The "terrifying threat from Labour"

[BigWordAtlas]

I know that Tory HQ staff often come on here and post, and will be doing even more so at the moment.

I also know that Kier Starmer has done a terrible job in gender critical thinking, and members like him, Rayner and Lammy are currently an absolute shitshow when it comes to the rights and protections of women and children. I'm not looking forward to the battle we'll face after the election to reverse the damage that's been done and to protect those rights, and fully bring down all the MRA policies that have formally or informally kicked in over the last few years.

But does anyone else feel like the absolute barrage on here in the last few days about the Holy Bloody Handmaid Terror that will be Labour's government is a bit... overblown? A bit Tory HQ-flavoured? They're absolutely panicking at the moment and will do any kind of astroturfing they can to chip away at votes, particularly in swing constituencies like mine.

No party is perfect, and Labour is currently far from perfect for me and my children. But realistically, I have to vote Labour where I am if I want to keep a Tory candidate out. I hate their gender ID policies, but this nail-bitten tone of total and complete apocalypse (and yes, I've heard posters use that word in this context) feels unhelpful and not really equipping anyone to improve things after the GE. They made me feel extremely anxious until I just hit a wall with the frantic language, and now I'm feeling much more pragmatic and ready to fight with Labour on this stuff, rather than against them and allowing another party to get in.

So AIBU to feel that most of these posts are at least seeded by Tory HQ, rather than actual Labour voters like me?

<hard hat donned>

This is the first one I've read that sounds a bit planted to me!

Sorry! 😂 Not guilty, but I do understand that anything expressing any party affiliation will sound that way this week.

I suppose I just like when I get so anxious I break through to cynicism, which is where I've got to this morning. Voting holding my nose, but feeling more pragmatic than I was this time last week, even.

It mostly goes over my head to be honest. I will never vote Tory, that is a given. Roll on Thursday.

I agreed with you OP. I think Labour will be boring and not do as much as they or people would want or expect, but after the shit show we’ve had from the Tories.

I remember in 2015 their scare tactics were do you want a Tory government or ‘chaos with Ed Miliband’? Chaos with Ed Miliband would have been so much better than a brexit vote with David Cameron and all of the chaos we’ve had since.

I started a private school thread under another name. People don’t actually realise or care what’s going on in many private schools (and worse they don’t bother reading it if I write it). I got called Tory HQ. I’m just a random person. I don’t know why I got called Tory HQ - just for disagreeing with a labour policy. Often on this website if you don’t worship the Labour Party, you get called Tory HQ.
FWIW I am terrified of Starmer - I don’t expect anyone to care, but I am allowed my own feelings. Didn’t vote for Bojo either. Still terrified of Starmer. But I’m not Tory HQ. If people want to call someone Tory HQ - essentially that’s troll hunting. They should report to MNHQ if they don’t think it’s a genuine mumsnetter. It one kind of troll hunting that MNHQ seem to allow - because they are pretty left leaning IMO.

I do understand that anything expressing any party affiliation will sound that way this week.

I think you've answered your own question!

Women are desperate. I have 3 young adult daughters and I know I am. Once we lose the legal definition of 'women' it's open season on the rights it's taken over 100 years to gain. This government is a corrupt clown show but once we have a leading party who define 'woman' as 'anyone who identifies as one' we've lost something it'll be very hard to reclaim.

Very true

Thanks for that, I'm sorry it happened to you. Can you say why Starmer 'terrifies' you? As I say, I'm enormously unhappy with his policies around gender ID but I'm also really uplifted by the brilliant campaigning women around the country have been doing the last few years to clarify and strengthen the (current) laws around GC. I hate the thought of what the worst of Labour could do with a supermajority, but 'terrified' is such strong language. Trump is terrifying. France's far right are terrifying. Starmer, though?

My granddad uses to say he was 'terrified' of Labour getting in under Blair (and would leave the country) - spoiler: he didn't leave, and he just didn't want his taxes going on 'things he didn't use', like schools, the NHS, Sure Start centres.

Can you explain why you're feeling "terror" at the prospect of getting the shockingly awful Tories out?

I think there's a disproportionate number of disaffected parents of private school attending children on mn, going by the sheer number of theads on here about it. Perhaps it's them.

I agree wholeheartedly with you about gender identity, and intend to lobby the new Labour government to effect change and return to some semblance of sensibility.

But Government is not about single policy politics, but the myriad of other things that affect outcomes for the vast majority of normal people out there - health, education, policing, housing etc. Women are just as badly affected by bad decisions and policies in all of these areas. The Tories have been no friend to women and children over the past 14 years.

