To have yelled and sworn at DS 12 for 20 minutes non stop in the car

[Lavatera]

Help.
I think I'm going mad and I've damaged my precious DS 12.
I haven't slept all night and I can't stop thinking that the baby I fell so in love with 12 years ago has been yelled and sworn at by me 12 years later.
I feel so, so sad, I don't know what to do with myself.
Yesterday, we had to drive to a town 50 minutes away to see a theatre production.
It was a special treat for my DD's (10) birthday present.
The performance started at 6pm so I knew we'd be driving through rush hour traffic, and the A roads between where we live and this town are well known to be hell at rush hour.
I really wanted to arrive early, in time to find parking, pay on the parking meter, and get to the theatre with enough to sit and have drinks together before going in to the performance. Not to mention I paid a fortune for a family ticket, but it was a show that DD really wanted to see.
So I'd spent 2 days telling DS that he must absolutely make sure that he was ready to walk out of the house at the time I'd set, I told him the time we needed to leave, and I reminded him at regular intervals.
On top of that, I was prompting him an hour before to start getting ready, 45 mins before, 30 mins before, 15 mins before.....he kept telling me I was overestimating the travel time because he'd checked his phone and seen it was only a 35 minute drive. No, I said, that's wrong, it takes 50 minutes, plus it's rush hour so we need to add extra time, plus I need to allow time to park and pay, and I want to arrive ahead of the show starting. I explained to him it was a special evening out and that he must be ready on time.
Nope. He was wasn't ready to leave. I mean by this point I was tailgating him around the house telling him to get dressed, get ready, etc.
So the time came to leave, me and DD had been ready for ages, I'd sent DS upstairs to get dressed, but DS still wasn't dressed, hair not brushed, shoes not on, at the time we had to leave.
Turns out that instead of going upstairs to get dressed and brush his hair like I'd asked him repeatedly to do, he'd decided to ho and sit on the toilet for 30 minutes 'in case he needed to go whilst at the theatre' and he walked out of the bathroom completely not ready.
I started stressing, I knew what the roads would be like, I ended up physically putting his clothes in his hands and telling him to dress, I brushed his hair, he was arguing at me to 'calm down' because I was annoyed by this point. It took him ages then faffing around, before we eventually got in the car 35 minutes later than the time I'd set.
We set off, and I lost it with him. I knew the tailbacks we'd face on the roads and I just developed this irrational anger. I shouted and shouted and shouted. And swore. Oh my God. I was shouting "YOU'RE SO SELFISH! YOU'VE MADE US LATE! YOU'VE RUINED THE EVENING! WE'RE GOUNG TO MISS THE SHOW! THEY WON'T LET US IN IF WE ARRIVE LATE! WE'RE FUCKING LAAAAAATE! LOOK AT THE FUCKING TRAFFIC!!!!! WHY HAVE YOU DONE THIS????" Honestly, I was like a woman possessed. I could not stop shouting. And I didn't stop raging for 20 full minutes. I was shouting so loud he had his fingers in his ears. DD was upset by my shouting.
I can't believe I shouted and swore like that.
For background, he makes us late for almost every single thing we ever have to be on time for. He's made us late for so many important events by just not listening to all my instructions and prompts and motivation and chivvying him along.....nothing, literally nothing works to get him out the house on time. Not even the threat of school detentions when he can't get ready even with my help in time in the mornings.
Christmas. I cannot believe I shouted for 20 mins and swore at my darling boy in a moving vehicle that he couldn't get out of so he couldn't walk away from me.
And upset DD in the process.
So the traffic was gridlock.
We arrived late, missed the start of the show, they let us in but wouldn't let us sit in our seats, they stuck us at the back in staff seats where we couldn't see very well (I'd bought prime position front central seats, I could see them sitting empty), and we all had a miserable evening.

Oh gosh he's really not like that though!
He's such a lovely boy ordinarily and not at all difficult in other areas of life. But he's a nightmare in this one constant feature of making me, us, everyone late for everything by not listening to the importance of us ever leaving on time!

The problem is, adults do get shouted at and need to know how to deal with the situation. You cannot hide emotions from children as they need to learn. This was a one off occurrence and, because of mum’s reaction, you’d hope it wouldn’t need to occur again. Lesson in life.

I have been there. Most of us have, probably.

I think he has learned an important lesson not to be so goddamned arrogant and selfish.

I think you have learned an important lesson that you might need to think deeply about your anger and the management of that, and if there are other triggers for that.

I say that without judgment because I have been there and for me I needed to get some counselling for stress and depression because my ability to manage my reactions was a bit flawed. In my case I also needed to get some medication support.

