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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

I don’t want my DD to be an Au Pair for a single dad

423 replies

Cyanbadmintonplayer · 05/06/2024 20:28

Hi,
My DD is 19, we live in Germany but we are a British family. DD really wants to give a go at being an Au Pair for a couple of years while doing open uni.
Shes using an agency and has been matched with a single dad and his 7 year old daughter, from what I can gather no mother on the scene.

He wants DD to take his child to and from school everyday, and then to and from
clubs every evening bar 1 and Saturday.
No cleaning expectations, no need to drive (tube or taxi depending). She would need to make dinner for the child 4 days a week and a packed lunch for between activities on the Saturday. Occasional babysitting but this could come with an extra payment.
DD would get some time off over school holidays but would occasionally be asked to travel with them.
The pay would be £150 p/w, food and accommodation provided (large room with en-suite), travel card provided, phone bill paid for. DD would like to see if a gym membership would be possible on top of this but doesn’t want to be greedy.

It all sounds good I know but I hate the thought of her working for a single dad!
It seems a lot less safe and significantly riskier. I’m also worried that it might not be the safest area she’d be living in (London S/W).

AIBU thinking DD should wait it out for a different family and working for a single man is just too risky?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
5
Todaywasbetter · 06/06/2024 13:31

If you want Actual street level information on crime use the metropolitan police crime map system if you know the postcode it will give you details of the last few years of crimes in that area the two instance as you mentioned was freaky never to be repeated crimes. The agency should give her advice if she’s not used to urban living I always feel safe in a very similar area

brogueish · 06/06/2024 13:31

Cyanbadmintonplayer · 06/06/2024 13:19

Thank you.

We have done some additional research today and asked more questions.

  • The room has a lock, it’s the only room on the top floor and when she asked how much privacy she had he replied with “the room has a lock and there are not other rooms on that floor, I can’t remember the last time I went up there, child might come up occasionally but she does know she isn’t meant to”
  • He explained she is welcome to have guests but would rather they stay in her room, there are two “guest rooms” but one functions as his parents room and the other shares a floor with his DDs room so he would rather there weren’t any strangers staying there
DD reached out to both of the previous Au Pairs, both have replied.
  • First Au Pair worked for them for two years when the child was 3 and 4. She said that it was a nice place to work, she never felt at risk and only left as she was ready to go to uni in a different city. Obviously this was during Covid partially so not the exact same circumstances.
  • Second Au Pair worked for them until August Last year, she was asked to leave when the mother was terminally ill and the father took leave from work to care for her. She said that it might be different without the mother present but she never had to get the child ready for school and even at 5 the child would wake up, wash her own face and get dressed, her mum or dad would sort breakfast, her hair and help with teeth brushing. She think the hours sound accurate but was asked to babysit around once a week, usually paid £25-£30 to do so. She said the main annoying thing was they would seem a little irritated if she used a taxi when the tube was an option and she had to be quite assertive in saying they wouldn’t have made it on time if they didn’t or explain that the bad weather would have made it very unpleasant. She also explained they are one parent one language household and the dad only speaks to his child in his native language, which can feel exclusionary at times.

My concerns with the Clapham area are the only two times I’ve heard about it in the last 5 years were following the Sarah Everard attack and around the time of the acid attack this year. I don’t think I’ve heard of any similar crimes in areas I’d define as safe in London such as Richmond/Kew, Hampstead, Wimbledon etc.

DD is even more up for it now especially as the others were able to stay more than a year.

Does your daughter have any knowledge of the language he speaks? Is the daughter bilingual?

Cyanbadmintonplayer · 06/06/2024 13:35

brogueish · 06/06/2024 13:31

Does your daughter have any knowledge of the language he speaks? Is the daughter bilingual?

I think the daughter speaks English and French but they always seem hire German speaking Au-pairs? No idea why. He has said that as much as possible she should speak to the little girl in German even if she replies in English.
DD has some French but not fluent.

OP posts:
mycatisanarcissist · 06/06/2024 13:38

WOMANDOWNN · 06/06/2024 13:27

Not all men are perverted rapists

No, but the vast majority of perverted rapists are men.

mycatisanarcissist · 06/06/2024 13:39

That sounds more promising if he's had two previous au pairs who had mostly good things to say.

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 06/06/2024 13:42

If it were my dd I’d probably be a bit uneasy but I think I’d give him the benefit of the doubt - but I’d want a sturdy bolt on the inside of her bedroom door. Which IMO should be provided anyway in such circs.

