they were "wrong" to call Imane Khelif a man, and that they now understand "she's a woman with XY chromosomes."

Am I going insane? A person with XY chromosomes is male! (Regardless of how they identify, of course.) Why are people saying stuff that is obviously nonsensical? Are people really that ignorant of basic biological facts?

but neither views means that people think all DSDs should be regarded as female

correct. I wouldn’t regard all DSDs as female either

Of course you do.

If I am a woman boxer then fine. I am not a boxer and never would be I don't agree with the sport at all.

So what? I beat mediocre men in tennis frequently. That doesn't say that as a class females can compete fairly with males.

Is it not unfair to the XX woman who lacks the help XY testosterone brings?

XY should be fighting XY .

Does your high testosterone level make you massively sporty, muscular and highly competitive, do you mind me asking?
My friend hasn’t found that to be the case despite all the talk about these boxers. 😉

The difference in arm length was enough for me, Angela could barely reach him! Was her bloody nose not enough of a domination for you?

Sigh, genes reside on chromosomes but you can get Y genes on the X chromosome and vice versa and many of the mutations of genes involved in DSDs arent even on the sex chromosomes. And there arent 'plenty' of people with DSDs. All of them, including minor comgenital genital ambiguities, are less than 0.5% of births.

Sywer syndrome, which is actually called XY Complete Gonadal Dysgenesis only happens to genetic XY males because it is caused by a muation in the SRY gene which is NORMALLY found on the Y chromosome. Cross over events can lead to it being found on the X chromosome and this is the cause of the DSS XX male syndrome or de la chapelle syndrome.

These are complex genetic conditions and whether or not they result in a man or a woman depends on awhole host of factors including whether there was medical or hornonal intervention at birth or not. They shouldn't be used in identity politics.

And they are very rare genetic mistakes, not the normal pathway. Which is XX female XY male and that is what sports categories should be based on. You don't see people born blind insisting they should be in the Olympics and not the Paraolympics.

How do you know, she was born with a vagina??? No where have I seen this being reported?

The irony of this situation is that both these athletes are boxers, and boxing is one of the contact sports that has very specific rules in place, ie by using very carefully graded weight categories, to make sure that competitors are as equally matched as possible, because clearly a flyweight boxer is going to be beaten to a pulp in seconds by a taller, heavier boxer with a longer reach.

What the boxing categories have not taken into account is the mismatch that occurs when a boxer, with the height ,reach and muscle strength advantage that comes with male puberty , is allowed to compete in female boxing because he complies with the weight restriction. And has an F in his passport.

i hope the IOC sorts this out before a woman is seriously injured , potentially killed because they are refusing to see common sense, and put in place a system to protect female athletes from cheats. It’s really quite simple.

It is irrelevant whether they win or lose.

If you think that it matters in the discussion about competitive advantage, then you are applying false logic.

I wish that this former boxing champion had spoken up sooner - he seems to have waited until one of his countrywomen was scheduled to box. However, his statement may be of interest to some. (Apologies if I've missed the fact that someone has already posted the link.)

reduxx.info/international-olympic-committee-was-warned-about-male-boxers-world-boxing-organization-vice-president-says/

But you don't think there should be sex tests for sports and have been banging on about CAIS with regard to the boxers, who as far as we are aware do not have a CAIS diagnosis.

Again I ask in case you missed it last time what do you think there should not a sex testing in sport? Do you think there shouldn't be M and F categories or that there should be M and F categories but that anyone can choose which category they want to compete in?

Ah but that might just be his mobile phone or lucky boxing amulet. Look at his passport to be sure.

The tests were not published because that would be a breech of GDPR.

The organisation has not been proven to be corrupt, the IOC have made that claim to discredit the test results.

Tests were carried out at two separate laboratories.

Both boxers could have appealed the IBA decision, to disqualify them from women's boxing, with the CAS. They did not.

The outcome of CAS tribunals are made public. Caster Semenya appealed his disqualification which is why we know he is male.

Variations in size and strength within your sex class are not as significant as the differences between the sexes.

An elite female boxer beating a poor male boxer does not mean men don't have a physical advantage over women. A man competing in women's elite sport has denied another woman an opportunity.

The IOC accepted the sex marker on Khelif and Lin's passports as evidence they met the inclusion criteria for participation in the women's boxing competition. Given the number of countries which permit self ID and allow people to change the sex marker on their official documents this is a dangerous precedent to set.

Women's rights campaigners have never reduced womanhood to simply having a vagina but being a woman still remains a matter of biology and men do not meet the biological criteria to be women.

Why the obsession with vaginas???
If you had to identify females by a single body part, it would be ovaries, not vaginas.

In what way is he being discriminated against?

He won

Do you care about the women at all? Even a tiny bit?

Khelif has won.

It’s not about the T. It’s about the physical advantages that going through male puberty conveys. These are irreversible. Height, bone length, muscle strength, heart and lung size and capacity. You can’t change them, or reduce them.

Is that clinical judgement not essentially: it will be better for this child to become a ‘masculine’ woman, without reproductive capacity, than a man without reproductive capacity or external male genitals?