To think Jewish people are the scapegoats of humanity?

[FactsNotFictionOnly]

I have not posted on the CITME board as although the current conflict is relevant, that is not the main point of this thread.

I do not mean to cause any offence to Jewish people. In fact the opposite.

IF THIS POST IS DELETED BECAUSE IT OFFENDS NON JEWISH PEOPLE, THEN PLEASE RESPOND WITH WHY YOU FIND IT OFFENSIVE BEFORE REPORTING.

I am an atheist and think all religion should be consigned to history books so have no affiliation with any faith but I found the reaction to Oct 7th shocking with almost immediate protests against Israel (the victim) in favour of the ‘freedom fighters’ (the agressors). The denials that atrocities happened, the antisemitism, horrifying comments on SM which are still allowed to stand to this day.

Never before in my life (and I’m getting on a bit) have I seen that reaction of hatred to any country that has been the victim of any kind of terrorist attack or act of war anywhere in the world. Never before have I been aware of the kind of atrocities committed in Israel on such a large scale by a neighbouring country, filmed by the perpetrators, either.

I had heard comments made about ‘the Jews’ at various stages in my life, how they run the world, the banks, the media etc but never really thought much about it or believed it.

I noticed an absolutely blatant lie that popped up on SM yesterday with thousands of comments agreeing with the poster so I responded (never normally do) saying so with evidence and the abuse I got was unbelievable.

That made me do a bit more research on the persecution of Jewish people through history and I was pretty shocked that they were blamed for the death of Jesus, murdering Christian children as sacrifices to be baked into flatbreads, the Black Death, World War 1, 9/11, Covid. All totally false and a lot of the time because it was a way of debtors not paying money they owed to the Jewish people who were the world’s money lenders as it was prohibited in Christianity and Islam and Jewish people were prohibited from other work.

Each time they were blamed for something whole communities were burned to death or had to flee. They were banished from England in the 12th century as well as lots of other European countries. Now I understand why there is so much hatred from the UK and Europeans as these ‘legends’ persist.

Of course in the Middle East from 586 BC they were persecuted where they were killed, forced to convert to Christianity (or pretend to to stay alive) before Islam took over, treated as 2nd class citizens, subject to high taxes and strict rules, regular pogroms and were also forced to leave their homes in their hundreds of thousands.

This was all before a return to Israel was even a thing so there was no ‘Zionism’ then which is currently the excuse for the widespread hatred of Jewish people.

Even before this current conflict there seems to have been a deliberate misunderstanding of the situation in the Middle East with a lot of relevant history missed out out.

Such as the Ottoman Empire ruled the area directly before the Mandate of Palestine and they referred to it as Southern Syria. There were no Palestinians only Arabs. Why didn’t they ‘freedom fight’ the Ottomans for their own State as surely they were occupied under the Ottomans too if they believe the land is all theirs?

I have never seen references to Palestinians being ‘occupied’ by the British either. Weird as they believe the land is theirs and always was theirs - from the River to the Sea.

Why do a lot of people ignore the constant terrorist attacks as the reason why not only Israel, but Egypt too, had to blockade Gaza after a terrorist group with a known mandate to annihilate Israel and kill Jews was elected to govern it by it’s citizens?

Why are people not understanding that this war is not a ‘normal’ war with normal rules of engagement between two uniformed military forces where civilians are afforded protection by their government, military hardware, munitions and bases are placed outside of civilian areas and civilians including children are not involved in military action by firing rockets, RPGs, shootings, stabbings, throwing IEDs, holding hostages in their homes and taking part in barbaric murders, rapes, burning people including children alive and taking hostages?

It is absolutely horrific that civilians have been killed in such a high number or at all but a lot of the deaths can be explained as above and are all due to the war Hamas started.

Why are Hamas not being publicly pressured by Palestinian protestors to give themselves up?

The only (and tiny) Jewish State in the world is now even being persecuted for defending itself against massive neighbouring states who want to wipe it out.

Has there ever been such a forensic examination of any other war while in progress as in this one?

The propaganda and false information circulating before and during this conflict has made it all too clear to see how the Holocaust happened and it’s terrifying to see. I used to watch films on the subject and wonder how could so many people have stood by and let it happen. Now we can all see how.