I’m in the you’re not being unreasonable camp. For your DD’s birthday next year leave him at home.

For anything else - school etc, he is told the time of the lift, or he has to get the bus etc by whatever time he either gets it or he doesn’t and he deals with the consequences.

I would also explain it - your job as a parent is to prepare him for life, if he misses the bus at 35 no one is bailing him out. He’s old enough to learn this.

And the screaming was a once off id be more inclined to apologise to your daughter. To your DS id apologise for only your manner of delivery and explain all the efforts you put into the evening - time, ticket price etc and now disappointing and frustrating it was for you that he ruined it. Because nothing you said was actually wrong, he was selfish, he was arrogant and assumed he knew better than you and he spoiled his younger sister’s birthday.

I was him as a child and looking back I think my parents indulged me too much. I have struggled as an adult and you will be doing your DS a favour to teach him that people don’t bail you out when you F up.

Time optimism! 😅👍

Teens are annoying. Full stop. If he didn’t have something irritating in his behaviour he wouldn’t be doing his normal process of development. Ya gotta love ‘em.

I have two 12 year old boys.
Neither would get ready most likely. If I want them ready my a certain time, I give them their clothes in a pile and stand there whilst they put them on. I then brush their hair for them and ask them to go to the loo. This is miles before I’ve got myself ready or anything else. Then they watch tv whilst I get myself ready.
honestly it hasn’t moved on much from when they were 4.
If I don’t, then I like you end up yelling, stressed and late. They get so distracted and just end up mucking around doing nothing otherwise.
been there a thousand times and I have two of them, not 1!
It’s a nightmare. I sympathise.
I have yelled like that a good many times and lost my temper. Not sworn but really yelled.
Take a breath. Talk to your DS calmly and apologise for yelling and swearing.
Come up with a better plan for future. That probably means for now, you hand him his clothes and stand there whilst he gets ready.

Just to say I agree totally - poor choices = bad behaviour. It’s quite simple. If we went on undiagnosed conditions, that would exclude everyone in the world 🤦

So this is now your opportunity to address it for once and for all. To sit him down and ask him how it felt knowing that he had caused you to be late and mess up his sister's birthday because he 'didn't think it would that busy'. He thought, aged 12, that he knew better than you, an adult, who drives and plans trips, just because Google maps told him so.

To point out that all the stress and anger it caused you, were purely as a result of him not listening. Ask him what he will do next time to prevent a further bollocking like that.

Ask him how he would feel if his sister made him late for something that mattered to him. Pre-teens and teens can be horrid, self-centered individuals who think they have all the answers. But if he is as lovely as you say, he will know this was all on him and will work to prevent it happening again.

But he's a nightmare in this one constant feature of making me, us, everyone late for everything by not listening to the importance of us ever leaving on time!

Is that because he doesn't believe that it's necessary to leave at the time he's told so then gets ready for a time of his choosing, or because he really can't get ready by a set time?

Is he late for stuff that is important to him as well?

I don't understand your whole mentality. Not your style of parenting. You are concerned at your own swearing and damaging your 'precious boy'. For 20 minutes? It takes a lot to make me shout, and I may shout one sentence, not 20 minutes. That's too long.

but you say he does this all the time so what earth are you doing? with your parenting. every time he says no it's not that, you say yes it is. We are leaving at x pm. That's it, end of, because I say so. Why aren't you parenting properly. why are you negotiating with a 12 year year-old ?

I've flipped out once or twice at the kids, and regret it greatly afterwards. All you can do now is apologise (and ask for one in return!) and try to be more controlled with your reactions. And as others have said, it was your daughter's treat and she must be very upset, so I'd be focusing on her.

However, obviously I don't know your son, but I would absolutely have left a 12 year old home alone for 4 hours if they wouldn't get themselves out of the door in time.

You need to get him assessed, OP, if his executive functioning is as bad as it sounds. How does he cope with school???

Look it's not ideal but he was thoughtless and selfish. Apologise to him but make it clear that his behaviour was the catalyst and that going forward he will be left behind if not ready within 5 mins of specified time. I lost it epically with DD a couple of times in her teens - slammed the front door so hard once the glass cracked not my finest hour
:( - it happens. We have a lovely relationship it didn't harm her - sometimes teens and adolescents benefit from a bit of shock and awe- it reminds them of their parents humanity. I remember my mum having a few major melt downs too. Be kind to yourself. ❤️

This.

Yes it wasn't ideal but you need to follow through and address this fully now once and for all.
So in future this doesnt happen and if needs be...he gets ready at 1pm and can sit on PS5 or go for a marathon poop or whatever and is ready to leave at 3.