Politics is never about 'perfect' policies to suit your beliefs and values. It's always about 'best fit'. KS will, I think, once in power, be a uniting rather than a divisive power, encouraging sensible debate and authentic understanding both of the issues facing the trans community and those facing women. The problem we have at the moment is that sensible discussion is stifled by the loudest voices - on both sides.

I'll be voting Labour. This government has been a disaster - for everybody's rights and dignity.

I think anyone earning over £50k will be pretty pissed off with the prospect of a Labour government. They make it clear time and time again that 'rich' people are their target, and by rich they simply mean high tax earners.

For me it will be the lack of incentive to do well because of the tax burden that is terrifying - when will people realise that socialism doesn't work?!

It's all a bit swivel eyed. Apparently the Tories or in some cases, Reform are going to save women from complete anhililation.

Yes, I agree with this. I was getting panic attacks as I read thread after thread about this threat, and I do think it's very real: as political commentators have said, some of these constituencies are so desperate to get a Labour member in that many of those standing are young, untested and possibly very wokey, and they could push the party in a dangerously anti-women direction.

But I also think that women have done brilliant work legally and publically countering all this nonsense, that Cass and other reports are showing the damage and hollowness of all the glittery hypocrisy, and that the public tide is turning against telling 7 year olds that they can have wrong bodies, and liking football or fancying women means you're 100% male. Starmer will learn pretty quickly that the mechanisms that actually power the country don't have much time for 'but this grown man wants to be in the Ladies', please BeKind'.

Yes, this is exactly how I'm feeling now.

I genuinely don't understand how someone can be 'terrified' of Labour but not be already terrified about the state of our Country? Judging by the kinds of threads on here the last few weeks MN has a very high amount of parents who aren't rich BTW sending kids to private schools. Or Single issue feminists.

We can't focus on 1 issue much like your post indicates, we have to go by the ones we most align with and exact change. We also have the responsibility as a nation to hold our government to account to ensure they are working in our best interests. How can we that if we vote on singular issues?

1000% Agree with your point about fighting WITH Labour on these issues.

Starmer is genuinely terrifying on the trans issue, if that is what we are talking about. He just cannot speak the truth about it. It is way worse than any of BJ's lies.

Lammy literally said the other day that men can grow a cervix

These people are horrifying. Smug, virtuous and possessed by ideology that they know what is best for everyone.

@Whatafustercluck Starmer has been lobbied for years on the trans issue - why do you think he will change his mind when he is PM?!?

It is what he believes.

Totally agree with you and often post as such. This forum ticks a lot of boxes to enable whoever to canvas opinion and plant seeds. It represents a demographic political parties are desperate to influence and anyone who doesnt think it goes on is being naive. God knows Facebook is used enough to spread crap that people eagerly gobble up. I tend to avoid these threads on MN or approach with caution.

Did you forget Transmen exist? They still have a cervix. Not everything about Trans is about Transwomen.

Just watch what Lammy said and then comment?

It's a bit simplistic to say socialism 'doesn't work'. It's a massively complex push and pull of various factors as to whether it works or not. The post-war social consensus built a free-at-the-point-of-use health service that has saved millions of lives, as well as thousands of schools, arts centres, libraries, parks and more that were open to everyone.

For many different reasons, we're still in the Thatcherite mentality of 'no such thing as society', everyone is out for themselves and whatever benefits me and my family is all I'll vote for. If anything, we should have learned that it's individualism that doesn't work and socialism is the best bet for all of us, taking the hit of what we can afford to make society fairer and better for as many as possible (the only thing that actually does reduce crime and poor health, and increases revenue, trade, creativity and good health outcomes).

But for now, the main political philosophy of the West is 'everyone else can get fucked if I can't have everything I want yesterday.'

So we’ll stick with the corrupt clown show? 🙄

You think you can give a party a mandate and then argue with them about it afterwards?

We've been flagging this issue for years. The time to apply pressure was long before the polls open not after they've won.

I respect your right to vote however you please but to congratulate women on all the campaigning we've done and then accuse us of posting on behalf of Tory HQ is really disrespectful.

Forum regular, not a Brit but facing very similar issues in our own elections. I've been reading quite a few of these threads and don't get the impression they're planted, they reflect genuine anguish. Some of us are single-issue voters, some of us aren't and also, it depends on just how starkly you perceive the party differences on issues not related to s4x and gender.

Now where I'm reasonably sure there are paid trolls at work is the Biden threads!

It is quite terrifying that Starmer refuses to work "pretty much come what may" past 6 o'clock

Sounds totes committed