is this unforgivable in a friendship?

[pam72]

I was in a close friendship with a group of other mums. over lockdown, I became close to the DH of one of my good friends. I'm a single mum - which can often be a tricky card to play...While nothing physical ever happened, we both admitted we had feelings for each other, but also agreed it would be catastrophic for so many people if anything further developed. Nothing ever did, but when he's drunk he sends me very full on messages about how life is cruel and how much he wishes we could be together. I don't fully shut them down - to do this I think I'd have to say I would tell his wife? but I don't encourage them (I'll tell him to go to bed / stop messaging) its incredibly hard to ignore and I think about him constantly. I also feel it's very unfair of him to send these messages. he seems totally able to compartmentalize and act like nothing weird has happened. but to me, it's all consuming, It honestly feels like a drug. Nothing happened, I distanced myself, from him and his wife's friendship, I moved house, I left my job. I questioned everything about myself, unable to believe the feelings I had for him didn't just trump, but floored any feelings of guilt I had for his wife. Never ever ever thought I'd be this person. Totally thought I was both stronger and way more loyal to the sisterhood.

Recently his wife has blocked me on every social platform, removed me from group chats etc and I feel (but don't know) that she is trying to get our mutual friends to distance themselves from me. If she knew the truth I totally get why this would happen, but if she knew the truth, I also don't think she'd stay with her husband, but she's still with him. I understand we can no longer be friends, I don't want to be, but am I being unreasonable to feel angry that the husband, who 1000000% drove every single interaction, is coming out smelling of roses, while I'm the scarlet women who tries to steal my friends' husband? I don't know what he told her, but it's clearly something that isn't true (I won't be in contact with him as I feel this just looks like I'm causing trouble)

NB - appreciate this is a hugely triggering post for lots of people, and I fully expect to get torrents of abuse - but I'm being truthful about a situation and a position that I don't think gets shared too much - but probably is more common that people realize.

Gosh, I thought you were going to say taking months to text your best mate back or taking longer than agreed to pay £100 back after borrowing or something like that from your thread title.

It’s not even a question for me. You’re not to be trusted. You’ve disrespected a friend’s marriage. You’ve been dishonest. You’ve a hid a secret. You’ve repeatedly sought validation from a friend’s spouse and kept it going because you’re needy. And you’ve completely failed to take responsibility for your role in this. Who needs a friend like that?

Not only would I distance myself from you if it were my husband, I would keep you at bay if I heard you’d behaved like this with anyone’s husband.

Much harder to walk away from an idiot who sniffed around your DH than what it is to walk away from your idiot DH who sniffed around a friend. Father to your children, a huge part of your life. I've never been in this situation, but I know one would be so much easier to fuck off than the other.

You aren't the main villain here op, but you certainly aren't the victim

These are my thoughts too. Its easy and very flippant to say she should have left him but when your lives are enmeshed with finances and kids its not easy or simple to just up and leave- surely you realise that?

As for her blocking you - of course she bloody would, what on earth did you expect her to do?- continue with cosy coffee chats where you both discuss how naughty he's been? I would block you too if I was her- you've betrayed your friend and it doesnt reflect well on you at all regardless of the fact he made the marriage vows.

Yes it is unforgivable and you should have told her years ago about his behaviour you’ve been entertaining his “friendship “ behind her back for years no wonder she’s blocked you she can’t trust you nor him
im sure she knows what her husband is and maybe she saw the messages and maybe she doesn’t like your responses or the fact you never told her about him
maybe she feels stupid like you’ve been laughing at her behind her back
either way you e not acted like a friend to her and it comes across as very sneaky and I’d not want you in my friendship group either as I’d feel there were no respect or trust with you if you can go about like that.

Right so, what In picking up from this is-

1. it is definitely an issue that you consider this woman a close friend, yet allow yourself to develop feelings for her husband and entertain his attention. You clearly do not respect your friend and your friendship or her relationship enough for this to happen;
2. I am going to repeat this to everyone over and over again, this happens not because “you can’t control your feelings or who we develop feelings for” it happens because you have a skewed moral compass and lack of respect. This happens to other people who have the same personal weaknesses, there’s lots of mentally and emotionally weak people out there, who raise emotionally and mentally weak kids very often. You’re not doing some sort of service for sharing this and looking for advice. If you’re an adult raising kids you should know better.
3. All her circle will cut you off, anyone who respects her enough will cut you out it’s normal and expected. Trust has been broken.
4. Being a single mum is not tricky or whatever. Married men in a committed relationship should not be in your radar even.

