To say a massive well done to the people of France...

[MrsBennetsPoorNerves]

For telling the far right National Rally to fuck off to the far side of fuck!!!

So relieved!

All this post- rationalisation of the FPTP system, didn’t see Clacton on Sea protesting about the wrongs of the electoral system prior to the election! The Labour government has a mandate to govern, PR is destabilising and nothing can get done!

Oh I'm not massively opposed to FPTP or anything, it does avoid a lot of issues with the tail wagging the dog in coalitions or just general parliamentary gridlock. I'm just saying that Labour's victory in terms of seat numbers doesn't equate to the majority of the population being all starry-eyed about them.

I do love how the left always said that the Tories were a minority government if you count votes cast. Now it’s all v different, natch!

I do think Labour has a v firm mandate, but then I thought that about all the previous Tory governments with significant majorities.

We French know what fascism look like. There are people, my mother/ aunt/ other family members who remember what it was like to live under the German occupation.
Do you know anything about the history of the RN movement? I suggest you read about it. Le Pen (father and daughter) are far right. Their policies are racist/divisive and repugnant to a lot of French people.
I also advise you to read about socialism because it appears that you do not know what it is.
I have never met a right-wing fascist, and I have never witnessed a right-wing march or demonstration.
You have never heard of the EDL? Where do you live?
People casually throw these words and phrases around without really considering what they mean.
You mean like you throwing the term "woke" as an insult. I prefer to be woke than being far right. You obviously don't.

Well done France.

Although the lack of a majority will cause them problems.

Hardly, this is just in your own head I’m afraid, I didn’t vote for Labour but I’m glad they won the overall majority! I think FPTP advantages outweigh those of the advantages of PR. If the Clegg/Cameron coalition was an insight into what PR looks like, I think it would be a resounding failure- deadlock and vetoing each other, not great for a country’s success IMO!

I think it distils down to this: If you have bought into the idea that Marine Le Pen is basically Hitler reincarnate, then you have to face facts that Macron has now enabled Stalin to wrangle the steering wheel from his hands, and that's what you are so cock-a-hoop and relieved about.

It's no good insisting that everything about the RN is wrong while conveniently ignoring the malevolent forces in this alliance, naively and optimistically being described as 'broadly left' by some, and the catastrophic economic and social repercussions that will arise from it. That's just wishful thinking. You can't have it both ways. Choose your poison.

That’s clearly from the heart, informed and rather moving in light of what France suffered in WWII.

But it would be exactly what many states around Europe would say about Soviet occupation. Socialism is not a harmless thing when the interests of the Party produce suppression, torture and killing. Which is easier to fall into than many on the left will admit.

It’s perfectly sensible greatly to fear the far left and the far right. The trouble that Western Europe has always suffered is that the far right is correctly understood as bad but the far left isn’t.

What are you talking about? I didn’t say anything about PR, which I strongly oppose.

@TwigletsAndRadishes completely agree with you, I was so shocked to see the consensus on this thread that this is a good result for France. As far as I can see it’s a view confined to Mumsnet.

It’s amazing how all people seem to care about is the “far right” being defeated.

Then you don't understand how the French system works. We have, as a nation, always done this. It is called uniting against a common threat to our values.

I think the fact they had to gerrymander the vote in France to blunt the RN is scary. It may have solved the immediate political crisis but it does nothing about the reasons why people voted the way they did.

France is not well integrated. I see this with DH’s family. DH is an Algerian immigrant to the UK and has family in France. The middle class family members who are not outwardly religious (no hijab etc) are comfortable. The more working class ones are far more isolated in the banlieue where there seemed to be a lot less integration.

There is a real problem to solve that goes far beyond politics.

It's weird isn't it final celery.. Why is the far left so poorly understood and not equally feared?. They turned much of Europe into a giant prison camp and aside from the body count they ruined millions of lives by making them live in their ridiculous systems.

Sorry, what? ‘Western Europe’ doesn’t understand the perils of the ‘Far left’ (to use your terms of reference) aka, ‘communism’, so what was the Cold War about then if it wasn’t about defending the cause of liberty by most leaders of Western Europe - one of whom was New Labour’s Tony Blair!

@suburberphobe

"You know, there are certain demographics where hatred is justified because they’re vile, evil people and far right fascists definitely fall into that group? God forbid we begin to “tolerate” them."

So that makes 37% of the French voters vile and evil people?

Interestingly despite getting more votes than NFP or Macron the RN received less seats which regardless of what anyone thinks of RN is less than democratic.

Again, we’re you living on another planet in the 20th century, The West doesn’t understand the problems with Communism- er, ok then, you need to revisit your history books!

Oh, ok, I must have misunderstood your oh so subtle, isn’t unfair that the extreme right lost out at the British general election, if only there was another way!

@Goldenbear

"Sorry, what? ‘Western Europe’ doesn’t understand the perils of the ‘Far left’ (to use your terms of reference) aka, ‘communism’, so what was the Cold War about then if it wasn’t about defending the cause of liberty by most leaders of Western Europe - one of whom was New Labour’s Tony Blair"

Western Europe didn't have to live under Communism like Eastern Europe did and feel the daily consequences of living under a communist dictatorship.

Aside from stationing the military in Germany the general public in Western Europe felt minimal impact from the Cold War.

I also have no idea about your reference to Tony Blair who had no role in defending the "cause of liberty" during the Cold War. He only became Labour Party leader in 1994 and PM in 1997. The Cold War ended in 1989.

It would be hilarious except real lives are at stake

Same with the far left . Thats why I voted Liberal Democrat. The UK needs balance .

Why are there communist parties publicly tolerated in W European countries, some of them quite significant electorally?

Why did the allied powers need to move against the possibility of a communist Italy and Greece after WWII?

Why are there still people like Corbyn and Momentum who openly espouse far left politics without any shame? This was a man who couldn’t support the UK after Russia poisoned the Skripals! And still people on here support him - see the current thread about Corbyn’s re-election.

I’d be grateful if you’d answer my question about what you were talking about with FPTP and PR. I still can’t work out why you attacked me so rudely.

But Reform isn't far right. There are proper definitions for these things you know, we can't just make them up abitrarily. Reform may have supporters who are by definition 'far right' but the Reform party itself is not.

I didn’t say anything of the sort. I said that I regard Labour’s mandate as v strong indeed.

i just pointed out the hypocrisy of the left, who denied Tory mandates under FPTP!

Jeez and why was that, why didn’t we have to live under Communism in Western Europe because western leaders and Western Europeans could very clearly see the huge issues with the extreme left aka communism, the opposing ideologies were literally the cause of the Cold War! So the how the hell do people come to the conclusions above about the hard left not being something Western Europe is opposed.

Yes, I know when Perestroika happened thanks, although I am surprised you do when you don’t appear to understand what the Cold War was. I used Blair as an example as he is the epitome of the liberal left wing and so far removed from the dangerous left that you and other posters have lumped in together!

There really aren’t “proper definitions” for far right or left. Both are entirely subjective. There’s no such thing as the Reform party, it’s a company owned by Farage and essentially a dictatorship.