To wonder if DP is all he seems?

[sunniedee]

Hi mumsnetters

I’ve changed my username because I’ve posted here quite a lot and have a few school mum friends on here who might recognise me. I’m very conflicted about my current DP and in need of some impartial, honest, unfiltered MN advice because it’s quite difficult / confusing to discuss this with family and friends.

I’ve been with my DP for around 9 months now but I've known of him distantly for around a year longer because of the social circles we’re in. I came out of a relationship about 11 months ago so I hadn’t really got to know DP a lot during that but we started seeing each other soon after my separation with my ex. I know this seems quite quick but during the time we’ve been together he's been absolutely lovely, he’s treated me with so much kindness and respect and we have such an amazing connection that I’ve really never felt before - I genuinely feel like we could go the distance. He has two DC’s and I have one DC. At times I can absolutely envision us having a DC together, maybe even getting married. I feel so lucky to have met him, he is soft and gentle, which is so refreshing as my previous relationship of 10 years was toxic and unpleasant.

BUT…. There’s more context to the story which plants seeds of doubt in my mind, but I feel dreadful that I'm even saying that because he really is so lovely to me.

I’ll jump into it.. his two DC’s are by two BM’s. He's currently having problems with his youngest DC’s BM. She brought social services into the picture which from what he told me seems to be an extreme measure. Without disclosing too much information (that I know), SS assessed and said no further action needed but they’ve brought in another service to offer support, which includes parenting work for him to do. From my experience of him I’m really surprised, he seems to be such a good dad, he loves his DC's and he's really been affected by this. His contact with his youngest DC has been limited during this time which he’s really struggled with. He tried to get the situation back to normal as quick as possible so we can still have time together too, any parent is entitled to their own adult time. But his ex has been offering him alternative days to have his DC (she says to fit around the reason SS were involved) and some of them work well but sometimes they would fall on occasions that we had planned to go away or spend time together so he’s ended up missing out on seeing his DC because of this. BM says that some of these days are so she can work but I don’t see why she can’t just work other days instead.

The thing is I'm aware that SS were also involved when he broke up with the BM of his eldest DC and he had to go to court for contact. From what I can gather the oldest's BM was a bit unhinged and DP ended up getting full custody. That DC now goes to her mums about 40/60. I’ve never met either BM but I’ve a couple of mutual(ish) friends with the youngest's BM who have told me she's nice, but I know break-ups can bring out the worst in people no matter how “nice" they are. He's never spoken badly about either of his ex BM’s, which I really love about him, but from what he does say it seems to be quite easy for me to read between the lines and paint the picture myself.

I’ve been feeling so awful for him to have this happen to him twice, he really doesn't deserve it. I also feel absolutely terrible for having the slightest niggle of doubt in my mind but a couple of things some friends have said keep playing over for me and I don’t know whether to listen to them or ignore them.

AIBU to think I should try to put it to the back of my mind and focus on the positive, I know people can be different in different relationships so maybe they just weren’t right for each other?

YABU - to have doubts and wonder if there's more with DP than meets the eye.

YANBU - to think DP is lovely with me so I should keep my focus on our own relationship and not pay too much mind to the rest.

EDITED: I’ve realised my post title might contradict my YABU / YANBU options, hopefully it’s not confusing but answers based on the options above would be great.

TIA!

Haven't said it's her problem, it's his and he really needs to address it.

Someone has already said it takes serious issues such as violence for SS to take action, given that they did take action and took the child of the mother and gave him custody it would imply he's not the violent one.

He needs to sort this out and get set access rather than access when she allows.

Ss get involved for lots of reasons. One reason (of many) in my friend’s case was when he was caught shoplifting from a posh supermarket and was arrested with his dd in tow. They both had a ride in a police car. My friend, the mum, only found out when SS contacted her about it. Dd never told her. But there were other occasions too.

I would say run. He's got lots to sort out with his two families already. I would say if his DC are badly affected, he should be prioritising them and they are children.
He is behaving his best with you possibly because he is not accountable. He could be well hiding with you.
He doesn't have 100% to devote to a third family and children.
SS involvement is not a good look. It could affect your own family if someone reports to them.
In any case, his DC should come first.

Keep him at arm's length and watch carefully. He may well be too good to be true.

Erect strong boundaries. If he respects them, fine. If not, it's a massive red flag.

At the end of the day, you are now up close and personal with this man and that is a very different perspective. You still don'tknow this man well enough to be able to decide to commit. Even if the fantasy is lovely, it's not really life.

Wishing you all the best x

BM is short for birth mum for those that were asking.

Just another example of why people with children shouldn't get involved in new relationships.

So are the they expected to live the rest of their life alone?

