To wonder if DP is all he seems?

[sunniedee]

Hi mumsnetters

I’ve changed my username because I’ve posted here quite a lot and have a few school mum friends on here who might recognise me. I’m very conflicted about my current DP and in need of some impartial, honest, unfiltered MN advice because it’s quite difficult / confusing to discuss this with family and friends.

I’ve been with my DP for around 9 months now but I've known of him distantly for around a year longer because of the social circles we’re in. I came out of a relationship about 11 months ago so I hadn’t really got to know DP a lot during that but we started seeing each other soon after my separation with my ex. I know this seems quite quick but during the time we’ve been together he's been absolutely lovely, he’s treated me with so much kindness and respect and we have such an amazing connection that I’ve really never felt before - I genuinely feel like we could go the distance. He has two DC’s and I have one DC. At times I can absolutely envision us having a DC together, maybe even getting married. I feel so lucky to have met him, he is soft and gentle, which is so refreshing as my previous relationship of 10 years was toxic and unpleasant.

BUT…. There’s more context to the story which plants seeds of doubt in my mind, but I feel dreadful that I'm even saying that because he really is so lovely to me.

I’ll jump into it.. his two DC’s are by two BM’s. He's currently having problems with his youngest DC’s BM. She brought social services into the picture which from what he told me seems to be an extreme measure. Without disclosing too much information (that I know), SS assessed and said no further action needed but they’ve brought in another service to offer support, which includes parenting work for him to do. From my experience of him I’m really surprised, he seems to be such a good dad, he loves his DC's and he's really been affected by this. His contact with his youngest DC has been limited during this time which he’s really struggled with. He tried to get the situation back to normal as quick as possible so we can still have time together too, any parent is entitled to their own adult time. But his ex has been offering him alternative days to have his DC (she says to fit around the reason SS were involved) and some of them work well but sometimes they would fall on occasions that we had planned to go away or spend time together so he’s ended up missing out on seeing his DC because of this. BM says that some of these days are so she can work but I don’t see why she can’t just work other days instead.

The thing is I'm aware that SS were also involved when he broke up with the BM of his eldest DC and he had to go to court for contact. From what I can gather the oldest's BM was a bit unhinged and DP ended up getting full custody. That DC now goes to her mums about 40/60. I’ve never met either BM but I’ve a couple of mutual(ish) friends with the youngest's BM who have told me she's nice, but I know break-ups can bring out the worst in people no matter how “nice" they are. He's never spoken badly about either of his ex BM’s, which I really love about him, but from what he does say it seems to be quite easy for me to read between the lines and paint the picture myself.

I’ve been feeling so awful for him to have this happen to him twice, he really doesn't deserve it. I also feel absolutely terrible for having the slightest niggle of doubt in my mind but a couple of things some friends have said keep playing over for me and I don’t know whether to listen to them or ignore them.

AIBU to think I should try to put it to the back of my mind and focus on the positive, I know people can be different in different relationships so maybe they just weren’t right for each other?

YABU - to have doubts and wonder if there's more with DP than meets the eye.

YANBU - to think DP is lovely with me so I should keep my focus on our own relationship and not pay too much mind to the rest.

EDITED: I’ve realised my post title might contradict my YABU / YANBU options, hopefully it’s not confusing but answers based on the options above would be great.

TIA!

I think it’s “baby mama” which is used in America and I assume other countries. Whether it’s PC or rude or whatnot I don’t know… perhaps someone can educate us?

I really don’t think she means birth mother, as there is no fostering/ adoption context here.

The thing is I'm aware that SS were also involved when he broke up with the BM of his eldest DC and he had to go to court for contact. From what I can gather the oldest's BM was a bit unhinged and DP ended up getting full custody.

Surely if he got full custody, the fault was not with him when SS got involved?

The other point that your post flagged up was he's not committing to days when he is supposed to see or care for his child.

I'm sure his ex can't just swap her work days around willy-nilly- so surely when he agrees to do childcare he needs to stick to that?

