'Dad's side of the family'...is it really a thing?

[TheolderIgetthelessIknow]

I read recently, not on Mumsnet but somewhere similar, a young woman stating categorically that she would not take on responsibility for communication (such as making arrangements, sending birthday gifts, etc.) to her husband's side of the family. I was a little shocked to see in the comments that most of the respondents wholeheartedly agreed with her, even if it meant that communication with that side of the family dwindled to nothing, assuming that many men are not that bothered about keeping in touch or even remembering birthdays, etc. I'm an older woman with a daughter and a son, both married. My daughter keeps in daily contact with me but has virtually no contact with her PIL. As a result, I see a lot of her children and know what's happening in their lives. My son, on the other hand, literally only gets in touch when he wants something -usually money- and I never hear from my DIL at all. I only see their children when I visit them (self-invited); they hardly ever visit me and my DH although I've invited them lots of times ( they're always 'busy', often with DIL's side of the family) and said that they can come whenever they want to. Birthdays, mothers/fathers days and Christmas are a bit hit and miss regarding presents and cards from them, although I always visit with cards and gifts for them.
So, my query is: am I being unreasonable to expect at least some sort of regular input from them, regarding the children at least? Is it definitely a thing that young mums now refuse to take on the burden of keeping their MIL up to date and maybe sending birthday cards or whatever? It might make me feel a bit better if I know it's just my son's laziness (not that that's any excuse) rather than antipathy from my DIL.

I have very little communication with my husband's side of the family. I don't take responsibility for any of the organisation to meet up or stay with them.

AND YET, we see them absolutely loads, probably more than we see my family on balance. And why is that? Because my husband takes responsibility for keeping in touch with his own parents and siblings, HE invites his own mother to stay with us, HE suggests going to stay with them, HE gets involved in HIS family's whatsapp group when get-togethers are being arranged. I just get told the arrangements and happily agree. Likewise, I arrange to see my own family, run it by DH, and he happily tags along.

If DILs are unfairly preventing their kids and husband from seeing his side of the family, then that would be very unreasonable, but if it's simply that they're not putting in extra work because they expect their own husbands to act like the grown men that they are and maintain a relationship with their own parents, rather than expecting it to be done for them, then I think the ones who are being extremely unreasonable in that case are the PILs and the husbands.

One Christmas DH and I swapped, so I bought for the women on his side of the family and he bought for the men in mine (similar numbers).

Why should it be the woman's responsibility to do all present buying and card sending for both sides of the family? If he can't be arsed to buy gifts or whatever else for his own family and close friends, why should his partner be made to feel guilty for not picking up the slack?

I think we are living through a time of transition. Women are increasingly unwilling to bail out shit, incompetent and uncaring men. This applies generally, not just to family relationships.

The exception is children. Most women will 'step up' and do more than their fair share to make sure their children don't suffer from having disorganised, uninterested fathers.

But when it comes to adult relationships, they're no longer willing to cover up for men's failings.

Tbh, most parents should know what their adult sons are like, shouldn't they? If you're unfortunate enough to have one who relies on being a man - and the general permission that society gives to men to be useless at emotional labour and not care who they upset - to be useless at card-sending/giving gifts and generally keeping in touch, then why would you want cards and gifts knowing your son doesn't give a toss and it's really your DIL sending them?

And if it's access to the grandchildren that's the issue, most women are very keen to have extra adults around who love and are willing to invest time and effort in their children. So cut out the useless son and go straight to the DIL - level with her. Say "X is useless at arranging things but we'd like to see our grandchildren more. How can we help? Can we take them out for the day to give you a break? Or can we pay for zoo tickets so we can all have a nice day out together? We want to be present in their lives and build a strong relationship with them as individuals."

And if your son is useless at gift-giving, let him feel the consequences. Send him a card and a selection box for his birthday and that's it. If it's the DIL who's arranging everything, acknowledge this - she's the one who deserves the generous gift voucher or the expensive chocolates, not the lazy sod who doesn't care and never gets in touch.