How to support your child whos just been exposed to an abusive relationship, and who now has a fragile mother..... obviously within an extremely short time frame, play the relationship roulette with a man who you hardly know who's as shady as fuck, with history for fucking up his own children. Your speaking as if SS involvement a casual situation that could happen to anyone. If you've no regard for yourself at least, get a grip for your child's sake. Even thinking about having another child with this man is just absolutely insane. Imagine dragging your child into a blended family with this stranger, add all the other shit in the mix and to possibly bring another child into the world with him. This is infuriating, please think of your child, responsibility and number one priority. Sorry if sounds harsh, but you need a reality check. Your friends are just too polite to say what they think!!!

He sounds like a magnet for vulnerable women (yes, I include you within this, OP).
Of course he's "lovely" with you. Give it a few years and, if you have a child with him and break up, you'll be added to the line of 'unhinged' exes, perhaps also with SS involvement.

I say the above, as a Mother of 2, who has had SS involvement because of my issues AND the Dad's. His elder children's Mum also involved SS because of his issues and the impact upon her children.

At a time when I was working with SS for the benefit of my DC, the father (whom I'd left 2 years before) was more interested in spending time with his new girlfriend than doing any work upon himself.

Because of my struggles, I have stay single and celibate for 6 years, as my priority has to be my children and what sort of guy would want to do someone with my issues? He'd have to be a walking, talking red flag (as am, frankly, I!).

Damaged people tend to attract damaged people.

Think carefully about the man that you've invited into your life (and that of your child) two months after a decade long "toxic" relationship has ended.

Ignoring many red flags for the time being....

Even if he is entirely a victim, it's just jot worth the effort and you need to put your child first. You split up woth their dad and that would be difficult for them and after less than 8 weeks you're distracting yourself woth a boyfriend. If you were single you wouldn't be worrying about any of this.

I wouldn't want to be involved with anyone who has social services involvement, bever mind it happening more than once. He is getting a parenting advice service. That costs them money. It isn't a free perk. However nice he is, it isn't worth it.

Whichever way you look at it, he's prioritised his plans with you over the chance to spend time with his DC. Social Services involvement would surely make him want to show them that his child is his first priority but he didn't do that 🤔 given what you've heard from friends, I'd be extremely suspicious that he is not all he seems. Could you contact him exes and ask if you should be concerned?

🚩🚩🚩

He has had SS involved twice

He has two unhinged exes - and this characterisation isnt backed up by other people

He chose a new girlfriend over his children

Your friends are warning you off

And gently, you are an easy target for an abuser. You’ve just got out of an abusive relationship and your confidence, self-esteem and standards will be on the floor.

So many red flags here. Walk away before you become “unhinged BM #3”

Run. 1.He chose you over his child. 2. He has children by two different mothers. And you are thinking about being no. 3. 3. Social services involved with BOTH children! Huge red flags

I was always accused of being the crazy, manipulative ex ‘BM’ to use your wording with every single new girlfriend he had. Every single time ‘he was absolutely amazing & treated them incredible’ so it was ‘clearly me being the crazy ex’. Then 6 months or so down the line I’d get an apology or something similar saying how he’d changed & how it was now clear I wasn’t the ex he made me out to be. It was all just part of the act of getting the latest girlfriend to trust him, he love bombed them, made out how he was an amazing dad or he ‘would be if only I let him’, I never stopped him. He always acted wonderful with their kids to ‘show how much of a good dad he would be’ etc etc. his latest girlfriend is working 3 jobs to keep a roof over their heads whilst suffering from cancer because he won’t work but she still thinks he’s wonderful because of how he treats her & how I’m the wicked ex. Our son is now 23 & he hasn’t seen him in about 20 years…

My concern would be that he’s live bombing you…. Grooming you as such… putting on an act to woo you… once your head over heels abusers then start slowly, to coerce and control you. The initial kindness being an act.

Mayne you need to ask to have a lok over the social services report…. There will be a paper trail stating what the accusations were and what their findings were!

Coming out of a relationship that was toxic and abusive and going so soon into another does make you vulnerable to these men who spot an injured soul and use their methods to boost their latest victim and play the white knight !!

of course he might be genuinely lovely… but there’s a few red flags and in your shoes I’d listen to my gut!

Maybe do a police check on him discretely !

OP I would urge you to go to a police station or call 101 and ask for Claire's Law disclosure. It's really simple to do and he would never find out. Bear in mind though that if it comes back fine, it doesn't mean he's a good guy. It could just mean he's never been reported to police. Lots of DV victims take considerable time before they get to point they can report it.

In terms of the two lots of social services referrals then it absolutely is a red flag. However it would be really helpful if there was a social worker reading this thread to put some context to possible reasons for involvement.

