To have yelled and sworn at DS 12 for 20 minutes non stop in the car

[Lavatera]

Help.
I think I'm going mad and I've damaged my precious DS 12.
I haven't slept all night and I can't stop thinking that the baby I fell so in love with 12 years ago has been yelled and sworn at by me 12 years later.
I feel so, so sad, I don't know what to do with myself.
Yesterday, we had to drive to a town 50 minutes away to see a theatre production.
It was a special treat for my DD's (10) birthday present.
The performance started at 6pm so I knew we'd be driving through rush hour traffic, and the A roads between where we live and this town are well known to be hell at rush hour.
I really wanted to arrive early, in time to find parking, pay on the parking meter, and get to the theatre with enough to sit and have drinks together before going in to the performance. Not to mention I paid a fortune for a family ticket, but it was a show that DD really wanted to see.
So I'd spent 2 days telling DS that he must absolutely make sure that he was ready to walk out of the house at the time I'd set, I told him the time we needed to leave, and I reminded him at regular intervals.
On top of that, I was prompting him an hour before to start getting ready, 45 mins before, 30 mins before, 15 mins before.....he kept telling me I was overestimating the travel time because he'd checked his phone and seen it was only a 35 minute drive. No, I said, that's wrong, it takes 50 minutes, plus it's rush hour so we need to add extra time, plus I need to allow time to park and pay, and I want to arrive ahead of the show starting. I explained to him it was a special evening out and that he must be ready on time.
Nope. He was wasn't ready to leave. I mean by this point I was tailgating him around the house telling him to get dressed, get ready, etc.
So the time came to leave, me and DD had been ready for ages, I'd sent DS upstairs to get dressed, but DS still wasn't dressed, hair not brushed, shoes not on, at the time we had to leave.
Turns out that instead of going upstairs to get dressed and brush his hair like I'd asked him repeatedly to do, he'd decided to ho and sit on the toilet for 30 minutes 'in case he needed to go whilst at the theatre' and he walked out of the bathroom completely not ready.
I started stressing, I knew what the roads would be like, I ended up physically putting his clothes in his hands and telling him to dress, I brushed his hair, he was arguing at me to 'calm down' because I was annoyed by this point. It took him ages then faffing around, before we eventually got in the car 35 minutes later than the time I'd set.
We set off, and I lost it with him. I knew the tailbacks we'd face on the roads and I just developed this irrational anger. I shouted and shouted and shouted. And swore. Oh my God. I was shouting "YOU'RE SO SELFISH! YOU'VE MADE US LATE! YOU'VE RUINED THE EVENING! WE'RE GOUNG TO MISS THE SHOW! THEY WON'T LET US IN IF WE ARRIVE LATE! WE'RE FUCKING LAAAAAATE! LOOK AT THE FUCKING TRAFFIC!!!!! WHY HAVE YOU DONE THIS????" Honestly, I was like a woman possessed. I could not stop shouting. And I didn't stop raging for 20 full minutes. I was shouting so loud he had his fingers in his ears. DD was upset by my shouting.
I can't believe I shouted and swore like that.
For background, he makes us late for almost every single thing we ever have to be on time for. He's made us late for so many important events by just not listening to all my instructions and prompts and motivation and chivvying him along.....nothing, literally nothing works to get him out the house on time. Not even the threat of school detentions when he can't get ready even with my help in time in the mornings.
Christmas. I cannot believe I shouted for 20 mins and swore at my darling boy in a moving vehicle that he couldn't get out of so he couldn't walk away from me.
And upset DD in the process.
So the traffic was gridlock.
We arrived late, missed the start of the show, they let us in but wouldn't let us sit in our seats, they stuck us at the back in staff seats where we couldn't see very well (I'd bought prime position front central seats, I could see them sitting empty), and we all had a miserable evening.

Can I ask why you isn't just go without him?

He's 12, he knows full well what he's doing and selfishly ruined his sisters birthday

Yes, you didn't handle it well, but you're only human and sometimes enough is enough

You should have just left at the time you wanted to and left him behind. 12 is old enough to leave for a couple of hours. Just don't take him next time

Not ideal but completely understandable, he really did deserve a telling off and maybe he will learn his lesson now.
I would have a chat with him tonight when you've all calmed down, apologise for shouting but explain how frustrated you were and that you were right about when you needed to leave because you missed the start and that spoiled DD's birthday treat. Tell him you and his sister deserve an apology for making you late. From now on say you will be giving him a time to be ready by, if he is not ready you will leave him at home.

