to think that in a functional household....

[RedWineSupernova]

.....the parent of high school age children should be up before the kids and should oversee the getting ready for school, making sure everyone is leaving on time with everything they need etc, being on hand to help with any uniform issues/anything else going wrong etc.

Not sleeping in later than DC due to having stayed up late playing video games with their mates?

Parent has normal job wfh. No shift work. No illnesses or any other issues that would mean they need to sleep in later.

AIBU?

Another perspective to this - at 16 (so a year older than OP's DD) my DS chose to do a before school job a couple of days a week where he started at 6.15am and then went straight to school. Was it lazy/"non-functional" parenting not to get up, make him eat breakfast and say goodbye pre 6am, when I wouldn't otherwise get up until 7am? (Note - if there had been any expectation of me having to do this, I would have told him he couldn't do the job).

I’m a morning person any way. But I’d always get up make sure everything is ok. Just to see them off.

She's 15, nearly an adult.

She doesn't need to see you. What you do is is nice and good for your relationship with her.

However her father will lose later as she won't have that relationship with him. She will remember he didn't get up.

She is 15 so it’s completely fine.

We are very chatty sociable folk but none of us are morning people, we rarely speak, can't shut us up rest of the time. My Mother was chirpy in the morning and fuck me I hated it. That’s a resurfaced memory this morning.

The same parents that can't be bothered to get up, are often the same ones that don't care about grades, nutrition, bed times, sleep hygiene, screen time, school attendance, completed homework, support with issues across the board. Being there as a parent of a teen can be imperative and parenting is still really very much needed.

It is not optional. In my view and indicates a culture of indifference, in my experience. I would not want that for my teens op, so I agree with you.

It's a poor example if you're in bed all day, everyday and nothing gets done yes.

Not getting up before 8 when your child goes to bed isn't lazy parenting at all - all of the other things you mentioned are valid yes(in certain circumstances) getting out of bed at the crack of dawn doesn't make you a better parent.

I guess for me it depends on what time the parent goes to bed and what time they do get up. Gaming every night can't be good for other family members/health..

One of mine gets out of bed at exactly 6.10am each school.day to regulate themselves. They get their own breakfast and read/watch their fav cartoons.

I am not getting up at 6.10 every morning. I get up between 6.45 - 7.15am Not due to gaming through the night.

They can wake me up if they need me.

At 15 she's old enough to get herself sorted out.

Honestly I think part of teaching independence is kids getting themselves organised. My 13yo is completely capable of getting themselves up and out the door on time. Uniforms and bags are organised the night before by them. The time to tell me you’ve lost your tie is not 5 minutes before you are due to leave. I’m up and about as I have primary kids/ off to work myself but high schoolers shouldn’t need “overseeing” imo.

I’ve always been up for my dc to see them off or give lifts etc and then gone on my way to work.
h however wouldn’t even think about it once they were at secondary school. He doesn’t drive so wouldn’t be offering lifts either.

From your update you aren't in a position to make changes to his household, so you can't really worry about it. I think it's a bit rubbish myself because he is choosing to do that, especially every night, but your DD will remember him not being around for her, so he's only hurting his own relationship with her by prioritising other things.

Don't give it any headspace.

I had a thread a while back asking if it was ok for me to step back and stop monitoring every aspect of my 15yos morning now she's in yr 10.

I used to make myself get up, get her up, make her breakfast, chivvy her through her morning and do everything for her.

MN opinion was to back off and let her get on with it.. so i did.

Now on this thread, apparently i'm neglectful, lazy, and ruining my relationship with her.

go figure.

Even if the child is perfectly capable and an older teen - I think it’s really nice for them to see a friendly face in the morning and know that someone cares enough them to get out of bed and just ‘be around’ ... even if they don’t actually speak.

I enjoy being up before the children and to assist them with things, even if they are capable of doing it themselves. I like the morning chit chat with them and to say goodbye properly before they set off for the day. I just can't imagine sleeping in and not having that communication and social contact with them in the mornings. My son's friend (12) is quite often left to fend for himself in the morning and as a result quite often misses his bus. Some mornings his parents are out at work before he needs to get up which can't be helped but a lot of the time they are asleep and have no clue about whether their son is up and ready or not. I think its really sad and I'm afraid I do judge them!

