To ask what I can do to make my child ok spending time with their abusive parent

[Vinividivici]

I don't want to make my 7 year old daughter spend time with her father, who repeatedly strangled her and who (along with his wife) constantly put me down to her. She hates him and every time she sees him, she is very upset afterwards. I don't know what exactly they are doing to make her unhappy other than the obvious.

However, I don't really have any choice due to the incredibly messed up court system. In fact, I am at risk of losing her if we go to court because her dad claims she doesn't want to see him because I have alienated her from him. Apparently courts believe these things.

I already act like it's good for her to be with her dad and I don't say anything negative about him.

What else can I do?

@tearsandtiaras I'm afraid so. I think that there's a conflict between theories (and commonsense understanding of) child abuse and how child protection works in practice.

What do you mean? Theories?

Im a child protection social worker.

Fine, believe it's a lie if you want. I assure you this is true and that my life (and my child's life) has been absolute hell for a few months thanks to it.

No marks, no evidence. The word of a child that young is not trusted and it's assumed that they may be manipulated by the protective parent into telling falsehoods, ESPECIALLY when the father claims parental alienation.

Ok, well in this case the child protection social workers didn't think my daughter responded aggressively enough to defend herself. The manipulative father told them that I am a terrible person who turns my daughter against him. They then wrote a report that reported my daughter consistently describing strangulation but then they just said I should encourage contact with the father.

I so feel for you both, have been through a similar situation. But remember you are doing your best under the (very difficult) circumstances and she has a safe home with you. Just keep logging everything.

Is there anyone independent she can talk to eg a counsellor or play therapist at school, or through a DV charity?

In practical terms, make sure you get arrangements in place so you aren’t exposed to him at handovers (my ex fought tooth and nail against this - it was a huge power trip for him to come to my house!) - can she be picked up from school, or collected by a friend/relative? Or, if it’s safe for her to do so (eg no busy roads), can he be court ordered to stay in his car if collecting from you, for example?

The father can claim what the hell he likes, only a court can make that finding. Stop dithering get it into court and stop contact in the interim ..until it is ordered by a court.

In reality social services don’t consider emotional abuse sufficient reason for contact to be withheld. They need to see evidence of physical harm or they will not act to protect the child.

Disclosures of emotional abuse made by children will be put to the abuser for explanation and his denials and lies are taken as truth over the clear testimony of the child. It’s his word against theirs and he is always believed.

Then he punishes the child for telling what has happened and so the child learns that it’s better not to tell anyone when “daddy is bad to me” - because mummy can’t make it stop, no one else will believe it and they will just get into more trouble with daddy.

Lots of assumptions and sweeping generalisations on this thread about what the court might do

If you genuinely don't think your child is safe, and there's no court order allowing contact, then you could withhold contact, at least for now

But if she continues to go, you could discuss strategies eg if X happens again, tell his wife immediately and tell school the next day

Some of you seem very slow to grasp what’s happening here. You keep saying things like

“ Surely your Dd has told teachers / social workers etc ? If she does , then of course they will believe her. “

The child HAS told people. But they don’t see that as proof that the father is an abuser . They see that as proof that the MOTHER is abusive, because she has planted these false ideas in her child’s head.

And they have LOTS of proof that they are lies

1. there is no physical injury to child as observed by a social worker . But of course if the mother takes the child to hospital , that in itself will be abuse / manipulating the child / wasting NHS time / Münchausen’s syndrome by proxy .
2. the father said it didn’t happen and he is much more plausible because he is male, rich and charming. And of course he’s not anxious , scared and angry like the mother, which proves he’s right.
3. the child says she doesn’t want to get daddy into trouble . Which is the smart thing to say because she knows she will be left alone with him to face his anger.
4. the child says that she still wants to see daddy. Because of course she loves him - most children love their abusive parent.

On top of this, they have lots of proof that the father is a Good Parent and the mother is a Bad Parent.

1. The father is willing for the child to see the mother but not the other way around.
2. The father tells the social workers / the system how great they are and how much he appreciates what they are doing for him. The mother is scared and suspicious of them and thinks that they are incompetent and dangerous.

This last one is the worst crime that any parent can commit with social services. They need a VAST amount of appreciation and love. There is a great deal of evidence from enquiries that SS leave children in horrendously abusive situations because they have decided that the parent / s “ Love their children “ and are “ trying their best “ and “ making progress “ - all based in the fact that they are nice to SW and evoke their sympathy. Meanwhile the child is literally starving to death in a cot in the next room.

So the absolute cast iron proof that the OP is guilty is that she is scared, angry, doesn’t trust the system and wants to keep her child away from her ex.

Those of you who are just regular parents reading this thread in horror think that a good parent tries to protect their child. But that’s because you haven’t had the benefit of the “ expert “ training of your average area social worker 🙄 and their few weeks of lectures on child protection.

IME that’s also why the police don’t agree with much SW practice and there is a lot of conflict - because the police know that

sometimes criminals lie and are manipulative

its much more likely that someone is lying about being a perpetrator than someone else is lying about being a victim

being rich and charming doesn’t mean you are innocent

being angry and terrified doesn’t mean you are guilty

that middle class men white men are just as abusive as working class black men, they just are often more clever about it and they are more likely to be believed

men who abusive and control their partners also do it to their children because it’s NOT a relationship issue, it’s because they are abusers

the smart abusers know how to do it in ways that don’t leave visible marks

women and children are often scared of bad men at the same time as loving them

7 years olds are children and often don’t know what’s best for them

Wish I could give this post more 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
You understand the situation.
Thank you.

@J0S wow - you have said it perfectly

Everything I’ve posted is from personal experience of what court, police, GPs, social services, health visitors, and teachers actually DID.

To sum up- most looked the other way and took a serial abuser’s lies as truth over the clear testimony of two abused children in spite of a documented, undisputed long history of prior domestic abuse against the mother in the form of coercive control / emotional abuse.

In fact his history of abuse led to suspicion that the VICTIM of his prior abuse, not the perpetrator, was the dangerous parent and was guilty of parental alienation.

Unless they see broken bones and black eyes they will always give him “the benefit of the doubt”.

In fact his history of abuse led to suspicion that the VICTIM of his prior abuse, not the perpetrator, was the dangerous parent and was guilty of parental alienation.

This is absolutely chilling.

Update: the stepmother committed some obvious emotional abuse against my daughter recently.

Legal advice is to force contact anyway.

I don't understand how the system is so dysfunctional.

Have you changed solicitor to one that specialises in abuse?

@TheFormidableMrsC not yet. Haven't had time to search for or engage one.

Surely that should be your prioirty ........ keeping your daughter safe with the advice of the most approriate professionals?

Give her a break, she posted this on a Monday at 1pm so I assume the event happened at the weekend and that the Op is at work.

How many top notch sympathetic family law solicitors in the OPs town could you instruct in your coffee break ? Many employers do not let staff make personal phone calls / send emails in working hours.

Oh and it’s right in the middle of peak holiday time, when many lawyers will be on annual leave and those who are not are covering cases for colleagues.