To think my SIL is over the top for this?

[killingpeeve]

In short, my nephew has been found, alongside a few other boys, to be calling a girl 'butchy' butch. This is their nickname for her and they found it hilarious to call her this. SIL was called into the school by head of year. The boys got nothing but a slap on the wrist, in reality. We suspect because they're all Set 1 (top set) and still in process of doing their mocks.

SIL says this is not enough. And she is punishing my nephew by saying he isn't coming on the family holiday - Which is also the wedding of my sister.

BIL is backing her.

AIBU to think this is too much? By all means yes, the school have been to soft here as a consequence. But, surely this is too much?

It means missing his aunt getting married. She is really upset and cried on the phone to me about this.

Knowing SIL, she is very likely to follow through.

It would mean him staying with his nan. And she would continue onto the holiday as planned with BIL

High chance she will see this thread of course. But the family is really upset. It's a wedding.

Plus all the people it's going to upset.

Give over, no wedding has been ruined due to the absence of a jumped up little shit using misogynistic slurs against girls.

This punishment is unhelpful. The SIL should go back to the school and ask for further sanctions and find ways of punishing that are actually connected with the issue e.g. remove all phones and social media etc. as he isn't mature enough to use them and can't be trusted yet/ground him as he can't be trusted around this group of boys/ask a police support worker to speak to him about hate crime and seriousness of using that language/directly apologise and in writing to the girl and her family.

The holiday has nothing to do with name calling and may well cause bigger issues in the future with their relationship.

We have had a similar situation with an older boy bullying my son about his disability (I posted here about it). We had a good result: the boy was told in no uncertain terms what would be the consequences of any further name-calling (police as a hate crime etc.) and he had to apologise to my son. He realised how serious it was, why it was so wrong and he is now actually very kind to my son and they are friends.

This was a good outcome as my son saw me model what to do and how to take action and why it was important to do so, and the boy involved had the chance to change his behaviour. It could have been counterproductive to completely demonise him.

So she obviously doesn't want him going on the holiday/ to the wedding..for whatever reason
And is using this school issue as the excuse
Is she trying to punish the bride and groom in some way ,does she not get on with the bride ?

I totally agree with your SIL that a severe punishment is needed . It’s a shame that other people in your family will suffer too but I imagine other people in the girl’s family suffered knowing she was upset and being taunted like this. I fail to see any relevance to you saying they ‘fancy her like mad’ and your view that’s she’s ‘attractive’. It was a shitty thing to do regardless of their supposed feelings.
I too am a lesbian . I adore butch lesbians and they are the hottest women in the world in my opinion . However I am a femme lesbian and if someone called me butch I would be hurt.

Agree what is it with recent posts regarding dc appalling behaviour?! 'Consequences?! How awful for your dc to be given consequences, they'll be do upset and NEVER FORGIVE YOU!!' As if a consequence for shitty behaviour like this should be a fluffy hug and no supper before bed. Bonkers, but representative of parenting today!

Do you seriously not understand the difference ?

No I don’t think you can argue that one women subjected to a man’s violence is better off than another

Is he showing genuine remorse for his actions?

So you don’t understand that lesbians are also women too? So not only do they get the standard misogynistic crap, violence , lack of equality etc that straight women have to tolerate they also get a whole extra load of crap from both men and women based merely on their sexual preference ?

But I imagine it is to him really just a holiday.

to all if you adults and especially the b&g it’s a wedding but to him that’s just a day or maybe 2 of the holiday. He’s a teen lad, he’s just happy the wedding is abroad and he gets a holiday out of it.

if the wedding was in the UK and local to where he lives then his punishment wouldn’t be to miss the wedding, it would be to miss the hypothetical holiday his parents would have taken him on this summer so IMO this is appropriate punishment.

his parents know this is a major consequence and seriously puts him out, their choice of punishment shouldn’t be changed just because family are sad he’s not at the wedding.

If my son did that there would be very serious consequences for him but what your SIL is doing is punishing everyone.
Its not the severity of it thats the problem for me its the way its affecting so many other people.

I wonder if you'd be so hell-bent on minimising this boys actions if it had been an 'ordinary' holiday and nothing to do with your sister's wedding? As in, you only care because it affects you personally?

I feel for the poor girl, being bullied in this way. What do you think the effect on her is going to be, at such an impressionable age? Eating disorder, maybe? Self-esteem in the toilet, resulting in a series of unsuitable relationships? Being bullied has long-term effects. Lifelong.

You and your sister need to get a fucking grip!

Oh for gods sake at no point did I say lesbians were not women.
stop picking a fight where there isn’t one.

OP has made it perfectly clear that she realises that. She talked about the girl's looks in the context of other posters specifically inquiring about this.

Have you simply come onto this thread to be unpleasant?

I’m quite thrilled to see someone taking something like this seriously tbh. All the stuff about the family being so upset feels a bit dramatic - obviously I don’t know your family but I’m struggling to think any bride would be that bothered about a teenage nephew’s attendance, surely she’d barely notice on the day?!

Punishment is meant to make a lasting impression on the receiving end, otherwise it's not a punishment. He's 15 - taking away his "toys" (such as mobile or TV) wouldn't make him realize his mistake, and you must admit that it's a rather grave mistake that might influence other people's life.

You seem nice, but perhaps your judgement is a bit clouded by the fact that you want him so much to be in your sister's wedding. Anyway, it's too late either way. His parents cannot cancel the punishment now or he'd never take them seriously again.

You'll thank them later. It's better for him to be punished now by his parents rather than later as an adult by society.

Will you all be this vocal in undermining this boy's parents to him?

Exactly that.

This thread is getting ridiculous. Of course firm action needs to be taken on what he did. But this punishment affects way too many other people who will suffer collateral damage.

This sums it up perfectly!!

It will be ruined by, not just the absence of a much loved nephew, but by the atmosphere within the family that has been created by OP 's brother and SIL.

There are many other forms of punishment that would be appropriate, and OP knows better than you, what will spoil her sister's wedding day.

I feel it is a bit harsh however this has absolutely nothing to do with you how they parent

This.

Is the sister so dependent on her nephew attending it'll devastate her day?!

I agree with your SIL. He will think twice about being a horrible bully. Do you know the life time impact of bullying? It leads to poor self esteem, self-harm, suicide, anxiety, depression etc. This compares nothing to him missing a holiday/wedding.

He does need a severe punishment, but it should not be one which punishes his Auntie! She hasn't done anything wrong, so this feels very unfair

If it was just a holiday then yes, but a family wedding that means so much to other family members, no

Does SIL realise how upset your sister is and how much it could damage family relationships? If I were your brother I'd be gutted she was using this situation to hurt my family

Grounding and removing technology would be far more appropriate, immediate and longer lasting to him