To not make 22 month old say please and thank you

[Sleepygrumpyandnothappy]

Obviously I encourage it sometimes, but generally I’m not fussed about ‘please’ and ‘thank you’.

DS (not yet 2) is a late talker and not really stringing two words together. If he’s persistently asking for more I’ll encourage him to say please, and I always model “thank you” but otherwise it’s not something we prioritise. I was very aware seeing SIL at the weekend that their two year old is told to say please and thank you all the time. Eg “would you like an apple or banana”, “banana”, “say ‘banana please’”. I find it quite jarring as it’s used far more than normal adult speech would require/expect.

Are we bringing DS up to be a rude little horror?

Same!!

I agree that modelling is best at this age. Forcing a young child to say please and thank you is not going to teach them to say it. Model and remind them. They’ll get there if you are consistent.

🙄🤣

Modelling is not correcting.

Are you British op? Because even a short transaction in a shop to buy a paper has about 25 pleases and thankyoys in it. And probably About 4 sorries. I even said thank you to the unmanned checkout machine last week!

I'm with your SIL on this one.

Absolutely. How else will they learn?

It's absolutely never too early to start encouraging good manners - by modelling initially & then later, explicitly insisting on it.

I'm a yr6 (age 10&11) Teacher in a Primary School & I cannot tell you the number of children on a daily basis that I have to remind about basic manners & common courtesy: please, thank you, excuse me, not interrupting me talking, not constantly calling my name when I'm clearly talking to another child or an adult, etc - it's exhausting!!

OP I have a late talker. At 2 they basically didn't have any words. Now 2 years 7 months. Lots of words and sentences and we are now starting to be consistent on asking for please and thank you. We did encourage makaton please and thank you when she was signing. She has picked it up and knows the importance within a few days. And we always Modelled it in the house to all the manners pearl clutches out there.

But FFS to everyone else. The child is 2. Not saying please at the age of 2 isn't a steady slope descent into juvenile delinquency lol. Yea model please and thank you. No don't expect a 2 year old who can't say many words to say them - I mean my child wouldn't have been able to say either word anyway. I'm with you OP x

I also hate the word ta and if talking was an issue I would do the signs for please and thank you and teach those, as well as say them.

Another post knocking other parents for trying to raise their kids properly, and justifying why they don't think they have to.

There are so many posts like this that seem to think if someone isn't insisting their child says please and thank you, and is actively withholding things from their child until the say these words, that means they aren't "teaching them manners"

I have never taught my 2 year old to say please, thank you, or sorry and yet he says them all the time. I've never insisted. We just model that language around him and he has learnt that's how people talk to each other.

Some examples only this morning of polite speech from him (and this doesn't have to mean specific words like please and thank you):

"Good morning mummy, did you have a good sleep?"
"I would like some cornflakes"
"Please can I have more cornflakes"
"I kicked mummy yesterday that was really really not nice I'm sorry" (we had words yesterday because he was kicking while getting his nappy changed so he was still thinking about that)
"Let's play in the sand pit together!"
"Bye bye daddy see you later!"
"Daddy will come home and I love my mummy and daddy!"
"Please can I have apple cut in little slices?"
"Thank you mummy!"

He's two and a half and these are all lovely examples of polite speech.

Never once have I held food out of his reach and said "what do you say?", "say ta", or "what's the magic word?"

The OP values manners. She just isn't insisting on it with a speech delayed toddler and is modelling the language until he picks it up naturally. Which he will. OP is going a good job.

I agree with your SIL on this. You need to enforce manners or you’ll have a child that grows up like my nephew, who never says thank you when I give him a lift home. He just gets out of the car with not even a bye sometimes. Rude child

That’s not what this is though! Op’s child is ONE. She’s not saying manners don’t matter and that she won’t teach him manners, she’s just focusing on other aspects of speech due to speech delay, also in line with advice from speech therapist. My son hardly said anything at 2. He’s now 3 and says please and thank you. Jesus Christ.

But why knock the other parents?

Where has op done that?

Why would you NOT teach your child manners? Bizarre.

‘I was very aware seeing SIL at the weekend that their two year old is told to say please and thank you all the time. Eg “would you like an apple or banana”, “banana”, “say ‘banana please’”. I find it quite jarring as it’s used far more than normal adult speech would require/expect.’

Your DC will come across as rude if and insolent if he doesn't learn it. Might be more important to stress it when young if he finds speech more difficult

Are we bringing DS up to be a rude little horror?

If you're giving up that easily and quickly quite possibly! Not because of this issue alone, but it shows a lack of awareness from yourselves around the importance of manners so likely not an isolated issue. Parents reiterate these words even before children can speak, it's just what you do, you keep doing it until they say it for themselves.

I would model it but don’t insist that he repeats them back to you all the time. It is useful to have good social skills but some people overdo the pleases and thank yous which comes across as a bit insecure and nervous.

I never overdid it, I'm not dogmatic about please and thank you

Lots of very interesting posts and I’ve particularly valued those from posters with a background in SLT or experience with speech delays. A lot concurs with what I’d previously read and yes we have absolutely emphasised extending “banana” into a “yellow banana” or “big banana” over “banana please”.

We no doubt model more than I realise because we were both raised in this country and it is reflective speech. But to me that means saying please and thank you to DS rather than going out of my way to make him say it. This morning was a case in point. He was eyeing up my banana so I asked him if he wanted some of it, which he did but I didn’t make him say please before handing it over. He was then interested in the skin, so I told him that went into the bin, he happily ran over to throw it away and I said “thank you”. To me that feels like a natural conversation.

Manners is a really sophisticated concept for a not yet 2 year old and for some people it does seem to boil down to a “magic word” as that’s easily mimicked. But if I’m teaching him stuff I’m more focused on teaching that it’s bad manners to try and grab mummy’s top because you want milk, or to pour your water on the floor when you’ve finished drinking.

The magic word from me would be f**k off.

I hate these performative please and thank yous

The tone of voice when saying please and thank you doesn’t indicate someone is a mannered person. It can indicate passive aggression, entitlement, bullying and martyrdom

oakleaffy
I find it rude If a toddler takes without saying “ Thank you” or “please” when asking for something-
Just silently taking IS Ill mannered

Thats nice. Dd didn’t speak a word till she was over 2 years old. Yet you would think her rude

FofB
My eldest didn't really talk until she was 3. Was in speech therapy and used sign language. We talked to her all the time and we still said taught her please and thank you. For example, she would sign for orange juice. I would say 'I would like Orange Juice please' and she would say 'yeh' and nod. I would then say 'good girl

This confuses me even as an adult

Your child wants Orange Juice but you reply with you want orange juice. To me this would indicate that your child was expected to go get the OJ for you.

Yes, this. I always say please and thank you but I don’t like badgering very small children to repeat words that they don’t even really understand the meaning of yet.

Completely agree with you op. There is no need to more at this stage with please and thank you other than what you’re doing. What is also more important with children with speech delays is to equip them with other basic conversation and pronunciation skills so that others can understand them. My son says please and thank you but still has trouble answering open questions or saying his own 4 letter name. Please and thank you are not the only things to focus on.