To have yelled and sworn at DS 12 for 20 minutes non stop in the car

[Lavatera]

Help.
I think I'm going mad and I've damaged my precious DS 12.
I haven't slept all night and I can't stop thinking that the baby I fell so in love with 12 years ago has been yelled and sworn at by me 12 years later.
I feel so, so sad, I don't know what to do with myself.
Yesterday, we had to drive to a town 50 minutes away to see a theatre production.
It was a special treat for my DD's (10) birthday present.
The performance started at 6pm so I knew we'd be driving through rush hour traffic, and the A roads between where we live and this town are well known to be hell at rush hour.
I really wanted to arrive early, in time to find parking, pay on the parking meter, and get to the theatre with enough to sit and have drinks together before going in to the performance. Not to mention I paid a fortune for a family ticket, but it was a show that DD really wanted to see.
So I'd spent 2 days telling DS that he must absolutely make sure that he was ready to walk out of the house at the time I'd set, I told him the time we needed to leave, and I reminded him at regular intervals.
On top of that, I was prompting him an hour before to start getting ready, 45 mins before, 30 mins before, 15 mins before.....he kept telling me I was overestimating the travel time because he'd checked his phone and seen it was only a 35 minute drive. No, I said, that's wrong, it takes 50 minutes, plus it's rush hour so we need to add extra time, plus I need to allow time to park and pay, and I want to arrive ahead of the show starting. I explained to him it was a special evening out and that he must be ready on time.
Nope. He was wasn't ready to leave. I mean by this point I was tailgating him around the house telling him to get dressed, get ready, etc.
So the time came to leave, me and DD had been ready for ages, I'd sent DS upstairs to get dressed, but DS still wasn't dressed, hair not brushed, shoes not on, at the time we had to leave.
Turns out that instead of going upstairs to get dressed and brush his hair like I'd asked him repeatedly to do, he'd decided to ho and sit on the toilet for 30 minutes 'in case he needed to go whilst at the theatre' and he walked out of the bathroom completely not ready.
I started stressing, I knew what the roads would be like, I ended up physically putting his clothes in his hands and telling him to dress, I brushed his hair, he was arguing at me to 'calm down' because I was annoyed by this point. It took him ages then faffing around, before we eventually got in the car 35 minutes later than the time I'd set.
We set off, and I lost it with him. I knew the tailbacks we'd face on the roads and I just developed this irrational anger. I shouted and shouted and shouted. And swore. Oh my God. I was shouting "YOU'RE SO SELFISH! YOU'VE MADE US LATE! YOU'VE RUINED THE EVENING! WE'RE GOUNG TO MISS THE SHOW! THEY WON'T LET US IN IF WE ARRIVE LATE! WE'RE FUCKING LAAAAAATE! LOOK AT THE FUCKING TRAFFIC!!!!! WHY HAVE YOU DONE THIS????" Honestly, I was like a woman possessed. I could not stop shouting. And I didn't stop raging for 20 full minutes. I was shouting so loud he had his fingers in his ears. DD was upset by my shouting.
I can't believe I shouted and swore like that.
For background, he makes us late for almost every single thing we ever have to be on time for. He's made us late for so many important events by just not listening to all my instructions and prompts and motivation and chivvying him along.....nothing, literally nothing works to get him out the house on time. Not even the threat of school detentions when he can't get ready even with my help in time in the mornings.
Christmas. I cannot believe I shouted for 20 mins and swore at my darling boy in a moving vehicle that he couldn't get out of so he couldn't walk away from me.
And upset DD in the process.
So the traffic was gridlock.
We arrived late, missed the start of the show, they let us in but wouldn't let us sit in our seats, they stuck us at the back in staff seats where we couldn't see very well (I'd bought prime position front central seats, I could see them sitting empty), and we all had a miserable evening.

How are you feeling OP?

OP your post actually made me laugh. It’s actually a bit like a comedy sketch - if clarification needed I mean it in a nice way.

Not ideal but you are only human. If you are worried about the impact it had on your son, now you are calm perhaps say that to him; e.g. the yelling wasn’t on and you apologise. However, point out to him that you indeed were late yet again to somewhere and to avoid you losing it again next time if he makes you late there will be consequence of X. Is there a realistic consequence that he would care about! It could be as others suggested he just doesn’t come or something else he liked doing will be impacted, etc…

But I don’t think you damaged him given it was a one off. But maybe try that different approach. Tell him when he needs to be out of the door and if he isn’t apply the consequence, no more reminders, just make it clear that this is the deal…. Easier said than done.

Also OP a calm conversation on the importance of being on time and it’s relevance to now and to later life (friendships, college, job etc) could be useful as he may not quite get why it’s so important

Listen we all lose our temper sometimes with our children, as much as we feel tremendous guilt over it and wish we didn’t.. we are only human.

