To have yelled and sworn at DS 12 for 20 minutes non stop in the car

[Lavatera]

Help.
I think I'm going mad and I've damaged my precious DS 12.
I haven't slept all night and I can't stop thinking that the baby I fell so in love with 12 years ago has been yelled and sworn at by me 12 years later.
I feel so, so sad, I don't know what to do with myself.
Yesterday, we had to drive to a town 50 minutes away to see a theatre production.
It was a special treat for my DD's (10) birthday present.
The performance started at 6pm so I knew we'd be driving through rush hour traffic, and the A roads between where we live and this town are well known to be hell at rush hour.
I really wanted to arrive early, in time to find parking, pay on the parking meter, and get to the theatre with enough to sit and have drinks together before going in to the performance. Not to mention I paid a fortune for a family ticket, but it was a show that DD really wanted to see.
So I'd spent 2 days telling DS that he must absolutely make sure that he was ready to walk out of the house at the time I'd set, I told him the time we needed to leave, and I reminded him at regular intervals.
On top of that, I was prompting him an hour before to start getting ready, 45 mins before, 30 mins before, 15 mins before.....he kept telling me I was overestimating the travel time because he'd checked his phone and seen it was only a 35 minute drive. No, I said, that's wrong, it takes 50 minutes, plus it's rush hour so we need to add extra time, plus I need to allow time to park and pay, and I want to arrive ahead of the show starting. I explained to him it was a special evening out and that he must be ready on time.
Nope. He was wasn't ready to leave. I mean by this point I was tailgating him around the house telling him to get dressed, get ready, etc.
So the time came to leave, me and DD had been ready for ages, I'd sent DS upstairs to get dressed, but DS still wasn't dressed, hair not brushed, shoes not on, at the time we had to leave.
Turns out that instead of going upstairs to get dressed and brush his hair like I'd asked him repeatedly to do, he'd decided to ho and sit on the toilet for 30 minutes 'in case he needed to go whilst at the theatre' and he walked out of the bathroom completely not ready.
I started stressing, I knew what the roads would be like, I ended up physically putting his clothes in his hands and telling him to dress, I brushed his hair, he was arguing at me to 'calm down' because I was annoyed by this point. It took him ages then faffing around, before we eventually got in the car 35 minutes later than the time I'd set.
We set off, and I lost it with him. I knew the tailbacks we'd face on the roads and I just developed this irrational anger. I shouted and shouted and shouted. And swore. Oh my God. I was shouting "YOU'RE SO SELFISH! YOU'VE MADE US LATE! YOU'VE RUINED THE EVENING! WE'RE GOUNG TO MISS THE SHOW! THEY WON'T LET US IN IF WE ARRIVE LATE! WE'RE FUCKING LAAAAAATE! LOOK AT THE FUCKING TRAFFIC!!!!! WHY HAVE YOU DONE THIS????" Honestly, I was like a woman possessed. I could not stop shouting. And I didn't stop raging for 20 full minutes. I was shouting so loud he had his fingers in his ears. DD was upset by my shouting.
I can't believe I shouted and swore like that.
For background, he makes us late for almost every single thing we ever have to be on time for. He's made us late for so many important events by just not listening to all my instructions and prompts and motivation and chivvying him along.....nothing, literally nothing works to get him out the house on time. Not even the threat of school detentions when he can't get ready even with my help in time in the mornings.
Christmas. I cannot believe I shouted for 20 mins and swore at my darling boy in a moving vehicle that he couldn't get out of so he couldn't walk away from me.
And upset DD in the process.
So the traffic was gridlock.
We arrived late, missed the start of the show, they let us in but wouldn't let us sit in our seats, they stuck us at the back in staff seats where we couldn't see very well (I'd bought prime position front central seats, I could see them sitting empty), and we all had a miserable evening.

He behaved disgracefully…can’t think where he gets that from.

Google "maternal rage". It's a thing.

I sympathise op I have lost it completely with my ds on a few occasions. The one I recall most was when primary aged ds refused to eat his home cooked dinner again. After years of food battles I lost my temper and threw the plate against the wall. I was out of order but it was from a place of fear and frustration. Ds is a know-it-all, with no sense of authority and very rigid thinking but he has a diagnosis of Autism. I did not know why he behaved as he did at the time when I threw his plate and lost my shit of course.

He would never make us late in the way described in your op, as he does what he is asked to do as long as he is properly prepared (unexpected trips don't go well).

But the arguing back sometimes happens as ds does not hold back if he thinks something is wrong, factually or he perceives an injustice. That did not always make him popular with teachers. What you described could be anxiety playing out but it would have to be present in his interactions with all adults/ figures of authority to be a sign of neurodiversity.

Ds doesn't recognise hierarchy the same way a neurotypical person does and that makes life difficult sometimes but it can also make him a powerful self advocate. He is very polite and formal when he challenges authority which helps.

Only you can know where the issue with your ds respecting your time and authority comes from. He needs to understand you are in charge and that there are consequences to his actions. If there is more to it than adolescent defiance then you may need different strategies.

With ds we talk a lot and discuss all important decisions. He is a young adult at uni now so it is a evolving relationship and he has much more autonomy. When he was little I learned to choose my battles and we found a way forward.

Good luck.

Don't beat yourself up.

Maybe now, he has learnt to do as he is asked.

But next time, leave him behind. Make it clear to him that his selfishness will only be allowed to impact him. I'd have left him at home, enjoyed the show with DD and then taken her for a lovely meal afterwards.

His actions have consequences. Tough love.

Well, I can understand being angry, but I don't think that ranting for an extended period and upsetting both dc was ideal, and maybe it would be good to think of some strategies to avoid a repeat, both in terms of managing your ds and in terms of managing your emotions.