For background, he makes us late for almost every single thing we ever have to be on time for. He's made us late for so many important events by just not listening to all my instructions and prompts and motivation and chivvying him along.....nothing, literally nothing works to get him out the house on time.
Why did you think this time would be different? If this always happens and you still have to spend half your life 'chivvying him along' then I think it is time to admit that something is wrong. Either he is actually incapable of following instructions in which case he needs more help, or he is being obstructive in which case he needs consequences. Yelling at him for a prolonged period through an already very stressful situation is not helping anyone. Least of all, you and your other DC.

Just wanted to point something out just in case it's something that may be overlooked. The whole 30 mins in the loo just in case and delaying going has a ring of anxiety about it. I remember my brother between 12 and 16 having anxiety and panic attacks about going places. My own son also had it as a teenager.

"he'd decided to ho and sit on the toilet for 30 minutes 'in case he needed to go whilst at the theatre' and he walked out of the bathroom completely not ready."

That also stood out. Where has he learned that behaviour from? That is classic controlling male behaviour.

I would probably have been the same OP. I think we coddle teens a lot because we are so aware of the science behind their annoying traits these days, but they are still bloody annoying.

I have had a similar rant at DD for thoughtlessness. At school she is completely different and gets merits for helpfulness and being thoughtful - it's like a different person.

Don't beat yourself up about it. I think I would take him aside and say something like "Look, I am sorry for the shouting, I really lost it. Can you understand how important that was and why I was upset? I spent a lot of money and time to make that a very special event and I had told you repeatedly what I needed you to do. You do need to understand that sometimes I am in charge and listen to me if I ask you to do something. I can't give you more independence if you don't follow rules. I need to know you are responsible. Do you understand why I got so upset?" then give him a hug. You weren't in the wrong but he will appreciate a chat and you can drive the points home while explaining it in a calmer way and get his confirmation that some of it actually went in.

I learned a long time ago that your teens/young adult DC will ruin every plan for going out. Never make them central to plans unless it's for them.

You will have a LOT more of this to come so you need to find a long term solution.

It must have been awful and I remember a lot of this... 😬

It’s completely understandable to be racked with guilt after an unhinged outburst and have that horrible feeling of revealing a side of yourself which you maybe didn’t even know was there. But it’s not terrible for your children to really clearly understand that you’re human and you get stressed and that their behaviour doesn’t happen in a vacuum.

I’d bet on your son not correcting you next time about when you need to leave, but maybe you could tell him he needs to pay you back for everyone’s tickets to really bring this learning moment home.

My ds is the same and I now leave him at home. He gets an invite and if he’s not ready i leave.

Had your DS been assessed for ADHD? He sounds just like my DD (diagnosed at 15). She’s 18 now. She made us late for everything, it was so stressful. It’s still pretty bad but she understands herself more now and is better at managing time. I’m ashamed to say I’ve had those screaming fits too because it seems so selfish and so self absorbed to make the whole family late and miss things. And it’s compounded, it’s years of it so I understand how this happened to you. I also understand the guilt you feel. It’s awful. To a lesser extent DH is also like this. I used to be really angry and resentful about him as well but now I just leave without him and he can catch me up. I even do it for the airport now. It’s not fair on my other DD and me who like to be early / on time. It really brought it home to me when me and DD2 went on a city break together a couple of years ago and every event and meal we had booked, we swanned in on time, not sweaty or out of breath from running, not angry and annoyed. It was so calm and nice.

Very selfish behaviour and like a lot of young people they think they know best.

Checked the journey time and didnt take into account traffic because he is not old or experienced enough to consider the time you leave and any potential delays.

We once travelling to Heathrow which is 70 miles from us. DT said he had checked the journey time and unbeknown to us had 'looked it up' and presumed that it would take just over an hour. He made us all later than I would like with his faffing and trying to make a point. We had an issue with traffic, the parking attendant for our Meet and Greet disappeared off the face of the earth and the company had to send someone over from another Terminal delaying us even more and we got stuck at security because DT had stuff a bottle of cologne over 100 ml into his rucksack so we had to run to the gate and were the last people on. Never do I want to do that again and ranted at him on the plane that if we didnt leave home at the agreed time we would literally leave him behind.

He actually started arguing back saying that he had read that the whole party needed to be there to check in but I said I would say he was sick and could they class him as a 'No Show'.

