Friend won’t take the hint about my house

[SlovenlyOldSlut]

I have a good friend who I met about six years ago, but only really became very friendly with during lockdown, as I was furloughed and she was caring for her sick father, meaning that as two single people, we had a lot of time for messaging and video calls.

As we live on opposite sides of London, we’ve always met centrally or in specific locations rather than visiting one another’s homes. She’s never been to my place; I’ve been to hers once when she had a tribute evening for her father after he died. That was something everyone she knew was invited to; she’s never invited me there one on one. This hasn’t ever been an issue for me, as there’s no point in either of us trekking across the city unless there’s a real reason to go to the other’s house (e.g. a party).

However, lately she has developed a real bugbear about not having been to my house. At every opportunity, it’s “I can’t believe I still haven’t been to your place! We need to sort out a time”. We’ll be making plans for something else and she’ll throw in, “Yeah, let’s do that - and we need to sort out when I’m coming round to yours too! I really want to see your place!” We were looking at an event near to me and it was, “Ooh, great - and I can see your house too! As I STILL haven’t seen it…” (complete with mock hurt face).

Now, I struggle with housework at the best of times. I don’t like mess, but I just get overwhelmed. However, at the moment it’s worse for a variety of reasons. A relative is storing some stuff here while they’re abroad, so I have less space. Everything seems to be breaking at once too. I’ve just bought a new washing machine, so I’m behind with laundry; the fridge freezer is about to die; plus the hob is now taking turns between either refusing to light at all or taking my bloody eyebrows off. The whole house needs time and money spending on it before I’m ready for guests.

I have TOLD my friend this. I tell her every time she brings it up. I’ve been completely honest about why I’m not ready for guests at the moment and have said I’m going to have a party at some point (realistically Christmas) once everything is a bit straighter. She isn’t listening. It’s always “Awwh, I don’t mind; you should see the mess my place is in sometimes!” - or worse “But I could help you! I love tidying up; it’s my thing, I’ll help!” The latter is my worst nightmare - I let another friend “help” once after she made a big thing about being a big declutterer and I wanted to cry within about five minutes.

AIBU to think she needs to respect my feelings for the moment? It’s not about her not being welcome; I don’t want anyone here at the moment. And it’s not like I’m around there every week and never return the hospitality - like I say, I’ve only been there once. I feel like I need to say that this topic is off limits until I say otherwise, even at the risk of offending her, because it’s becoming stressful having to fend this off every time we meet.

You are coming across as a bully. OP had already asked you to stop.

Oh FFS 🤦‍♀️

Zero to do with the thread, but I do sympathise with the everything breaking at once, OP! I suppose it must be because one tends to buy things at the same time , often connected with moving house or some other life event ( wedding presents) , but it does make you feel as if the inanimate objects in your home are ganging up on you.

in the last month,I have had the toaster ( rarely used since DH switched to muesli for breakfast, so I presume sulking and downing tools) , my beloved stab mixer which literally fell apart IN THE SOUP, the pepper mill ( got a much nicer one which matches the kitchen) ….the television has develop a weird fault where you can’t turn it on or off except ant the plug and to make it show you a picture you have to turn the satellite box on manually with a tiny button.

Dont have her round, the stairs will probably collapse….or the front door will refuse to shut.

Frankly, it doesn't matter whether your house is a mess or a palace- it's your private space and you clearly don't like to invite people - any people- there. It's not personal. Tell her this and that the discussion is over- you'd prefer to continue meeting elsewhere. If she pushes, she's not a friend.

I think that OP knows what the problem is - and it's little to do with the 'friend' .

When OP says she's 'untidy' it's a classic word used by serious hoarders to justify the hell their condition has left them in.

I would bet my bottom dollar that OPs home is so overwhelmed with 'stuff' that she doesn't know how to start sorting it out - and the friend keep asking - is just reinforcing the fact that OP knows that she needs help.

Go to your GP OP.. confess all. There is help out there . Hoarding is a mental illness with help available.. do it OP it will be like a weight has lifted.

Confess All?! Wtf, are you all there? Making stuff up is also a symptom of some mental illness....as is seeing things that arent there
......the irony. The thread is about a friend not listening to a friends boundaries or actual words saying no NOT to do with the state of the ops house. Hovel or Castle, 'I don't want anyone here at the moment, I'm not comfortable with that' is all that matters. It's not difficult to grasp

I don’t think you mean to, but you’re the one who comes across as trying to shift blame. I’ve been clear that I’m not ready for visitors at the moment and really that should be the end of it. You’re telling me that I have “underlying hostility”; that I’m oversensitive, am making excuses; that I’m rejecting kindness and that it’s “normal behaviour” for a friend to keep pushing this issue (and therefore implying that my response is abnormal).

