to say women don't have XY chromosomes?

[taylorswift1989]

Seeing a lot of posts on social media with people admitting they were "wrong" to call Imane Khelif a man, and that they now understand "she's a woman with XY chromosomes."

Am I going insane? A person with XY chromosomes is male! (Regardless of how they identify, of course.) Why are people saying stuff that is obviously nonsensical? Are people really that ignorant of basic biological facts?

This is a genetically inherited condition. Well known in the community and not a shock when it happens.

Our chromosomes are what define our sex.

Our genes are what determine our sex
Our gametes are what define sex

Female with high testosterone do not have male levels of testosterone.

I’m a biological scientist in the field 37 years, not sure how much more reading I want to do tbh.
As much as you want to believe what you’ve written it’s just. not. true.
You’re now trying to say that people with XY chromosomes are not genetically male. Yeah ok then. I’m not even sure you know what a chromosome is 🤦‍♀️

How do we know she has XY chromosomes? I’ve seen nothing that confirms this. The only thing even alluding to this comes from the IBA statement. But there’s no evidence of her being biologically male, and we know the IBA is extremely corrupt and not the most trustworthy source

I know.

Some of the answers are showing that YANBU!
The obfuscation and whataboutery are ridiculous. There are 2 sexes - male and female. Male - XY, if the body is created around the production small gametes, Female - XX, if it's created around the production of large gametes. Anyone can say anything about gender, which is a social construct (though very probably also often interlinked with sex) or about 'legal sex' on which I make no comment - because the key to differences between males and females is not gender or 'legal sex', but biological sex, which means that at population level, males are bigger, stronger and faster than females. They are also more violent and more criminal. It matters not whether a male person has a DSD - they are a male with a DSD. Just as it would not matter if a female were born without an arm, or grew up with a flat chest. She would still be a female and therefore part of the population which is smaller, weaker, slower, less violent and less criminal than the male part.
Sympathy for people with DSDs is also irrelevant to the biological issues involved, which are absolutely clear.

From BBC

As others have probably said, we are not ignorant of basic biology, but are also aware of complex biology. Whatever definition you want to put in place eg XY is male, there will be exceptions. What about XX males? There are a significant number of them in the world. Would you allow them to compete? Or is it, bluntly, anybody who looks male is male?

The tests was carried out by two independent organisations and approved by the Court of Arbitration in Sport - the same organisation the IOC delegate doping decisions to.

I remember reading about them,very interesting and because it was known in that community they knew how to deal with it.

In most other places it is described as vanishingly rare, though seemingly common in the olympics. 🤔

So what? There is no suggestion these boxers have CAIS. And CAIS individuals are unlikely, brutally, to be strong or athletic or sporty enough to be able to get to the top level in any sports. They also have undecended testes and other medical problems that would make this very unlikely.

Are you a doctor or scientist? (I am neither anymore but have a degree in Molecular Biology and Genetics). You domt seem to understand DSDs as a branch of medicine very well.

It seems appropriate to bring in Mike Tyson at this point.

“Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth.”

If the defenders of Imane Khelif et al happened to be elite female boxers themselves - I'd love to know how many would be happy to get in the ring with them.

I do feel sorry for her with all this speculation - but I believe she was also born with internal testicals which are creating the extra testosterone. So you could easily say women don't have testicals either.

From my limited understanding its our ovaries which create our female hormones and men's testicals that create male hormones...so she would have gone through male puberty which is what the issue is.

It's an example of a particular condition where a child can be wrongly assumed to be female. It's no longer a shock in that particular community.

Whichever poster says she was born with a vagina, could they post the irrefutable evidence please? (And that's not simply the person or her parents saying so.)

Two sports organisations have banned her (?) from competing as a woman.

The IOC based their decision on what is on her passport.

You’re now trying to say that people with XY chromosomes are not genetically male

I did not say that.

I'm a woman with high testosterone due to PCOS, no female with high testosterone even comes close to the levels of testosterone that a male has.

Normal measurements for these tests:

• Male: 10 to 35 nanomoles per liter (nmol/L)
• Female: 0.5 to 2.4 nmol/L.

It really is as simple as women are XX, men are XY. Agree with you OP. There may be some
exceptions with chromosomal disorders - but those are rare exceptions which would warrant further discussion. To quantify if any other way would be wrong. Women don’t stop being women after menopause when they stop producing female hormones. Hormone treatment and surgery isn’t everything.

She has a vagina and a cervix.

She is a woman.

What about women who have a hysterectomy? Are they no longer a woman?
And women like Tracy Emin who, after cancer, no longer have a functioning vagina.

There is a ot more to being a woman than having a womb, cervix and a vagina.

XX people are females, not males. The Y chromosome is required for expression of male sex-based genes which in turn makes a foetus male.

So you are saying a girl who was dressed, played, engagement as per her peers. You are basically denying her lived experience because it doesn't align with your view ?

Because I would respect her as knowing what her sex is. Honestly the pure bile, ignorance and disrespect of individuals, not hypotheticals but individual human beings, is beyond disgusting and a sad reflection of today's society.

Imagine how her family and others with children who share these MEDICAL issues. Christ the witches are alive today.

He does NOT have a vagina and cervix. That is impossible in an XY individual. He may have, or have had before puberty, ambiguous genitalia.

In some male babies, the penis is no bigger than a clitoris. So they can be seen as 'female' at birth.

There are also females assigned 'men' because they have an enlarged clitoris.

These sad cases can be designated as a particular gender based on ignorance of medical facts.

A chromosome test is the only way to find out.

So you are saying a girl who was dressed, played, engagement as per her peers. You are basically denying her lived experience because it doesn't align with your view ?

Because I would respect her as knowing what her sex is. Honestly the pure bile, ignorance and disrespect of individuals, not hypotheticals but individual human beings, is beyond disgusting and a sad reflection of today's society.

Imagine how her family and others with children who share these MEDICAL issues. Christ the witches are alive today.

I feel sorry for individuals who find out they are a different sex than they thought, however I value female safety above male feelings. What's wrong with you that you don't?