I don't think you should entirely blame your ds for ruining your dad's birthday, it sounds like you have a fair amount to do with it too.

So you would just sit calmly in a traffic jam knowing that you would possibly miss the first half of a show which was your daughter’s expensive birthday treat when it was DELIBERATE??
And…. This comes after an hour of stressful chivvying?
Hopefully it will have shocked him enough that he feels ashamed of himself

I wondered that about the toilet thing. Sitting on the bog for half an hour when you don't need to go is pretty weird.

Or was he sitting on the bog playing on his phone? You hear of a lot of people whose husbands do that on here.

Being habitually late is very rude imo. It's showing that you think your time is more important than the time of those you are keeping waiting. Of course, stuff goes wrong from time to time, with traffic, cancelled trains and the like but some people do it all the time. (I had a friend in my teens who used to leave his house at the time we were supposed to be meeting, and not allow any travelling time. He was always late, and in the end we stopped inviting him to anything that was time critical.)

Hopefully, he'll have learned his lesson from this.

Honestly, I think you should have left him at home since he wasn't ready. In your dd eyes it was probably you who ruined the evening. I get you were frustrated and a lot of people are saying it is understandable but I don't see it as okay at all.

Your ds sounds like an arrogant little brat. I would have been just as cross.

@Girlofyourdreams yes I do. And can honestly say that I have never / would never lose the plot and shout at them for 20 mins

I find it worrying that so many responses are minimising / condoning OP's behaviour

There's a huge difference between not 'sitting calmly' and completely losing your shit to the extent of uncontrolled shouting and swearing for 20 mins.

I don't blame you at all.

I would exclude him from any outings for a while, get a babysitter for him.

When you are ready to include him on an outing that he wants to attend give him notice that if he's not ready by whatever time you WILL leave him behind. And do it.

You mucked up long ago by enabling this behaviour and giving him so much power he ignored your requests as he knew better. Honestly hope you do more yelling and less enabling or he's going to be a horrible man, boyfriend, husband and father. You really don't need anyone telling you otherwise

I agree with all the other posters who are saying not to be too hard on yourself. Yes, the reaction wasn’t ideal but no one is perfect and your DS was so so so selfish in his behaviour. I hope he takes it on board and changes. I would sit down with him separately to talk about it, and address this behaviour pattern when you are feeling calm.

12 is old enough to learn that if you play stupid games you win stupid prizes

Same! OP recognises clearly that her behaviour was disproportionate and out of control so why are others excusing it? None of them would accept being on the receiving end.

I think you did emotionally abuse your child here and it's not acceptable, whatever happened. I also think he could have anxiety.

Nothing but sympathy and understanding here OP. I would punish him severely for this. I would have absolutely left him behind.

If he has form for this then you are going to have to have different tactics, e.g. tell him you are leaving 30 minutes before your actual departure time.

Is he like this at school or with his friends? Is ADHD a possibility?

Emotional abuse? Have a day off.

Why can't parents show anger? It's an emotion that all humans have. You don't suddenly lose all "negative" emotions when you have children.

Her son was behaving appallingly, and whilst she should apologise for swearing, she shouldn't be apologising for having an outburst caused by his selfishness that ultimately ruined his sisters birthday treat. You fuck around, you find out.

Finally, if a husband did this to his wife, and said wife was fucking about making everyone late, I would bet the responses would've been scathing because the wife is behaving like an entitled princess.

Haven't read the whole thread but one thing struck me.

he kept telling me I was overestimating the travel time because he'd checked his phone and seen it was only a 35 minute drive.
Why are you letting him tell you that you are wrong. He is 12. He doesn't drive. He has zero experience of planning such a route. You gave him too much power at the beginning, why?

He deliberately set out to ruin DDs birthday treat, does he usually ruin things when he isn't the centre of attention ? Is he ever late for things he wants to do?

Based on your OP only it sounds like you have spoilt him and now the adult/child dynamics are the opposite of what they should be. What was his punishment for deliberately not getting ready, for deliberately arguing with you, for deliberately being rude, mean and spiteful to DD to ruin her special event? Do you ever give him punishments? Need to see your answers before anyone can advise properly tbh. But you were not wrong to have a go at him, it sounded long overdue.

I've been there and tried to learn from it. I get very anxious when late and if that combines with PMT I now need to take myself off for a scream.

In future though I'd just either get him in the car with no shoes or leave him. You can leave them at 12, right?

This. Minus the swearing - but, look, most of us born in the 60s know exactly what we would have got from parents if we’d done this and spoiled a sibling’s treat - and it would have been a lot worse than shouting.

Id apologise for the shouting and swearing but make it very clear that he is in massive trouble for what he did.

Leave him at home next time.

I would have had an absolute meltdown too.

I can feel your anxiety, rage and frustration just pouring out. The degree of planning, the sheer mental load, the micromanaging and nagging a child who was seemingly determined to fuck up your plans precisely because you were putting demands upon him… well I can imagine all of that happening in my house. I’m autistic and so are my kids and it can be a very tricky situation when we trigger each other, hence meltdowns.

It might not be sheer malice on his part though. You say he really really struggles with things like executive function, no matter what you do and even when he has the threat of detention hanging over him. He sounds very anxious. So do you (let’s just say it takes one to know one, because I am the same).

I can see you haven’t come back (my advice, never admit to being a less than perfect parent because MNers will tear your parenting, and your child, to shreds) but maybe you’re still reading. I can see a lot of neurodivergence in your OP because your family dynamic sounds quite a bit like mine.

@Sixpence39 it's appalling, isn't it?

Oh give over !