If he struggles with latenesses generally try to teach him some stratagies - to do list, doing things in same order.

If it's a case of he doesn't care then don't pander to him you leave at the time agreed. If he's in his uniform or not got his shoes on it's his Choice or if he's capable leave him behind.

Also start issuing consequences for rudeness/not doing as told. Rather than ranting at him tell him he loses his phone and other tech for three days.

Apologise for swearing and stop nagging him. Tell him once, remind him on the day then let him make a choice

I would hazard a guess all these "sit him down and explain" suggestions have been done to death before with your son.

I don't think you did something wrong losing the plot with him. He deserved that. And the arrogance of thinking he knows better than your opinion and planning.

The downside is that you feel dreadful. He is being a total arse and he did indeed ruin the evening. I'd be keeping him on the ropes for that now.

DT = Damned Twit?

I totally get snapping in the moment for a minute, but screaming and swearing at a 12yo, with a 10yo in the car as well, for 20 minutes, when neither of them could escape is far too much. Didn't it kick in when his fingers were in his ears that you had gone too far?

That's going to be your dds lasting memory of her birthday treat, so I would definitely be arranging another outing for just you and her and apologising profusely.

You know he's like this so you could have taken tech off him until he was ready, or made him stay at home, or told him a different (earlier) time, or arranged dinner first so you were in the area early.

Does he get pocket money? If so take X amount away for every 5 minutes he's late, if not then reduce his screen time by 10 mins for every 5 minutes he's late, if he goes to a club then stop that for a couple of weeks (or however long) until the tickets are paid for.

Is he able to be on time and ready for things he wants to do?

There are a million strategies that are better than locking kids in a car and screaming and swearing for 20 minutes (And one if them definitely isn't to remind him that you could have hit him a few years back so he's lucky as pp suggested) It must have been scary, especially as you were clearly not in control of your emotions and driving as well.

I get it's frustrating, I have 2 adults, 2 teens and 2 preteens. I've definitely had some less than ideal parenting in my time. But the way you handled this made everyone, including yourself, feel like shit, which is a lesson to take forward.

I did this once when a 14 year old destroyed an expensive and precious piece of sports equipment of
mine I had explicitly told them to be careful with the day before we went on holiday involving the sports equipment. Yes I was unreasonable but fuck me I was cross. Frankly think they need to learn. We are only human.

This is one of those ‘turning point’ moments. You can’t ever do that again.

Something is not working. Ask for help. Get him assessed. We have all had these Penny drop moments when we know something has to change.

This was one of them for both of you. You have to make steps towards a big change around how things are done as it’s not working for him OR ayou OR your other children.

If it was me, I’m would get an assessment first and then move on with the information you get then. Good luck x

Teenagers are sent to test our patience to the absolute limits.

It sounds like you’ve got to the point you’re fed up of repeating yourself over and over and it’s reached breaking point.

Don’t beat yourself up over it. Teenagers can be arseholes and he won’t remember this in a few weeks.

It’s not time blindness. He knows exactly what he is doing. He literally told his mum she was wrong about the time they had to
leave and he decided he’d get ready for the time he had declared was the correct time to leave.

This isn’t neurodiversity. He tells her she is wrong, that they can leave later and that’s when he gets ready for. But he is an idiot who doesn’t know better so is always wrong and always late… and the OP lets him do it.

@Rickrolypoly but she wasn’t trying to justify it. She feels terrible. Hadn’t slept etc. Surely that’s what you take from the post?

I agree with this.

I would be raging too, OP. But just to second another poster - my partner was just like this from a child until fairly recently and it always caused huge arguments. He's now been positively assessed for inattentive ADHD, and it's changed his life. For him, his inability to be on time was related to 'time-blindness', where a characteristic is to be completely optimistic/delusional about how long things take. He would also focus on an unrelated task eg. start shaving etc when we were about to leave the house. There are many other symptoms related to executive function, which have been improved by a mixture of self-knowledge about his condition, and frankly, medication.

I'm sure many will disagree with me, but if this is how he is all the time, there's a good chance he's not just being a dick (though it can look that way).

What does a 12 year old need to do to get ready? He just needs to get in the car? Clothes, hair, makeup handbag, let the cat out etc are not things he needs to think about so why the preparation.

Having said that I agree with others he should have gone to a friends house.

Just to add - the fact that he told his mum she was wrong about how long it would take doesn't mean it's not ADHD. Time blindness can extend in all directions, including to advance planning, not just in the moment.