Once we were at high school my mum never got up for us. We'd occasionally ask for her to do our hair and end up with a very snarky mum pulling our hair a little too roughly! My mums great apart from that, honest guv.

But I didn’t want to be that kind of mum so I always get up. He's 16 and I make his breakfast and packed lunch. He can and will make his own if he has to but I like doing it - I see it as a perk of having a SAHM. Seeing yourself out just seems a bit sad and lonely. I know I’m projecting my own feelings and most teens are fine seeing themselves out the door!

My DH stands at the front door every day and waves our DS off. Last wave as DS turn the corner. It’s so cute.

You enjoy those mornings together so you do it. He obviously doesn't so doesn't bother. If he's generally a good parent and spends time with her outside the morning I think it's fine. She doesn't need a tea made for her, she doesn't need to be waved off. Sometimes it's ok if parents put themselves first.

It all depends on the context but if we're not talking about parents getting up and leaving the house early for work or working shifts, I would say it's nicer if the parent is up.

I think I'd feel that my parents didn't care if they just decided to sleep in even though I wouldn't want a parent fussing over me at 15.

Also, as I work p/t from home and my husband always leaves quite early and works very hard and full time. I'd feel a bit lazy and disrespectful if I was having a lie in in the weekday.

So I'm up before my 15/17 year olds. They get themselves up and ready, although I do tend to put out the cereal boxes etc for them and if I don't take them to school, I like to see them off.

Weekends on the other hand I'd not hesitate getting up later than my kids (though this never happens now they're teens ha ha)!

Two separate issues:

High school age children should be developing independence, so steadily diminishing support from age 11-16 - although it's nice for the parent to get up and give company, by 11, an NT child with no SEN should be capable of taking responsibility for dealing with everything they need for their day, (whether they are required to or not is a different question) and only rely on the parent for any unusual problems.

Should the parent habitually be sleeping in because they stayed up too late, and hence are demonstrating less self-discipline and responsibility than is expected of the child - No, that's a terrible example to be setting in the absence of shift work or illness.

I used to have to get myself up and out for school from the age of about 6 whilst my mum stayed in bed. She was very unreasonable, not a problem for older teens or ones who have proven themselves capable I don't think.

It's not about babying them, or checking they need help etc. It's about being present, chatting, catching up, them starting their day with some verbal communication before reaching school

Getting up with your teen and doing everything for them are not the same things - my daughter makes herself breakfast and lunch, sorts her own uniform and is in charge of getting her laundry sorted, remembers her own kit. But I sit down at the table and eat my own breakfast with her, have a chat, compliment her new hairdo she's trying out, say hi to her friend who knocks for her. I'm just present, not interfering!

Of course parents should be up to see kids off. I still make daughter (and wife) a cup of tea at 6:30 every morning, make sure she gets some breakfast, make her a packed lunch give her a kiss goodbye and tell her to drive carefully - she's 19. Ok I am soft, she can and does do everything herself when i'm away but I want her to remember the little things that parents do for when she gets to that stage. I could not be in bed when the kids were getting up, completely wrong signal. You are right.

When ds1 was at secondary I was having a really tough time with my chronic illness, which necessitated him being independent in the mornings. I know occasionally he might have preferred me to be up, but he understood that I was doing my best. He’s also now a very capable and independent adult (and we’re very close).

I don’t think it is essential but I think it is desirable. Any time you spend together is when you get incidental chat which keeps communication open and is when you start to develop a different relationship as they grow up. I would suspect that your dd might view your house as a home and your ex’s as somewhere she stays. It is him that will lose out long term as you will be her go to parent.

Im either at work before my teens get up for school so they have to sort themselves out, still at work as im on a night and get home after they left for school so they have to sort themselves out, or, im asleep in the morning when they leave as i need to catch up on all the hours sleep in down from the shifts so they have to sort themselves out.

If that makes me a non-functional shitty parent, so be it.