You’re talking in this very therapy-esque style and obviously think you’re approaching this very sensitively, but in reality, you’re actually being a bit dismissive and trying to make it all my fault.

👏

My initial reaction was that you weren't being unreasonable at all - I think we're all entitled to socialise how we see fit and it's totally fine to not want your friend to come to your house. I also live in London and have friends who haven't seen my house due to distance - I wouldn't think much of it. But bearing in mind she clearly does I think the way to deal with it is by being direct and kind. "I really value our friendship, but I just really do prefer socialising outside of the house. It's nothing personal at all so please don't be offended but please do stop asking me if you are able to come over. I just don't enjoy hosting and don't find it very relaxing.".

However, some of your responses have made me wonder whether there is a hoarding element going on. Obviously it's impossible to tell this from a few messages - maybe you're just talking about normal levels of clutter/disarray that many of us experience at times. But if your friend suspects that there is something bigger going on, this might be coming from a place of trying to help. She's going about it all wrong in trying to force herself in to your space, and you're not obliged to accept any help. If you don't have a hoarding issue, I'd scale back all the chat around not ready for guests/chaos etc. so she's clear she's got the wrong end of the stick!

If you think you might have a hoarding issue (there are risk assessments you can do if you're not sure -- google hoarding scale) then you can get help. Your friend sounds like she cares and could be someone to open up to or there are lots of other options too https://www.mind.org.uk/information-support/types-of-mental-health-problems/hoarding/help-yourself-with-hoarding/

This has got to be up there with 'just move house', just get a new job' and 'just LTB'
🙄

This is ridiculous and offensive. As you say, hoarding indicates mental illness - so don’t minimise it or insult those suffering by lumping anyone who’s a bit untidy into the same category.

How do you not realise how deeply patronising and offensive this is, especially after the op saying she's not a frigging hoarder?

Tbh you are both being weird. Her for the fixation on seeing your house (who cares?)

And you, most people would say sure come a week Saturday and spend the following weekend sorting it out. But that doesn't seem possible which is odd.

But your choice you need to be firmer

She should just accept it and move on op 🤷🏼‍♀️ it would be different if you were at hers every second day, but you only went once at a general gathering. Her failure to accept no is odd and intrusive. You have said when you sort the place you will invite her over so she shouldn’t be forcing it on you! I get the wanting to sort the place, we have a relative storing things and honestly when I agreed I didn’t think into my own lack of space and I also wouldn’t want anyone over at the minute so I can understand that!

@auntpanty . OP cares. It's her house. Her friend keeps pushing for an invite and OP finds it intrusive. Why is that so hard for you to understand?

Oh OP, you sound like me! My house is a bit lot of a mess. I’m trying to get to grips with it but it takes time. I have some close friends who I don’t mind coming over without too much of a tidy up. An unannounced and unplanned visitor is my idea of hell. No thank you.

Am I a horder? I don’t think so. It’s not that I don’t want to get rid of a lot of stuff - time is a massive factor in it. I also have mobility problems which makes life that bit harder as doing all the sorting out and clearing up a pain. The logical side of my brain also acknowledges that once it’s sorted out it will be much easier to keep tidy. I am getting there, but slowly. I don’t want to be pushed into doing things faster. Having said that if I know that someone is coming round in say 6 weeks time, that pushes me to get started and keep going. I always get much more done with a deadline.

Is there a time frame for when your relative’s belongings will be removed? If so, perhaps pencil her in for a few weeks after that? It shuts her up for the time being and gives you a goal to work towards that isn’t too soon.

Having said that, I don’t like pushy people and your friend is making me feel uncomfortable on your behalf. I would probably start to distance myself from her.

I'm with you OP, what on earth does it matter to her that she "hasn't seen your house". She sounds very petty and determined, making a huge deal and putting unnecessary pressure on you.
If you were at her house all the time, eating her food and taking advantage of her hospitality, I could kind of see a point. But that's not at all the case! If I'd asked a friend once and they said they weren't comfortable for whatever reason, I'd leave it up to them to decide when to invite me - if they wanted to. Surely that's what every normal person does?
She isn't taking your No for an answer = isn't respecting you and your boundaries.