The difference between a good mum and a not so good one in my opinion is a good mum understands when she has done wrong… they realise they shouldn’t have done this and what to make it right. A bad mum simply doesn’t acknowledge the pain she has caused.

You clearly are a good mum because you care…! Apologise, explain what triggered you, have a cuddle and come up with a plan to work on it together going forwards.

Sounds like you were totally justified. Yeah, the yelling wasn’t great, but you gave him plenty of notice which he ignored. He sounds a bit entitled.
I think you should have waiting ten mins and then left him behind.

I mean.. I think I'd have lost it long before you did. You're only human, his behaviour sounds infuriating.

Yelling does not change behaviour for the better. It doesn’t change relationships for the better.

I think he absolutely deserved it and the swearing too. This will for sure stick that he can't do what he's been doing. Sometimes I feel a good old fashioned shout does more than the wet 'oh darling, can we rush up' x100.
He was damn selfish and how many prompts did he get from a week before!

You're human. It happens. I've been there and done this too. My son is 30 now and we laugh about it (and he admits he was difficult)

RockAndRollerskate · Today 10:54
Wtf. No one deserves this.

I grew up being screamed at constantly. It didn’t make me more on time or less clumsy. It made me sad, anxious, lonely and scared.

You need better strategies, better consequences and better ways of getting through to him. Don’t you think the fact he spent 30 mins on the toilet “just in case” is concerning? Is there already anxiety there?

Why anyone on this thread thinks that berating a child like that for that long is okay is beyond me.

You’re going to treat him like this but expect him to treat future partners with respect? How would he learn that

And here are the apologists.
He is not you. Stop projecting.
He isn't shouted at and screamed at constantly.
He is 12, not a toddler - OP does not need to pander to his 'big man doing as he wants' decisions.
He sat on the toilet, because sitting in the kitchen/bedroom would have got him moved - toilets are a common strategy for delaying. You are immediately in the wrong if you drag them off the toilet.
He won't be treating future partners with respect, unless he gets a few shocks, he will be controlling every outing, every treat, everything that he does not want to do. There are plenty of posts about that on here!
Do you honestly think that the OP just decided to carry on berating him?
It was a build up of her anxiety, the thought of messing up her daughter's birthday treat, the loss of the money, caused by the boy, a last straw.

But OP must be very careful not to make the poor boy anxious. Never mind making his sister sad, and herself stressed.

OK swearing isn't ideal but I think you're limiting why you were rightfully so cross

Seats like that are not cheap I'm guessing? You had planned things to the letter, gave him a direct order of what to do way ahead of time and then he acts like that because "his phone says 35 minutes".

Frankly, if he's mansplaining to you at 12, you need to sort this now.

He has ruined an expensive event organised for his sister, which strikes me as selfish and shows a total lack of respect for both of you.

Is he the same when things are organised for him?

I think you should instigate a punishment of some sort, where he will perform tasks and "pay off" the debt of the tickets wasted down to his ignorance and lack of respect.

Is he ND? If not there's little excuse for his utter lack of respect for you.

Is he disrespectful at school as well?

You did lose it but with good reason. I would ban him from all events moving forward until he improves his behaviour in regards to respect. You need to tell him in no uncertain terms that his back chat and disrespect will not be tolerated, he is a child and as such should not be questioning when he is told by you to do something.

I would not put up with that from my son and he has Autism! In our home, if either of mine showed poor behaviour we have an "expectation discussion", the one involved (or both) are told what expectation they have failed to follow and we discuss what happens next in regards a punishment depending on the behaviour that led to it. Mine are now 17 and 16 but this has worked for us since they were 12 and 11 respectively. It shows a clear action and consequence and worked very effectively and quickly.

OP clearly said she feels bad and it was a one off by the sound of it.

Different to being screamed at all the time.

Not great you shouted, but just apologise and explain to him if this ever happens again you'll give him two choices 1. He leaves the house as he is, shoes in his hands to put on in the car if needed, hair brush to take with him etc or 2. He gets left at home.
Next time just give him those two choices and then if he doesn't make his choice you choose for him.
I'd also stop giving him so many time warnings, unless ND, tell him 30 minutes before he's got 30 minutes to get ready and then leave him to it. Clearly constant reminders don't work and he probably just feels like you are nagging him.

In a week or so when the dust has settled I'd choose a time when you are both calm and ask him, why does he find it so hard to get ready on time?
Is it that he doesn't want to go, is it that he thinks he's got enough time to get ready in 5 minutes, would he rather you leave him to it to get ready with no help/prompts, or would he rather you give him a tick list of things he needs to do so it's there in black and white.

Another option is he gets ready first - before doing anything else.
So for school in the morning he needs to get ready before breakfast, if he has a phone before his phone is handed to him in the morning, shoes on, hair brushed, teeth brushed, bag packed, completely ready before breakfast or phone/screens of any sort.
So again another way to tackle this 6pm performance would be after lunch he can't do anything else but get ready, again no screens, no playing, so he has literally hours to get ready. Either he takes hours to get ready or he gets ready and then can do something else whilst he waits for the right time to leave.