To clarify I haven’t encouraged him to have ‘adult time’ with me over his kids, it was just that from his perspective there were other days his DC could have stayed with him but due to this situation with SS the days altered so they happened to fall on days we’d planned stuff, and he rationalised why we should still do those plans. I’m beginning to understand how all of this sounds.

As a parent, rearrnging plans to meet the needs of your kids is, unfortuantely, par for the course. x1000 when you are living with them full time. I bet you do it all the time for yours.

I though BM was 'birth mother' (meaning his ex's.)

Maybe it's just shorthand instead of saying the ex of his child?
And there are 2 women who have had children with him?

SS assessed and said no further action needed but they’ve brought in another service to offer support, which includes parenting work for him to do.

But what exactly is 'parenting work'?

Is that how to be a better parent, or did his ex want him to give more time to his child than he was?

If he'd done anything awful, then he'd be banned/limited contact, not being encouraged to go onto a course, surely?

What's his side of it that he's told you?

Regardless of any of this, I think you're in too deep, too soon.

Your own children deserve more time and space after the break up with their father. You shouldn't be getting so heavily involved with a new man 2 months after your relationship breaking down.

Have time on your own.

Gosh - he "gets upset sometimes" when his ex has accused him of being manipulative.
Even without everything else this would be a huge red flag for me. Were you by any chance in a heated discussion or argument when this happened? or was he trying to get his own way about something unrelated?

I do sympathise with you @sunniedee Meeting a someone after a breakup can be very exciting and our feelings do tend to carry us away with them. Also the first relationship after a divorce or separation does tend to cut deep so to speak.

This guy may be all you actually see him to be - but - there are enough red flags here that you should really sit up and take notice of. Sounds like your instincts are starting to tingle. Do listen to them.

Listen to your gut.

And do NOT become BM3 under any circumstances!

My ex isn’t the greatest dad. He also has children by two exes. (All grown up now). Both his ex’s were ‘crazy’ 🤔 but not once had the SS ever been called by them or me. He may have his (many) faults but he’s a million miles from anyone ever needing to call SS. The fact they’ve been involved twice by the ex’s with your ‘lovely, gentle’ dp seems very questionable and very dodgy imho.

Which I said I totally agree it's mother. But honestly if you can give something like this so much of your time then jeez! Who friggin cares about someone saying BM 🤯

Depends what the SS said. If they found nothing worth investigating they may just feel they have to say something. Z bit like being audited, they haven't done their job unless they have a criticism. Perhaps their criticism was not enough green veg in the diet, who knows.

So let me get this right, he prioritises seeing you over his kids, which you seem to have no problem with, but you think his ex should arrange her WORK around his schedule?

Whereas he should be on beck and call to rearrange his life around his ex?
I'd go back to court and get the days fixed.

Also he has been upset at times with things his ex about him to SS. I couldn’t get the full picture but I think she might have accused him of being controlling and manipulative. Which I - currently - really don’t see in him but maybe I’ve been clouded by things if this is in fact love bombing. It devastates me to think it could be. But I came here for opinions so opinions is what I have. And I do appreciate that.

I think you should stop trying to 2nd guess what his ex's have said or done or what that means.

It's all hearsay with no proof.

You need to step back, take it slower and not be thinking of marriage and another child with a man you've known for a few months, and just out of your break up.

Slow down.

Or maybe he really was attracted to women who become vindictive?
It doesn't always have to be the guy who's the 'bad' one.

Baby mama (and daddy) is a horrible expression. To me it has negative connotations.

You will become "crazy ex bm3"
According to bm4 who is taken in
Step away from drama for your dc sake

Yes, obviously that’s exactly what I meant because there is no middle ground 🙄

No smoke without fire.

You need to put this one on the low low low burner at best. Start seeing other men.

Regardless of him (and he sounds like there is a lot more than meets the eye) you need to think if jumping into a new relationship is the best thing for your DC.

You were only single for all of 2 months.

I’m 1/3 of the way through and this is messy. 9 months does not make a DP. You have a boyfriend with two kids by two mums, social services are involved… why aren’t you running for the hills? What attracts you to this situation?