Hi OP. Your friend sounds like a pain. I'm a Londoner and have many friends whose houses I've not visited. Much easier to meet up centrally. Also, I want to see my friends, not where they live...Is your house particularly interesting or large and that is intriguing here? Otherwise lots of nice and polite suggestions up thread as to how to respond to her.

OP - so many replies you probably won’t even read this, but I just wanted to say that reading your post made me almost have to reach for my inhaler as it made me feel so anxious! Obviously I’m partly joking but I really feel your pain in the situation you describe above!!

Sorry if you read it that way - it's not my intention and I hope I haven't upset you OP. I've re-read and she hadn't said before my post that she wasn't a hoarder, although she has indicated now that she's just a bit untidy, which I agree is totally different.

I will take her at her word on that of course - but some of the things she's said on this thread clearly made a couple of us get the wrong end of the stick! And if she's speaking in a similar way to her friend then maybe her friend also has the same misconception, which might explain her desire to see for herself/help.

Regardless, my advice stands to tell her friend politely and firmly no and not use the excuse of mess etc.

@ClockworkDisaster Yes, we sound quite similar! I certainly wouldn’t classify myself as a hoarder - I’m no psychologist, but to me, hoarding implies a mental block around being able to throw things out; a fear that the 2003 Radio Times or the Christmas photograph where you cut everyone’s heads off could prove vital one day. (I’m probably massively over-simplifying, and I really don’t intend to offend anyone.) I don’t have an issue with getting rid of things; I’ve just put out a full bag for the charity collection and did a car boot sale with a friend not so long ago to get rid of surplus stuff. It’s more a sense of feeling overwhelmed sometimes; jobs that might take five or ten minutes in isolation can feel insurmountable when there are six or seven of them waiting.

Also, I think the thread has been dominated by the untidiness angle, whereas there are other issues that aren’t as (relatively) simple to fix. I can’t get the new boiler boxed in by next Tuesday. The broken kitchen door could be replaced, but what’s the point when ideally I want to replace them all? If I have visitors, I want to show off the house at its best - or at least a point where I feel comfortable.

In your own time? My guess is that means never. Realistically it means never and realistically you aren't going to be organised in time to have this fantasy Christmas party either, are you? You sound like my mother. Constantly saying 'When I am a bit more organised I'll do XYZ but at the moment I'm in the middle of sorting my house out and I'm just too busy.'

Except that nothing ever changes and her house never gets any better. She's fundamentally lazy, lacks motivation, buys more stuff because she's bored, telling herself she's going to use it/wear it, but never does. And she finds it hard to let go of stuff she doesn't need. So she never gets around to doing XYZ with her life, but continues to make excuses for her own mess, as though it's a temporary thing. It's not.

If your other friend felt the need to step in as a declutterer and go through your fridge throwing stuff out, that tells me your problem is worse than you are acknowledging on here.

Just tell her the truth. That you live in a tip, you have an tidiness and hoarding issue, you don't feel mentally ready to tackle it yet but neither do you want to open yourself up to judgement either. Your meet ups are to remain on neutral territory or they won't happen at all, until you say otherwise. Just own it. Don't waste time getting stressed and trying to find ways to put her off for this month, or the next month, or the month after that. Just be honest and be firm.

@SlovenlyOldSlut Yes I totally understand that. I have a lot of little jobs that need to be done. But sometimes to do one job you have to do a few other first and it’s all a bit much when your mind isn’t in the right place.

But yes, the larger jobs that need doing make it harder. I’d love to rearrange my utility room into one of those lovely neat ones you see on Insta with big matching cupboards and everything neatly arranged. But to do that I’d need to remove a stud wall and put a door back up that the previous owners removed when the put the stud wall up. And like you, I’d like to change all my doors. That’s not a skill I have myself so I’d have to get a carpenter or handyman in to adjust and fit them. Therefore - not gonna get done for a while. And whilst it’s all a random mess of stuff that doesn’t match or fit well it’s much harder to keep clean and tidy.

Why are you being such a twat to a stranger? Dial the projection down and go say all that to your mother....it might make the urge to do it to strangers lessen

She doesn't want her over. It doesn't matter why.

@SlovenlyOldSlut i get it. I’m in a similar position and have been for the last 6 months.

Massive squishes. Ask her to stop harking on about it and that you’ll invite her at some point but in the mean time let’s go do x/y and have some fun.