YANBU to be angry.

YWBU to handle it in that way.

I would have left him at home.

Or, knowing what he’s like, told the kids the show starts at 5, and been super early (or at least on time).

Now you need to both sit down and apologise to each other. You apologise to DS for the swearing. And he apologises to his sister for being selfish and spoiling her treat and to you for being disobedient when asked to get ready.

He now shouldn't get a bday present so his sister can have an alternative present because her present was ruined. He needs consequences, no shouting.

12 is old enough to be left at home isnt it?
Maybe from now on just give him a couple of reminders then just leave without him! If he wants to go with you he will make the effort!
Also consider your own behaviour....a 20 min screaming rant probably isnt normal either. Are you sure you are alright, mental health wise? (things like depression or meno can sneak up on us).

I had a visceral reaction to reading your post - I have been there with my daughter. Years back thank god, but reading your comment was triggering for me.

The rage.🙁

My daughter (who still lives at home) was like this at 12, and at 24 still is. She self sabotages all the time. Spends vast amounts of money on getting cabs to work because she can't leave the house early enough to take public transport. Had her probation at work extended by months because her time keeping was so poor.

She was a really, really difficult teenager, just so pointlessly oppositional ALL THE TIME, but when we came out the other end of that phase the appalling lateness persisted. When she was an adolescent I just thought she was being naughty and selfish, but the fact that it's been so persistent and has been such a problem for her professionally makes me feel that there's something else going on that's causing this behaviour. My daughter does have very bad anxiety though you wouldn't always know that from talking to her.

Are there any other aspects of your DS's behaviour that are difficult?

Could you sit down and - in a very objective way - just explore what was going through his head in the hours before you left for the theatre?

https://www.bbc.com/worklife/article/20170209-why-some-people-are-always-running-late

I'm amazed that so many people are saying the OP should apologise to her son. He deliberately caused the family to be late and ruined his sister's birthday. He thoroughly deserved the bollocking that he got.

Set his watch a quarter hour ahead.

I’d have done the same, have done similar. I’m a potty mouth when I’m angry/stressed.

"I'm amazed that so many people are saying the OP should apologise to her son"

Telling a child off and being angry with them for ruining your night is reasonable.

Ranting and swearing at them for 20 minutes is abusive.

I'm saying that as someone who has ranted and sworn at my child for the same thing. The OP knows what she did wasn't ok.

Hard agree.

He deserves being told off. This isn't something he will just grow out of, he needs to be told and this to have consequences that effect him because he sure as shit doesn't give a fuck if his behaviour effects anybody else.

Raising arsehole lazy selfish kids is how you raise arsehole lazy selfish men.

You should have shouted at him all the way back too and when he got up the next morning, shouted at him again.

Make him pay for the family ticket by stopping his pocket money or by taking birthday/Christmas money.

Lateness is something that really bothers me personally, and I can definitely see myself losing it like you did in this situation.

I think there are a number of issues here. Firstly, he is always late. Secondly, for whatever reason he thinks he knows best about things that he is not well placed to have a final say on. Thirdly, there appears to be no mention of his reaction beyond sticking his fingers in his ears. I think the thing that would bother me most is the second thing. Some people really do just struggle with being on time, although I feel that he can't use any excuse around that when you were there reminding him he needed to get ready. However, him deciding for you all that he knew better and therefore that you would not be able to leave until he was ready to do so (in line with his own thoughts of the travel time) is what I would be punishing. It shows a complete lack of respect for you and his sister.

Did he react at all after the outburst? Did it appear to bother him in the slightest? I feel I need to say that although I know I would also react like you did that I don't think it is acceptable, but very understandable. I would wait until you are calm and explain to him your frustration. I would also be tempted to make him make up the difference in ticket price between the ones you bought and the seats you ended up in - paid directly to his sister. I would also go down the route of telling him that if it happens again he will be left behind so that there is never a repeat of the outburst.

This sounds so hard! I really feel for you. Please forgive yourself. You are human. Apologise for the way you raised the frustration, but not for the frustration itself which is totally justified.

henlake7 · Today 11:14
12 is old enough to be left at home isnt it?
Maybe from now on just give him a couple of reminders then just leave without him! If he wants to go with you he will make the effort!
Also consider your own behaviour....a 20 min screaming rant probably isnt normal either. Are you sure you are alright, mental health wise? (things like depression or meno can sneak up on us).

Depends on the 12 year old if they can be left at home. If he is controlling, as I think, then he can cause havoc because it did not go his way.
'Mum took my sister to a show and left me all alone..'
A lot of controlling teens/preteens will decide that there will be consequences for everyone else if they are not paramount!
He upsets everyone, causes his Mum to flip, and OP's mental health isn't right...