It's an in law one...

[inlawproblems]

First of all, I must start by saying that I love my PIL... 99% of the time.

DH has two brothers. One of them lives in the same town as us with his wife and children, and the other lives five hours away with his wife and child. We get on well with the one who lives five hours away but we haven't seen them for over a year due to the distance. They will be visiting next weekend and we are looking forward to seeing them.

Things aren't so great with my other BIL and his wife. His wife hasn't spoken to us for 18 months since our daughter was born, for a really stupid reason. He is backing his wife up but we don't think he really believes they are in the right. Before my daughter's birth we all got on well.

Literally everyone thinks they are being completely ridiculous and the thing they are upset about is utterly trivial. To avoid drip feeding, they are upset that we named our daughter a very common top 10 name which also happens to be their daughter's second middle name.

Anyway. We have invited the visiting BIL and his wife and child for Sunday lunch next weekend. We were also planning on inviting PIL.

When I mentioned this to FIL two weeks ago he said he was rather hoping that we would do something all together. I said that until BIL and SIL acknowledge how hurtful their behaviour has been and apologise to us, we don't want to have a relationship with them. FIL said they will never explain or apologise, and so I said in that case we won't be seeing them. He wants us to just let it go and play happy families. I made it very clear that doesn't work for us.

Today PIL came round for lunch and everything was normal, nobody mentioned next weekend. And then an hour or so after they'd gone home, MIL put a message on the family WhatsApp group saying they want us all to come round for cake next Saturday afternoon and Grandma will be there too.

We have not replied yet. We don't want to go. We feel that we are being strongarmed into seeing them and pretending everything is normal, when what we want is to have a discussion. (They have refused multiple requests from us to meet and talk.) PIL are banking on the fact that if we go next weekend we won't want to cause a scene in front of Grandma, or be unpleasant to SIL who is two months postpartum. (I wouldn't piss on her if she were on fire at this point but I recognise that the optics of having a go at a woman who's just had a baby in front of the entire family aren't great.) They're right about us not wanting to make a scene in those circumstances. That's why we don't want to go.

AIBU?

Thanks for reading if you made it to the end of this!

I have no idea why anyone is team SIL.

They're team SIL because it's AIBU and you aren't a 'perfect victim'. You really should have posted this on Relationships for a more balanced view.

Here, people love to give the OP a kicking, rile them up, insult them, and generally forget that this is someone's life and something the OP has been dealing with for a long time before coming on here. It's pile-on central.

Meanwhile, if SIL had showed up to post about whether she was BU for cutting off family members for using a second middle name, or for being outraged that a family member proposed three weeks before her wedding, she'd have been given an absolute kicking too. The nest of vipers is like that.

This whole thing is bat shit crazy. It's not a hill to die on. Just go to your PIL, eat cake, be polite and get on with your life. Life is too short for all this stress. You don't have to be their best buddies but equally don't have to continue with all this nonsense.

Thought it was just me thinking this!

Crikey, what a drama over a minor issue, I couldn’t get this worked up!

OP, I’d just let this go - it wont change anytime soon and over time, this will pass on to all the children involved including yours. If this was a “school mum” situation just for example, you'd surely just avoid the perpetrator for your own and your families peace of mind.

There has been zero communication between me and SIL since her passive aggressive thumbs up 18 months ago after I'd just given birth

Hang on? From what you've said she's the devil incarnate. She's vile. She's abusive to her DH. She's various other things.

And now you say you've had absolutely no communication for 18 months?? So she hasn't been vile to you? She hasn't said anything, done anything, told you anything, argued, shouted, abused. She just hasn't spoken to you?

Wow. Just leave her alone. Stop trying to demand attention from her. Leave your PIL alone. Stop causing drama and conflict. Go or don't go. But just stop going on about it now. Nobody in the family is interested in your tantrum anymore.

I can assure you, any "microaggressions" she may have perceived would have been as imaginary as the name problem.

I think I wouldn't feel so hurt about this if I didn't know perfectly well that I've always been nice to her and definitely haven't done anything to deserve this. If I'd been disinterested in the birth of her baby (even for an understandable reason, e.g. my own infertility), I wouldn't be nearly so aggrieved about her behaviour towards us. I'd consider it tit for tat.

Nobody was team SIL in the beginning. It is the vitriol the OP has shown here towards her SIL that has changed things considerably.

Literally all that was required of her was to say "congratulations" when our DD was born, come along and meet her once, keep her feelings about the name to herself, and tolerate us at the occasional family event, and she couldn't even manage that.

So what! Its not brilliant for sure but get over it! Do it for your PILs. This isn't about boundaries. You're not changing your daughter's name. It's about moving on for the sake of people you love. That's more important. You think you're showing boundaries but you're actually showing selfishness and intransigence.

I don’t think people believe that it is ok. Most would probably be concentrating more on their new baby and the people who choose and want to be there than the people who don’t.

Not particularly great what they did, but the amount of mental energy you are putting into this, the desperate need for an apology, and really trying to dripfeed about your SIL who you haven’t really seen or talked to and blame her for about everything as if you all (including your DH and his brother) aren’t grown adults with your own minds and free will is ridiculous.

