To be glad that the VAT on school fees

[Shaketherombooga]

Is now going to be happening in January? what’s the point in stalling it? I think it’s one of many decisions that we just need to get in with.

YABU - it’s SO unfair. Labour hates ‘strivers’ etc etc

YANBU - Yup, Labour said they are taking away tax breaks for private schools, so let’s get on with it.

"I couldn't care less how bitter the private schoolers are, you're probably still going to be a lot more comfortable than those you voted to screw over for years."

And it's the private schoolers that are bitter you say????!?

Got off their arses and done ok for themselves. Most have come from nothing and just want better for their kids than the shithole comp they came from

Lots of jobs are high pressure and stress without high pay.

All children deserve quality schooling.

If it becomes clear that all has worked out well in 5 years time, then feel free to pm me, and I will come on here and apologise!

It may be hard to analyse some of the costs... such as reduced income tax returns as high income parents work less... and reduced global competitiveness due to reduced overall investment in education (if private schools become the preserve of overseas students, who will then take that educational investment by their parents back to their home country).

So I'll expect a proper independent economic analysis, not just your own judgement!

Will you do the same if it turns out I was right?

(Feels like I win either way - I really do hope it doesn't turn out as I fear. Feeling a bit silly and giving a public apology would be a small price to pay)

Old 2 homes Ange? Yeah probably 🤣🤣

Genuinely interested to know where all the undersubscribed schools are... definitely not the case where I live & I have 6 secondary schools within a 1.5 mile radius of me, and a similar amount of primary schools (maybe a couple more). All are oversubscribed and there are plans to do a lot of building on local green belt, with no extra schools.

I think you have misunderstood. I really don't care about the outcome.

Did you mean to be so rude?

Aye, shame they cancelled the North Sea oil licences really......innit

Just my opinion. I am completely entitled to that, you know. I started out caring a bit but some of the private school parent group are so rude and entitled that I don't care any more.

Regarding the data that will be available after September @strawberrybubblegum help me understand:

1. some people will have declined to apply for independent schools knowing the VAT was likely because Labour were likely to win.
2. But some of those kids might not have got in anyway.
3. Some people might have risked it in hope of Tory victory or modified Labour policy or school managing not to pass on whole 20%.
4. The ind schools will still be full, how do you measure the number who chose not to apply?
5. For kids already in the Independent system, it’s unlikely that many people will have decided so far in advance to take their kids out of school for September, too much uncertainty then for such a massive decision, with election/implementation timing and individual schools’ future level of fees . Even if you can’t afford to pay for the entire education private any more, you can prob scrape together enough to get them to a point where leaving is least disruptive.
6. Other factors dictate numbers in state schools- birth rates, building work in catchments, immigration, catchment area changes.

Is there really going to be much in the way of meaningful data come September?

I think this is the point which is often missed, it's not just about how hard people work now, it's historical. They are often the cries of 'I work hard too but still can't afford private school'. And that is true, lower paid jobs are often physically much harder than lower paid ones - carers, health care assistants etc work very hard in an important role for relatively low pay.

But how many of them can say that they studied for 5-6 hours straight after school every night, every weekend, every holiday day, whilst their mates were out having fun. That they spent the money from their weekend job on study guides for exams rather than on clothes and going out. I knew what I wanted to do, and worked flipping hard from around 11 years old to do it, going to a failing state school. My parents valued education but could only afford private for 1, my brother needed it more, that's a choice they made which I fully agreed with at the time and now.

Realistically, I probably still couldn't afford to pay for private school for both my girls because I chose to stay working in the nhs, that's a choice I make and take responsibility for. But if I feel they really need it, I won't hesitate to move into private practice to pay for them to attend private school, as with the VAT increase, I couldnt afford on my nhs salary. The choices I made as a child to get to where I am now are mine, the historical effort was mine, the achievement is mine and my children are my responsibility to provide for. And I will be sad to leave the nhs which I believe in and which trained me, but my children for me come first, as they do for every parent.
Looking at this thread, I'm not the only nhs professional who could be pushed out by this policy.

A lot of independent schools aren't full. Not are they selective.

As with many parts of this debate, it needs to be remembered that not all independent school are Harrow/Eton/etc, not all are selective, and a lot of parents sending their child(ren) to independent schools are no more well off than some of those baying for their blood.

Mine included but I still don't agree with this policy

I mean my job

Fortunately my df are grown up but they went to a decent state school

Dc

Do you know what- the only rude people on these threads are certainly not the parents who put their children in private schools. They provide well educated backed up, evidenced answered when questioned . Most private school parents aren’t the ones even making these posts in the first place.

Where as there are others who seem thrilled, make unfounded comments and seem to be getting off that some might pay 20% extra for private schools. Unfortunately- the only ones who will lose out in the policy are those with scholarships or bursaries from working class backgrounds, or those who couldn’t get a place at a special educational needs school and have found if they give all their salary and have no luxuries etc they can just afford to put their child in to a private school to meet their needs. As a head teacher in a state school, I absolutely salute these parents , I see children who are neglected and their parents could not care less about their wellfare and then I see these parents working 3 jobs to pay the fees.

After reading some of these posts I am delighted they are bringing in VAT on fees.

Honestly some of your posts turn my stomach. I mean I know that there are right wing snobs out there. But reading your views takes it to another level. Seriously you disgust me.

You deserve it. And I will celebrate it.

I didn’t specify academically selective I just said that some kids might not have got in. I thought all independent schools had the right to choose their pupils as long as not discriminating based on protected characteristics?

Yeah I'm sure loads work 3 jobs to pay the fees 🤦

I am not sure why you are directing this at me. You can't call me rude because I don't care about the policy. That is what I am talking about when I refer to entitled behaviour. I am sure there are many policies you don't care about that I do . I respect that as your right. Could you please do the same.

But it will also be massively different county by county. In Surrey for example 20% of all children attend private school and that is probably higher for secondary v primary- could easily be 30% at a private secondary. You’ve suddenly got quite a big problem at that level if you have a big shift to state compared to areas of the country where private schooling is much less common. Some London Burroughs will have even higher percentages. Each county will have a different supply and demand flows. Grammar areas will be affected differently to non-grammars etc.

@PenNirvana

"What about nurses? They have more stress and responsibility than most. Where is that reflected in their pay. Or should they be penalised because they have a less mercenary approach to the job they chose than others?"

Well it depends on how people are rewarded in their careers. Currently it is the free market so an investment bank may choose to pay someone a lot of money because they make the bank a lot of money. They will pay the banker more money than the one who doesn't and who gets fired.

Or you could base remuneration based on stress and responsibility or what value they contribute to society. Because these metrics are subjective then you would need the Government to decide who gets paid what across the state and private sector

@DinnaeFashYersel

"After reading some of these posts I am delighted they are bringing in VAT on fees"

Would you hold the same view if this tax policy cost more to raise than it generated in tax revenues.

I could generally see both sides of the argument until this post… after years of watching the richer folk repeatedly vote in a party that just benefits those like themselves

Why weren’t the not so rich folk voting? Given the rich folk comprise a minority of the country, I am not sure you can pin the previous election results solely on them