You were both wrong. You told him you had feelings for him, and entertained his musings about your possible life together - so yes this was unforgiveable from a 'friend'. It doesn't mean that he has lied to her. If he told her exactly what you have written here - the truth - she would still hate you, because what you did was wrong. She is married to him, they have a family and a life together. The likelihood is that he hasn't come out smelling of roses but she has chosen to try to work things out with him. I think it's pretty easy to understand. I think your anger is misdirected to be honest, take responsibility for own actions - and they had nothing to do with being a single mum making the situation tricky to navigate. You were flattered with the attention and failed to shut him down when you should have. She rightly probably hates you both. Do the dignified thing now, and just back off. Leave them to try to fix their marriage.

You had an emotional affair with her husband. You admit you didn't fully shut him down. Of course you could have done by blocking him, but you clearly enjoyed it.
She has found out, and may or may not want to resolve their problems, that is her prerogative. Outside of MN, far more people do repair after infidelity than don't. And no doubt he has told her it was all just a stupid fantasy on his part, which it was,, and most relationships that start as affairs do fail.
Why would any of the others in the group would want you anywhere near their husbands ? You have shown you cannot be trusted to have appropriate boundaries around partnered men, so of course they will all want you kept away.

You say being a single mum is a tricky card. Only because of people like you who flirt with and don't discourage other people's partners.

Do you have any other friends apart from this group? I cant get my head around a woman throwing good friendships away for one man. A man who tries to have an affair with his wife's friend. I mean, he's not one of the good ones is he?
Do they have children? A home? The reason she could be blaming you is because it's easier. It's hard to face up to the reality of the man you ended up with, it's complicated to seperate and she's probably trying to protect her children. Let's be honest, he won't.
You need to have a think about all of that @pam72 . Why were you so willing to disregard your friends for a shit man? Were you lonely? Such a shame and you know as well as the rest of us, he isn't worth it.

I’m stunned you’re angry that xhes trying to make her marriage work. Plenty do. Of course you need to be excluded. And none of the other women will trust you either. You told him you’d feelings for him and that trumped any feeling of guilt for his wife. Who would want to be your friend. I certainly wouldn’t. You wanted to steal her life.

And this my friend is why single mothers are never included.

I've never had feelings for anybody's husband but ... as the kids grow up, I'm never included and they meet up with their husbands occasionally perhaps, they have other friend groups, but the single parent us never included.

So I feel cross with you!!!!

Because a small percentage of single parents get into these situations, we all pay the price of being excluded. To a degree.

Namechanged.

Right, op. I’ve been in a vaguely similar situation- DH and me are good friends with another couple, and the husband and I find each other attractive. There was a time it felt pretty all-consuming to me, like a bad crush. However, forgive me if this sounds patronising- we were both absolutely sensible enough not to start messaging each other or anything like that. I don’t think either of us would ever cheat on our spouses. The attraction is just there, and still is to an extent - we are married, not dead - but we are adults, we can handle that.

I would feel terrible if my friend picked up on the ‘spark’ between us - she has not as far as I know. My DH once said that he thought the husband had a thing for me after a night out - but he didn’t expect that this was reciprocated on my part, and it didn’t seem threatening enough to stop being friends with them.

By messaging each other, you and the husband have totally overstepped a line, and of course your friend would block you. You say that you weren’t responsive, didn’t ’do anything’, but how would you have responded to his messages had you found him completely unattractive? I bet it would have been different. And I also bet that what’s truly upsetting you here isn’t that your friend blocked you, but that he hadn’t come running to you on the back of this…

I'm a single mum - which can often be a tricky card to play

Good grief, I've read some bollocks in my time but this takes the biscuit.

Its not "tricky" to not come on to your friend's husbands FFS, most of us manage this daily for our entire lives.

You are an awful "friend" and I dont blame everyone for shunning you. He's the biggest shit of all but you are also covered in it.

I think there are two types of affairs. One type where people are thrown together through circumstance, fall in love and leave their wife/husband. The other type, which is much more common, is when someone wants the fun of flirtation and extra marital relationships but does not want to leave their wife/husband. They tend to flirt with people they find attractive, somehow find a reason to get their phone number or text them, and follow up if they get some interest in return.

Your guy sounds like the latter type. His wife has decided to stay with him, for now, and knows you have shown an interest in him. Regardless of who is more to blame, she is obviously going to cut you off.

You are lucky that she hasn’t left him or you might have been saddled with him. He’d probably start texting his wife a few months into your relationship.

He’s done it before and will do again. The mistake you made was thinking you were special. Once you responded, and didn’t shut down his first wander over the boundary, he knew he could continue to test the waters. It would only be a matter of time.

Luckil you didn’t do it, however, he probably thinks you’ve led him on without giving it up. He then got frustrated and thus wanted to get rid of you. The easiest way to be rid of you was to tell his wife you’ve come on to him.

The second I read that you had become close to the DH, I shook my head. You had no business doing that.