You haven’t painted yourself well in this and the more you add the worse you, yourself sound. Don’t go if you choose to but remember if they show up every time his parents invite you all together and you and your husband don’t go, you and your husband will be seen as the unreasonable ones and perhaps you as bad if not worse as you are trying to paint your SIL out to be.

She's the one having a tantrum.

All I am doing is saying I don't want to go to a party with someone who has refused to acknowledge our baby daughter and has caused our whole family an enormous amount of pain.

But apparently that is unreasonable. Or not. The votes are quite split.

How much do you think I should like her after this behaviour?

I don’t really understand why they’re so bothered about you using a second middle name.

It would have been better to effectively ignore their silliness and carry on as usual, than to allow this toxicity to develop. It was a them problem that has no become a you problem.

You absolutely cannot speak for a Muslim woman and/or a woman of colour about whether she has perceived comments said to her as microggressions or not. You just can't.

I can assure you, any "microaggressions" she may have perceived would have been as imaginary as the name problem.

Ah. I see.

I disagree with it being simply because it’s AIBU - I didn’t read the whole thread but I did select read all for the OPs posts and read from beginning to end before I posted for the first time.

At the beginning I was more on the OPs side re the fall out over the name - it’s a silly reason to be so upset and angry on the surface.

But what turned me from YANBU to YABVVU - is the OPs own words to describe how she and her DH have escalated the initial incident and despite claims to the contrary - there has been animosity and disapproval / dislike of SIL since before the poor woman married into this family.

No, it's because OP accuses SIL of being vile and abusive etc and then goes on to use some pretty vile and abusive language towards SIL herself.

Plenty of people come to AIBU and get a huge majority of people telling them they are not

In this instance OP most certainly is being unreasonable. She's dragging on a situation longer than it needs to be and dragging more people in to it than necessary.

Oh, jeez.

So now you're implying I must be racist.

We are properly down the rabbit hole now.

Everyone welcomed her into the family with open arms.

After all this time I totally understand SIL not wanting to talk to you either. She probably thinks you are as batshit as you think she is !

some of the responses on this thread - while well meaning- expose the lack of understanding many people have about this type of person.

SIL sounds like a shit stirring narcissist. I know that term gets thrown around a lot, but her behaviour exposes a lot of behaviour which shows someone whose sole purpose is to create discord.

The sense of entitlement- middle name exclusivity.
the silent treatment- it’s gas lighting. She didn’t express her upset to Op then cut off ties -She sulked for 6 months, leaving them to guess. The aim was to cause confusion and upset.
Triangulation- setting people against each other, as she has done with BIL and his family.

being the target of this is very stressful. It doesn’t help when people around you don’t show strong boundaries around someone like this.

OP- your PIL are being rather weak around her. But I can see why they don’t want to alienate their son.

Would it help if they at least validated that they know you are in the right and she is in the wrong? Why don’t you have this discussion with them?

having someone like this in a family is bad news. It never improves and there’s no point wasting energy on her, but I’d recommend that you take the power back.

That would involve not being drawn on her behaviour. Go to the meal, but largely ignore her.

All of this STARTED with her decision not to talk to us.

They swear blind there is no other reason for it than the name thing and we have to take their word for it.

*You can put some distance between yourself and someone else without being inexcusably rude towards your in laws and letting your spiteful and petty behaviour undermine your husband and children's relationship with their relatives.

Literally all that was required of her was to say "congratulations" when our DD was born, come along and meet her once, keep her feelings about the name to herself, and tolerate us at the occasional family event, and she couldn't even manage that.*

I have a feeling that this all runs way, way deeper than a name and I'd like to hear SIL's side of the story!
Oh and spiteful and petty behaviour? I suggest you go and take a look in the mirror!

This is like when couples have split up and then their child gets married or whatever and they say, AS ADULTS, that they can't possibly be in the same room. It's immature and pathetic. It's a couple of hours (could be less) once or twice a year! You don't need to be best buddies!

Oh and I can't imagine SIL or BIL would cause any kind of scene at the gathering (if you go) because I expect they'll be busy with their young children! Unless of course you carry on with your insistence of an apology. Maybe they're pretty pissed off that you haven't provided one for the obvious hurt that you've caused them?

Works both ways

I too would love to hear her side of the story.

Unfortunately she's not telling and we have to draw our own conclusions from that.

The conclusion being that this is a her problem, not an us problem.

Oh and we have apologised for inadvertently upsetting them, which is far more than they deserve in the circumstances. They did not even acknowledge it.

Oh really…

You already mentioned you thought they got married too quickly

And your first thought when you noticed they weren’t accepting any of your invitations was that they were probably getting a divorce.

@inlawproblems yes, but you are persistent in refusing to attend anything while they are there. It's going to spoil the weekend with all 3 siblings together, and while you will say that's her fault, it's also on you. You could attend and either ignore her or be polite and give her the opportunity to respond kindly. Or not. But that would be down to her