Oh OP...you've already said you were vulnerable after coming out of an abusive relationship. These abusive men just home in on their victims probably without realizing it and the victims themselves probably don't realize they are giving off subtle signals.

The facts as you told them are, this man has two failed relationships both with children in involved. Both relationships have apparently had social services involvement but unknown why. At least one of his ex's has said he is coercive and controlling, though you've not seen this side of him. He spent time with you when he was apparently supposed to be sending it with his daughter.

The first thing here is to ensure you and your daughter are safe. I'd be making sure he had no contact with my daughter this early in the relationship anyway. You could try clares law. But I think speaking directly to the the ex's would be most revealing. If you ask both of them questions and they are coming back with similar answers then you will know it's probably true. Then assuming you haven't found out anything dangerous, you ask him why each relationship failed and why social services were involved. If he entirely places blame at the ex's you will know for sure he is bad. Because most times where kids are involved people will try to make it work and mistakes are made both sides, it's rare to be entirely one persons fault...unless they are a narcissist or a cheat and in this case hed have been unlucky twice. Bit too coincidental! That niggley feeling you get is your instincts. They are telling you red flag red flag. To be honest only do the above detective work if you still think he is a worthy prize worth the effort, I think you've probably seen enough to realize he probably isn't and your instincts seem to be telling you so..I've lost count of the times I wished I trusted my instincts! The fact he is nice as pie now doesn't necessarily mean he always will be. As other have said some narcissists and abusers like to love bomb first and slowly withdraw or sometimes their masks slips. People generally present their best side early in a relationship anyway. Wishing you luck and that you and your daughter stay safe whatever you decide.

On the vast majority of mumsnet threads you get people with polar opposite opinions or people playing devil's advocate or even just suggesting possible reasons or different interpretations.

The fact that everyone here is telling you the same thing in different ways is a big, big deal.

Has 2 kids by two different women - Amber flag (to mis-quote Oscar Wilde "To lose one joint-parent may be regarded as a misfortune; to lose both looks like carelessness")

Blimey, how many women here have babies by different fathers. They must be well worth avoiding when it comes to dating

Calls them both crazy 🚩🚩🚩

Maybe they are, if one at least took him to court and lost custody and made lots of spurious complaints to SS.

Chooses to holiday with you instead of see his kids when SS have suggested he sees them 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩

If it wasn't his weekend to see them why not. If he did it this time he'd be at her beck and call, especially if she finds out he's starting a new relationship.

Thinks it's unfair that the ex wants him to have his kid so she can work 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩

Why can't she arrange her schedule around her time with the kid. They're no longer together it's not his problem. What's the betting if he asked her to look after them on his weekend she'd be straight onto SS.

I’ve been with my DP for around 9 months now
I came out of a relationship about 11 months ago
I feel so lucky to have met him
my previous relationship of 10 years was toxic and unpleasant.

^ Another set of red flags, but these are about you OP.

You've just left a relationship.
It was 'toxic and unpleasant'.
You stayed for 10 years and you have a child.
You say nothing about co-parenting with your child's parent.
Within 2 months you consider yourself to be with a new 'partner'.

You haven't had time to—
Work out how you came to be in an abusive relationship, for so long.
Do any healing.
Figure out how to make healthier choices going forward.
Transition your own child through their parents breakup.
Forge a constructive co-parenting relationship with your own Ex.

It is vanishingly unlikely that DP is a good choice. You are not 'lucky' to have met DP, you are engaging in incredibly risky behaviour and most likely repeating old patterns.

Stop avoiding your own life and your own issues by immersing yourself in the dramas of a random new guy. Focus on yourself, your own behaviour, your own child, and your own co-parenting with your own Ex.

(I'm assuming your child is with your toxic Ex, but even if from a prior relationship, your breakup is still a huge upheaval in their life).

Sounds like you want to believe he's a good man despite all the information you have that is the opposite. By coming on here to ask you know the answer it's just accepting it.

Anyone can be nice especially when they are after something from you.

I wouldn't feel comfortable being with someone who has SS on his case either.

Yes he's all he seems. A loser. Run.