David Tennant: women should "shut up"

[jacksonlamb]

As a (now ex) David Tennant fan I was so disappointed to hear his speech yesterday. Whilst talking about trans rights he told his audience that he wanted a world where "we wake up and Kemi Badenoch doesn't exist anymore. I don't wish ill of her, I just wish her to shut up."

(There's some devious doublespeak here: if you wish someone didn't exist, you obviously wish them ill).

But more importantly, how dare he tell women to shut up about women's rights. Yet again powerful and privileged men tell women what they are and are not allowed to say. They must shut up whilst men speak. Their views are wrong, men are right.

Anyone has the right to believe that the rights of trans people are more important than the rights of women (although I believe this is profoundly wrong). What they do not have the right to do is bully, belittle and threaten women who disagree with them; who are trying to protect their hard fought rights.

I despair.

You can only say it’s irrelevant because women got politicians to listen. It’s obvious but I get why you’re keen to move on from the success women have had.

You prefer they didn’t speak up. Then what? We would have had Self ID.

This stuff doesn’t change because everyone does as you do which is to say I don’t want this (men in female sports for example) but I’ll actively work against anyone drawing attention to it.

The minority of men / trans women probably do want to live their life, fine by me it doesn’t mean men can’t accommodate that rather than women.

They can support their own sex class, that’s more progressive as a society

I see it differently, in that's it's TW who won't leave women alone. Nobody, unless they are bigot, cares what people do in their private lives. It's when the trans issue is forced on us, it wears thin. The difference to homosexuals was that they never constantly courted attention. I believe there are many homosexuals and lesbians, who share the same frustration. Just get on with being whoever you want to be but stop the drama and aggression. More importantly, stay in your own lane. By you I don't mean you, personally.

And why is that?

Because you and others said don’t speak up?

And I wouldn’t get too complacent all those posters who think women shouldn’t speak against Self ID

Really? You post something that's not true, I explain why I know it's not true and your response isn't to do a bit of research so you can correct yourself and maybe make a pertinent point based on facts? Amazing.

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Not all TW are a threat obviously but TW as a group retain the patterns of male violence that other men have“

This is part of the problem I have. As someone falsely lumped all women together as a sisterhood, above, you are lumping all men together as the same.

As a child, I was abused by my father and my brother. Pretty much every other man I have known as an adult has been kind and gentle, my husband and son particularly. As is my daughter.

I don’t consider TW to be any more of a threat than any other person. I don’t judge anyone as part of a “group” but as an individual.

What on earth are you talking about? What have I said that's not true?

I'm deeply sorry for what you suffered as a child.

99% of all sexual abuse is committed by males. Sex is very relevant to safeguarding.

I am waiting for you to post a link to support your assertion that JK agrees that women who disagree with her should be wiped out.

Don't bother with any more of your deflections. Post the link or admit you made it up. Literally no one on here, even the posters who are anti JK Rowling, have come on here to support your assertion on what you claim JK said.

I haven't called you a liar. It's you that keeps referring to yourself as a liar in relation to your slur against JK. I suggest if that particular cap fits you should wear it. I'm sure it will suit you.

For the love of God, it’s not about being trans, it’s about being MEN. Men. However they identify. Men statistically are more of a threat, and as we don’t know which ones are harmful, all have to stay out until someone (do enlighten us if you have the answer) finds a way to tell which ones are harmful to the ones who aren’t. Most men don’t sexually assault or attack us, most do just want to live in peace, but they still don’t get to come into our spaces.

That risk does not change if a men says he’s trans or not.

And the ‘it’s like being gay back in the day’… tired old lazy trope. It’s not. Being gay doesn’t infringe on the rights of other people. Gay men, straight men, Asian men, white men, transwomen (men). The common denominator is…. They Are Men.

Just because it hasn’t affected you doesn’t mean you get to shit on the others or minimise their experiences (usually vulnerable women) whom it negatively has.

Self ID is far from irrelevant.

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ArabellaScott
99% of all sexual abuse is committed by males. Sex is very relevant to safeguarding“

Absolutely, but TW are no more of a threat than biological men. The suspicion and sometimes blatant hatred shown towards them is off the scale. Their lives are difficult enough without often unwarranted nastiness.

Haha thank you, I was just about to but I'll save myself the bother.

So you, of all people, will know the harm that can come to women and girls. A convicted rapist ends up in a female prison free to rape at will ( this has happened on multiple occasions) and the rape of women in hospital wards, in changing rooms at leisure centres. Surely after what happened to you - you will do everything possible to avoid that happening to others?

It’s not about groups - it’s about safety and protection.

AccidentallyWesAnderson

Just because it hasn’t affected you doesn’t mean you get to shit on the others or minimise their experiences (usually vulnerable women) whom it negatively has.“

I really don’t see how expressing an opinion that differs from yours is doing that. Clearly, a different way of looking at things just isn’t allowed here.

I don’t consider TW to be any more of a threat than any other person. I don’t judge anyone as part of a “group” but as an individual.

Do you consider men to be more of a threat than women?

Can you tell us where and when in the UK these frequent occasions where men are in women's prisons free to rape at will has actually happened?

And the ‘it’s like being gay back in the day’… tired old lazy trope. It’s not. Being gay doesn’t infringe on the rights of other people

It's not a "lazy trope" , it's a fair comparison.
A lot of people (not me to be clear) would and have said in the past that being gay is infringing on the rights of other people, be it by undermining family values or cheapening what marriage means for example.
This is no different. It's the exact same argument rehashed.

I have been called a liar in this post. I was told I was a lying about what Kellie-Jay Keen said.

Anyway. Out of enthusiasm for this at the moment. I've explained why I'm not able to trawl through copious amounts of twitter posts or google extensively. You either accept that or you don't. It doesn't bother me.

I very strongly believe that a middle ground, that supports both women and trans people can be found if conversation was allowed. I have experienced this happening. I don't believe that forcing trans women into mens toilets, or trans men into womens toilets will keep anyone safe. I have stood up, put effort in and made a difference and will continue to try and do so.

Why can’t men support all men in their sex class?

No matter how they present

How do you feel about men who identify as women, being given access to spaces such as prisons, refuges, rape groups, women's hospital wards, changing rooms (gym, shops, school etc), women's toilets and so on.

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Meetingofminds

So you, of all people, will know the harm that can come to women and girls. A convicted rapist ends up in a female prison free to rape at will ( this has happened on multiple occasions) and the rape of women in hospital wards, in changing rooms at leisure centres. Surely after what happened to you - you will do everything possible to avoid that happening to others?
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It’s not about groups - it’s about safety and protection“

I referred to “groups” as that’s how another poster identified TW.

Of course I know how violent men can be. I simply don’t understand the disproportionate mistrust, suspicion and downright hatred from some towards TW.

I work in the judiciary and it would not be right to list the actual prisons or the victims. However I can confirm two pregnancies were also the result, one being a female prison officer raped by a convicted sex offender that was biologically male. We have now received guidance in the courts that assessments will be done on a case by case basis. There is every chance that Labour will reverse or remove even that practice.

"Karen" White. A man put in women's prison who sexually assaulted female inmates. Happened under and because of the Tory Party. They really hate women.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-45825838.amp

Yes, we were talking about current Conservative MPs. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

There is every chance that Labour will reverse or remove even that practice.

Is there? Who is pushing for that?