Separately its totally unfair on your DD that
A. Your DS dicked up and ruined her birthday present
B. You created a terrible atmosphere by (understandably) going nuts.

You should provide a "makegood" outing for her that's just the 2 of you.

I have to agree. I would never treat anyone like that, no matter how annoyed I was with them and I'm honestly so shocked at the number of people saying they've done similar. My DH has never treated any of us like that either. And I wouldn't take it from either of my young adult sons (and have never had to, as they have never seen their parents behave like that so it's just not how they interact with people when they're annoyed). Neither DH or I were raised in families like that either. It's just not the type of behaviour that I've witnessed amongst my friends or family.

It's one thing raising your voice and shouting a couple of sentences so that the other person knows how angry you are, and that they pushed you too far, but there is no need at all to swear, and as for a barrage of shouting for 20 minutes with no escape for everyone around.....it does suggest an anger problem that needs sorting out pronto.

DH and I have witnessed parents in the past shouting and swearing at their family member (whether spouse or child) when out in public and on one occasion we were concerned enough for DH to intervene. We were about to call the police as the dad was outside the wife's car and was having an altercation with her through the window and trying to yank the doors open while the kids were crying terrified in the car with her and she was trying to drive off.

It just suggests someone who is totally out of control and once that happens their behaviour can be unpredictable. Who knows if the person is going to get physically violent?

What would concern me about your situation, OP, is that you admit yourself you were out of control, so your mind would not have been on the driving, so I would be worried that you were not safe to drive in that state.

It's such a shame because your daughter won't remember her treat being "ruined" by being a bit late but she WILL remember it being actually ruined by the upset and the awful atmosphere that you created by your response to your son winding you up so much.

It doesn't sound like he actually wanted to go in the first place so I'm not sure why you took him and didn't arrnage for him to go to a friend's house for the evening or arrange an adult to be in the house with him while you were out. Especially knowing he has form for being late. When you booked tickets, did you ask him if he wanted to go?

This! You really need to drill home the knock on effects of his actions and arrogance. How dare he assume he knows better than you!

Also a good opportunity to address not relying on info from the internet over a reliable source!

As many others have said, I think your outburst was 100% understandable and you shouldn't feel guilty or worry you have done lasting damage.

There was one thing however that jumped out at me from your first post - when you said he went into the toilet for 30 minutes and told you it was 'in case he needed to go during the theatre performance'. That sounds as if it could be anxiety - I've met people who won't go to the theatre or cinema at all because they feel trapped. And his behaviour generally, all these delaying tactics and faffing about, even though he must know it creates problems for him (as well as everyone else) - maybe it's a way of putting things off, things he doesn't want to face for some reason. And he's only 12.

Anyway, that's just a thought, I could be way off and I'm not trying to minimise how annoying it must be.

He totally deserved your wrath.

Your are only human, being a Mum does not mean you are a saint. It'll be good for him to see your anger, anger is Ok.

As women we aren't suposed to get angry and get called all sorts of names, screaming banshee, harridan, medusa, shrew get called mental, etc.

Hopefully he will learn from this.

You shouted. It’s not ideal but it happens. He won’t be ‘damaged’ from an isolated and many would say deserved telling off, even though you might have preferred to have handled it differently.
Sit him down, apologise for shouting but tell him clearly what the consequence will be for any future dicking around of this nature - I would suggest withdrawing phone/tech use for a chunk of time that would deter him. Then stop nagging, nudging him along,reminding,begging or anything else and just follow through, every single time with a punishment that actually affects him personally in a negative way

Your poor DD! Her brother took all the attention away from her on her special day and made it all about him.

You say he is lovely, but he doesn't sound it. The lateness isn't something to be compartmentalised. It is currently part of him. Even though he is so young he should understand that his lateness shows a total disregard and disrespect of others.

I think your DD is owed another evening out - on her own.

Yanbu you are only human.
He was being a twit. A bit of a know it all too questioning your timings.

I would give a consequence too. Like phone and computer taken away. His behavior was completely unacceptable.

You knew this was going to happen, so why did you leave him to his own devices ??

It's not ideal but actually he really needed to see what his behaviour does. Hopefully he's learnt his lesson. In future I'd ask him if he's really so arrogant to think that he, a 12 year old non driver, knows better than you, an adult that has driven these exact roads for however many years you have.

You both owe your daughter an apology and another outing of her choice. That he is not welcome on and find the most boring babysitter you can.

I would apologise for losing it with him but then ask him if he can see what the results of his behaviour were and if he thinks it will make him do anything differently another time.