You say "actively choose to ignore them" as though making arrangements, maintaining communication, remembering birthdays, shopping for presents etc. is easier than not doing those things, which is not the case. All of those things take time and energy, and when you work full time and have young children to chase around all the time you're not working, I regularly go 4 or 5 days on the trot without a single half hour to think. I barely have time to keep in touch with my own family some weeks. If my husband suddenly decided he wanted me to do all of that for his family as well as my own, we would quite simply end up seeing much less of both of our families, because I just wouldn't have the time or the energy.

If my mum feels like she hasn't spoken to me enough lately, she sends me nagging texts and guilt trips me and so I ring her. All these women who are annoyed that they never hear from their son ought to be nagging and guilt-tripping THEIR SON. He's the one you birthed and raised and watched grow. He's the one you love and who loves you. Yes, it would be very nice if his wife picked up his slack, but you ought to see that as a nice bonus, and if she's just too tired, she's not the one you should be getting annoyed at.

YABU why is always the women's responsibility to take on the mental load of everything as well as work and look after children. I love my PIL, they are good people and occasionally I will send photos of the DCs to them but DH speaks to the several times a week because they are HIS parents and he cares about them. Tell your son to do better.

My kids are adults now but dh has always arranged his family get togethers, and me mine.
Luckily he is always keen to contact his family.

I think doing all the « kin keeping » emotional labour often falls to women.

Frankly I don’t have the bandwidth to deal with my partners family- he deals with them. I have enough of my own family and friends to keep up to date with.

I'm in my 60s, so probably around OP's age, and I would never expect my dil to maintain the relationship if my ds couldn't be bothered. I don't maintain the relationship with my in-laws, my dh does that. OP has some very old-fashioned ideas about "women's work" that I for one am very glad to see fall out of favor.

OP, speak to your son and stop blaming your dil. It's not her responsibility to maintain a relationship with you.

Shared responsibility here but no set method

@IpsyUpsyDaisyDoos
I thought my relationship with my kids and their spouses was normal.
I think it helps we are all really easy going and if there are any issues we talk about them. I am lucky my daughter in law is lovely and she is a fantastic mum and i make sure i tell her as i do with my own daughters. Although my own daughters like to think they can run my life but thats a whole different thread 😂

Normal is subjective. Your normal is not my normal. My normal isn't anyone elses. My sister has a very different relationship with her in laws to what I have with mine (luckily for her, the love her like she's their own).

Not everyone has a lovely relationship with their in laws. Not all MILs (or FILs) are accepting of the new person that's entering their family.

My MIL openly dislikes both my SILs. I am her favourite DIL (and it took a LOT of effort and ignoring of the madness to get there), but am still regularly subjected to the silent treatment, criticism and general rubbish. She often loses her mind at my DH (the one of her three sons who will actually challenge her) and we can go weeks without contact between the two of them.

The result is, over 15 years down the line, I have my own relationship with my in laws, but I do not get involved in DHs. My involvement is only as far as what contact my DD has with them when MIL has been awful. DH handles the rest. And that's his decision, which suits everyone.

Also, you state that you're all easy going and can tell each other things. So tell your son you want more contact. Sorted.

YABU

Why should your DiL step up when your own son CBA? She has her own side of the family to deal with and make the effort for why is it on her to deal with your son's side of the family as well. If you want updates on your grandkids, then ask HIM.....radical idea but try it.

ETA......why would you think your son's laziness is somehow a better "excuse" for him not bothering, rather that her not being willing to deal with things a mature person wouldn't think twice about?

But you see, you are still placing ultimate responsibility for a man’s relationship with his parents on his wife.

Why do you let men off the hook so readily for being “useless at this sort of thing” but not extend the same generosity to their wives? Why do you think men are useless at it? Is it just their nature? Are they too busy, too tired, or they just don’t think about it, or they find it hard? Why wouldn’t you assume any of those things might be the case for their wives too? You expect the women to just get over whatever hurdles they have to maintaining contact with two sets of relatives, whether it’s time, energy, or desire, and just do it anyway, where you merely shrug and roll your eyes at the men who can’t even maintain contact with one side.