The wife is married to a dick head, deep down she knows this. She’s silly to stay with him but she was right to block you rather than watch the slow moving car crash unfold. You’re no longer part of that friendship group. Time to move on and learn lessons.

@MsNorburry , I completely agree ! I was a single mum , and I never went near my friends partners , in fact I met my current partner through friends. However the op has just reinforced the idea , that single parents are after anyone they can get .

You told him you had feelings for him. You didn’t shut it down. You did not block him.

yes, your behaviour was completely unforgivable in friendship. Hers is perfectly understandable. Why wouldn’t she block you? Try to put as much distance between you and her entire life as possible?

”in a way, the OP would have done her friend a bigger favour by having a full blown affair with him”???????
I am not sure on what planet ANY of us would feel a “friend” had done us a favour by shagging our husband. If op was so desperate to protect her friend she could have told her that her DH was persistently contacting her, after trying multiple times herself to shut him down. But of course, that didn’t happen because op was getting cheap thrills from betraying her friend.
Op didn’t give a shiny shite about the feelings of her friend as clearly demonstrated by her post. Now she’s whining about being shut out? Grow up and get some self respect op. This was NEVER going to end well for you.

You're right- it's an absolute mystery why she blocked you. I cant get my head around that at all - a complete riddle. You'd need a really good psychologist to work that one out OP. Baffling behaviour. 🙄

@pam72 you're right that he is more to blame than you.

But the thing is that most people don't leave a marriage when their partner hasn't physically cheated and it's just messages. They want to give their marriage another go. But they absolutely would leave a friendship if they felt betrayed by their friend! A friendship is easier to leave than a marriage. I'm not surprised at all by this woman's response to the situation.

He's definitely managed the narrative here - you should have shot this down from day one, feelings or not, and told your friend her husband is a dick.

He hasn’t compartmentalised at all. You didn’t mean anything to him, he was messaging you for some entertainment.
sorry you’ve gone through this but you sure aren’t the only one he was playing along.

Clearly he's unhappy in his relationship and maybe there's genuine feelings there for you. Right person, wrong time situation. But even if that was true, his behaviour is terrible. Can you honestly say you're still attracted to a guy who sends drunk messages to women being his partners back? That would turn me right off.

I'm sorry, but your behaviour hasn't been great either.

You could have distanced yourself immediately rather than telling your friends DH that you had feelings for him! You could have blocked him immediately?

Playing the "poor me" card now is pretty awful. Imagine how she feels? I think your message makes it clear you enjoyed the conversations with her DH more than you enjoyed her friendship which probably explains why you didn't stop it earlier but you can't now put that blame on her for ending the friendship.

We all make mistakes. I think you have to recognise that this was one of yours. Step away from it all. I wouldn't want any of this to leak onto my kids either.

You are both to blame and you have both betrayed her and yes it is unforgivable in a friendship and she has acted I think like most of us would

but is it unforgivable in a marriage - not sure a marriage is a far more complicated and intense relationship that is not quite so easy to end as just blocking and removing from groups and ignoring someone if you see them in the street. Trying to salvage and work on the marriage having cut you out is I think quite a normal response. She still could end the marriage but giving it a try makes sense

it was always going to end this way OP you must have seen thau so ask yourself why didn’t you tell her and block him and distance yiurself

This, nothing physical happened, just messages, and of course many people stay after infidelity, actual full blown physical affair, not just soppy meanderings and flirting. It’s complex to leave a marriage, especially if there are kids.

but every single person would bin the friend and have them excluded from the social group. Every single one.

op he wants his wife, not you. It was all bullshit. If he’d wanted you and not her, he’d be with you. You were an amusing ego boost. And have paid the price.

I became close to the DH of one of my good friends

This doesn't just 'happen' though, does it? It's a gradual thing, and you could have backed away at any point but you chose not to.

You don't know that he has come out of this "smelling of roses". I am sure that the mutual friends you're upset about being judged by are also judging the fuck out of him, and who knows whether the marraige will ultimately survive this. But you can't really be surprised that your friend hasn't immediately thrown her husband and the father of her kids out on the street when you couldn't even bring yourself to ignore his drunken messages!

Your biggest concern seems to be that this situation has changed others perception of you. You mention not wanting mutual friends to think badly of you, but I just don't think this is realistic. Your friend has every right to confide in other close friends after her world has been rocked by the discovery that her DH is a lying scumbag, and you can't really blame her or them if finding out changes their opinion of you. You cannot reasonably expect to have an emotional affair with your good friends husband without it impacting your social life. Yes, his betrayal was greater than yours, but that doesn't mean yours shouldn't carry any consequences.

You describe being a single mum as a "tricky card to play", which is really telling IMO. It reads like you thought it was all a game.