I only say this as I know someone who has SS involvement. A child said something at school and they did referral. The break up between mum and dad was not by any means amicable (it sounded like it was tit for tat) and there was a lot of mum feeding 'information' to the young child. Ss came along and advised dad not to see kids and he was losing the contact they informally had (altering weekends each and couple nights a week) whilst SS looked into it. Immediately I was suspicious and convinced that the dad was being untruthful about what was going on because social services are so strapped that they only get involved where there serious abuse. However the social services confirmed there was no order in place for him not to see child unsupervised and there was no police involvement. It baffled me and still does. Supervised contact went ahead as dad was convinced that enraging with ss and doing right things would help but two months down line the mother said child was getting upset coming to see dad so wouldn't allow contact. SS agreed (again it raised alarm bells that dad was abusive in some way) so contact was ceased. The mother moved out of the area so dad couldn't contact her and didn't know where his child was (mum moved child school too). This went on for months with dad having zero contact with child and ex. At end of it. Apparently ss said no formal Orders needed, they were happy ans apparently dad was just stressed and he low confidence in parenting (he had to do some parenting workshops). I'm the same as previous posters where I'm highly suspicious of how truthful this was and obviously the dad had done something terrible to the ex and child otherwise why would ss get involved. However a close friend of mine acted as a character reference and saw all the papers and supported the dad with ss and saw all papers and confirmed no formal orders in place, it was all an informal process and that ss suggested no contact was a precautionary measure, no legally binding (apparently if he'd ignored it and acted on parental rights to pick kid up from school before they changed school, he would have been 'going against advice of ss and shown disregard for the informal
Process' therefore deemed not taking it seriously and they'd have got a formal order) eventually ss signed it off after 6 months they were happy no issues and needed no further involvement, the dad has no idea where his kid is and no contact because of that and is getting a lawyer to help him.
It all sounds a bit wrong and incorrect to me but my friend doesn't have enough loyalty to the dad to lie about what she's seen in paperwork.

What I'm trying to say in a very long winded way is it'd be really good for a social worker to read this thread and put some Kind of context into why social services would get involved (although I stress two referrals is worrying unless the two BM are mates are in bitter cahoots with each other which I think is highly unlikely) but then if he was so bad would older children be allowed to live there? At best your new partner has a chaotic situation/ life and is it something you want to be a part of? The prioritising you rather than seeing his kids and letting BM work is a huge red flag too!

Maybe it's worth calling social services. They won't disclose anything to you but if you say you're in a relationship with him and have a child and no issues for you but you are conscious that there clearly has been allegations against him before and want to safeguard your child and make sure you're confident they will be safe around him? Ss have different disclosure to police so if there is an issue they might tell you if they think your child is at risk?

At least until the children have left home. If you have joint custody then you can have free time to yourself for sex if that's what you want.

Consider yourself in his position here...
ex hi CBM I need you to have little Fred this weekend as I'm working.
CBM I'm off with friends for a girls weekend, it's all paid for, sorry
ex you can cancel its not more important than spending time with Fred
CBM Why don't you organise childcare, it's your weekend, your responsibility.
ex so you'd rather spend time with your friends than with your son, you're a bad mother

Mumsnet is full of complaints by second wives who feel they're being put upon by the partners ex. Avoid the hassle don't get involved. How many mumsnetters are there with more than one failed relationship? Why don't we include them amongst all the red flaggers. Any woman with more than one failed relationship ought to be an automatic red flag for anyone.

Just stay single, spend time with your children and relax when they go to their dads. Avoid the hassle.

Especially when they investigate and take the child off the mum and give custody to him, he really must be a wrong un, she must be a peach.

That is your view and what you would do in the situation. In the real world, lots of adults are capable of having healthy relationships when children are involved. Some people may be happy to stay single until their children are older, that is fine. Some people would like to feel loved by a partner, that is also fine. Your view is very simplistic and pretty judgemental to be honest.

Have a lovely day!

Of course he’s being lovely with you, you’re at the love bombing stage.

The whole thing is a massive red flag.why are you even considering this man?

Baby Mother not Birth Mum!

Baby Mother refers to previous partners with man’s kids. Birth Mum is an estranged mother who for whatever reason has not raised her child/ren eg has given them up for adoption or left them.

You sound like you’ve got your own axe to grind here I’m sorry… the fact is that the OP is sufficiently concerned about her partner to ask for advice on the internet. If in her gut she believed that everything is hunkydory, would she be doing that? Irrespective of this ex or that, alarm bells are ringing and OP just needs to make sure she has her eyes wide open because she senses something is not right here. End of.

My two peneth. It is so hard to meet threshold for SS involvement, I honestly wonder what has happened.

I have also known SS place a child back with a DF, who it was previously removed from, because he was a lesser risk than the DM who's life escalated to the point the DC had to be removed her. Absolutely crazy. DF seen as the better of two evils. They were serious concerns too.

You're not long out of a long abusive relationship and have gone headfirst with the first available guy you've met. You're already fantasising marriage and a child with him - why?

You need to do Claires Law and give you and your DC some time alone without men/bf/ DP.

You also need to put your DC first. Their needs before yours and certainly before any new bf.

In all honesty the way I would look at it is that this has happened twice, there is no smoke without fire and you should trust your gut. If you have even the slightest niggle then run for the hills. There’s one thing I’ve learnt in life, it’s to trust my gut, as it’s usually right