Perhaps, just perhaps the reason men are so useless at it is because they are never held to account. Because when they fail, their wife gets the blame, rather than themselves.

If my mum told you that she complains at least once a month that she doesn’t get to talk to me enough, because I don’t ring her as often as she’d like and I don’t always pick up the phone when she rings (true story), would it even occur to you to wonder why on Earth my husband doesn’t pick up the phone to her and chat to her on my behalf?

Actually I'd say the expectation that men are entitled to have women run the boring, unappealing bits of their life is traditional, not modern.

I'm just perplexed that women, knowing that their men are absolutely useless at this sort of thing

But I am also absolutely useless. I do not want to send any cards, I don't want to remember that it's the 5 year anniversary of the purchase of the kitchen sofa of the second cousin I've never met. Women are not naturally better at date remembering and stamp purchasing.

My DH is crap at buying cards and gifts but he is in close contact with his Mum and she helps out a significant amount with our children. I ensure she, and everyone on his side, get cards, gifts etc. I don't know if this is my responsibility as such but they're all nice people and they take the time and effort to look out for me and my children.
It's a bit sad when people don't do something because it isn't seen as 'their' responsibility. My DH helps my mother out with jobs around the house- probably not 'his' responsibility but he's a nice person.

Thing is, this is teamwork. A man just not bothering to remember his family stuff because it's wife work is not the same.

I know OP has stopped reading the thread now but I've just got a rhetorical question.

If the DS is so bad at remembering people's birthdays etc., does OP or other MIL's in that position, give him a call to remind him about DIL's birthday. Or, as I suspect, does he not forget his wife's birthday because she'll either have a word or make it clear that she is not happy (quite rightly).

So that's what DM and DF need to do - ring up and have a word. Express that you're not happy, you're disappointed, you want more consideration.

I remember my now 17 year old DS saying, a couple of years ago, that his friend had rushed to the shop to get his mum a birthday card as he'd forgotten it was her birthday. DS said to me something along the lines of 'If I'd done that I'd not hear the last of it eh mum?' Answer - dead right. And he'll not hear the last of it if he forgets when he's left home either!

Me too. DH is far more sociable than me. And I come from a family that doesn't bother with birthdays anyway so I'm damned if I'm running round buying birthday cards for his family when I don't send them to my own. If he thinks it's important to send cards then he can do it. There's nothing on the Y chromosome that makes men explode if they walk into a branch of Hallmark.

Selfish? I don’t think so.

I’m in my 50s and 100% agree that it is well past the time for women to be picking up the misogynistic slack. I don’t think we’re being selfish - quite the opposite by helping equality of the sexes for future generations.

I actually like that this is becoming the norm. Women already have to take up the slack for men in so many areas, and with little thanks. Maybe this will breed a new type of man who actually takes on the responsibility unlike your son, who can't be bothered and it shouldn't be your DIL responsibility just cos he can't be arsed.

I’ve also noticed that some younger women say it is their husband’s responsibility to buy gifts and stay in contact with the husband’s side of the family. I don’t think that is necessarily fair because generally women are better at remembering special occasions and buying gifts than men are.

However some MILs overstep the mark and there are plenty of DILs who justifiably choose to keep their distance and tell their DH to look after their own family so that it limits the DILs contact with their dreaded MIL.

What's your evidence for saying that women are better at remembering special occasions and buying gifts than men? Has this been scientifically proven?

Or is it just a case of men being strategically incompetent so that they don't have to bother?

My DH seems perfectly capable tbh. I'm not sure why he wouldn't be.

No no. Men and women have been programmed to believe it’s the women’s job because the poor men folk cannot possibly remember.

Yet they remember their Mot, their dentist, important meetings for work, when to renew their insurances, when it’s their mates birthday, when the (sport / hobby of their choice) fixtures are, they remember when new movies are due to come out. They remember what beers they like and which is their favourite Chinese.

They choose to not be arsed mostly with remember family dates you no boring no relevance to them womens work. They mostly remember wife’s birthday and anniversary etc because relevant you no to stay married and get sex 😏😉