How can a tiny race of 1% of the population who have achieved more than any other race alive today, be so hated.

Is it jealousy of their success or the hundreds of years of lies that have been brainwashed down generations?

AIBU?

https://www.historytoday.com/archive/why-were-jews-persecuted

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews

Does she know why they unfollowed her? I have unfollowed many people over the years because of the things they were posting 🤷‍♀️

I unfollowed a Jewish friend recently, not because she is Jewish, we've been friends for years, but because she's been posting the most hateful propaganda that was actually making me really upset. I would be mortified if she thought it was because she was Jewish. To unfollow someone does not always mean that I don't want that person in my life, but that I can't look at their posts. I've unfriended some people on Facebook, who I love dearly, but I can't read their posts. We laugh about it when we get together though.

I don't minimise antisemitism, and I find it weird that you're so comfortable throwing these accusations around.

I haven't been helping her personally, no. She didn't say anything about receiving abuse, so I wouldn't presume she was.

Did you ask your friend at any point if she was ok?

Why would I? She gave no inclination that anything is wrong. We dont have that kind of friendship. She didn't reach out to me when I was actually attacked. I just used the example of unfollowing someone because of what she posted.

Well said!!! I find op's post offensive in its ignorance. And I wonder if they realise that the stuff they say about Jewish people being inordinately successful is in itself an anti semitic trope.

This is so odd. Should I reach out to Ben Gvir and co and completely ignore the hateful, bloodthirsty bile they have spewed, simply because he is Jewish and might be facing antisemitism? By this reasoning, Jewishness and possible discrimination takes precedence over everything else and they shouldn't be held accountable for anything?

Unfortunately this person is just trying to minimise, deflect and attack anyone who might like to intelligently point out what’s going on with modern day anti Jewish hatred. There’s always someone who throws this in response to David baddiel to deflect any attention to his well put together argument. Don’t feed the trolls.

That's a bit of a leap.

From what the poster said, its not.

Poster 1: I unfollowed my (Jewish) friend because she was spouting hateful rubbish.
Poster 2: What support have you offered her regarding antisemitism?

This logic indicates that not only should the OP ignore unsavoury behaviour, but the OP is somehow responsible for the friend's unsavoury ideas, by not centering her Jewishness and subsequent possible antisemitism. It could be said of any minority, and it's still wrong.

some posters seem to love to derail this thread.

Nobody reasonable would expect you to contact a guy thousands of miles from you who you don't even know. It's not that hard.

Now if it turns out he's your brother in law or something, that would be different.

Absolutely this! 🇪🇭

@HelenHen I don't see regular protests in Britain against Russia or China, however there are regular pro Palestinian marches in the major British cities. What good are they doing apart from causing disturbances and hassle for ordinary people trying to get through daily life. They also add to the threat of violence and aggression against Jewish people in Britain who don't deserve any of the antisemitic hatred that they are currently experiencing.
You mentioned a common enemy. Who do you think it is? I suspect I know the answer.

The real enemies are Netanyahu, who seems to be screwing his own people over, and the leaders of Hamas, who are doing the same thing.

They are putting lots of pressure on Israel to calm down a bit, and on each government to try to push for peace. You choose to ignore that, but there's no doubt that the protests have been effective.

My comment was in response to the poster minimising anti-Semitism. It's a pretty upsetting thing to see on a thread about anti-Semitism, don't you think? People denying the seriousness of it? So I wanted to know if she's the same in real life too or if she saves it for anonymous forums.

Yes, you do minimise anti-Semitism. Remember when you said just last night that it's no different from all other forms of hatred and therefore you don't understand why we're talking about it?

Where did I say I don't understand why you're talking about it?

And honestly, do you think any form of hatred is more hateful than another? Do you think me being attacked for my nationality was somehow better than someone being punched in the face for being Jewish? Why do you think other forms of hate don't feel as bad as antisemitism?

Yes antisemitism is disgusting... and so are all forms of hate and racism. Am I wrong?

You're "all lives matter"ing anti-Semitism. Again.

So I'm wrong then?

You're wrong to insist on talking about it on a thread about anti-Semitism, yes.

Why don't you both just admit you hate Jews?

This.

It's good of you to show your support for the Palestinian people by posting the flag of the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic, currently under occupation by Morocco.