Dartwarbler · 06/06/2024 13:51

I think I’d be way more concerned about whether the parent had used au pairs before.

we had au pairs- actually young men which was brilliant for our 2 ds. Had them all the way through their primary school years mainly to do walking to and from school bit and a bit of afternoon activivty once back form school - usually a lot of playing at the rec and generally wearing the kids out 🤷🏼‍♀️🤣🤣🤣

BUT,it is a lot of work for parent, and in effect you become a parent to the au pair as it’s often their first stint away from home and in a foreign country where their language is still pretty basic. You’re there for logistic sorting, emotional support (girlfriend issues🤦‍♀️, but we also dealt with a bereavement) and delivering a lot of cultural and language learning, in addition to their language school formal lessons. You, as parents, also spend a lot of time with au pair if you’re doing your part of the deal.

they relied a fair bit on my husband, and whilst I was a bit of “mum” to them they clearly preffered to broach more difficult issues with him as well as the old pub/sport type stuff they enjoyed togther.

being in a household with just a parent of opposite sex to au pair is going to be more difficult - she may feel more isolated due to having less connection socially. She CANNOT rely on her social life circling on child care and language - she needs that in her actually new home too to feel valued by the family she is temporarily part of

However, it sounds like a lot of what’s being offered is more of a cheap nanny …and I’d be really concnered that in that arrangement, the dad is going to dump a whole bunch more onto her in terms of childcare and little expectation of what he is doing to support her other than throwing “perks” at her. She doesn’t need gym memebrship, she needs committment if she gets stuck someone at midnight she is safe to call him and he will come and pick her up just like you as parent would. She needs to know he will help her navigate language issues and cultural differences, that she can sit with him in the evening and use him to practice her language at full immersion over say, TV watching etc. and they have something in common to chat about at end of day, over breakfast and over the long weekends when they’re both in the house.

if he has a track record of having female au pairs before I’d be more comfortable. BUT she needs to interview him on hte phone too - ask him about this stuff. If she is his Guinea pig then be a lot more conscious

also make sure she is with an agency in the country she’s going to. If there are any issue around concerns or that it is simply not working, she needs to know how it will work in terms of her leaving placement and being allocated to a new one. We had that once, the lad came and he was not used to quiet rural life and got very homesick, we went to agency with him , they placed him with family in London, he had friends there, we rehired someone new. It happens and is not an issue as long as agency has got her back totally.

make sure you are always able to extract her urgently and put her in pace of safety over any situation even slight issues. Again that doesn’t just apply to working with single dad. Shit can happen with mums bullying au pairs as well.

make sure she knows she hasn’t failed if it doesn’t work, she can try a new placement, and if she finds it isn’t for her, she will have still gained some self awareness about the placement.

always use an agency. They do the DBS type checks so make absolutely sure you check that.

Southlondoner88 · 06/06/2024 13:58

I really think teaching her to be cautious of men is ok to a point but to be so distrusting is another thing, this isn’t a healthy worldview to be giving her. There are far more likely scenarios where she would be assaulted, walking home late at night in london, going on a dating app, sleazy men on dates or in bars, work colleagues being inappropriate. These are still rare enough but why focus only on this poor dad and why don’t you trust your daughter to be able to make informed decisions as an adult? Do you think all domestic workers are out to meet a fella? I used to nanny and find this quite offensive that you would think so little of us professionally.

BeGutsyCat · 06/06/2024 14:00

I know this sounds like convoluted logic, but I am absolutely not being disingenuous.

The reason you heard about the Sarah Everard attack was because Clapham is a very nice area.

It was shocking and outrageous and her fellow middle class white women in the area rallied to protest, because she was a middle class white girl from Durham (nice uni) in media (posho industry).

30 women were murdered in London that same year (many raped too), mostly from rough areas or non-white/non-European so no one cared. In fact outside of London very closely around the same time, I remember 1 woman was beheaded (in a nice area, but she was a woman of colour), but there was very little media and public interest. It would've been a sensationalist whodunnit media blitz for months if she were Sarah Everard's demographic.

The other reason, of course, was that the perpetrator was a Met Police officer. Murder was a shock factor but also, in 2023 over 150 policemen were found guilty of sexual offences and violence against the person. Again many of these take place in rough areas or against WOC.

The same with the acid attack. It's much more common in rough areas. Almost 500 acid attacks in London in 2017! (It's fallen to about 100 in the past few years though.) That incident made a stir because it was Clapham, a naise area where such incidences are unthinkable.

shearwater2 · 06/06/2024 14:00

mycatisanarcissist · 06/06/2024 11:52

I lived in France, too, in my 20s and I had multiple men stop me on the street and ask me if I'd like to get into their car and go home with them, as if they had mistaken me for a prostitute. That never happened in the UK.

Quite. I was relieved to get back to the UK where I was usually merely wolf-whistled at from afar. I don't think France is as bad nowadays, though I am 48 now and it is hard to compare from my brief experience on holidays. I also think Italy has changed also. We spent a lot of time there a couple of years ago and DDs walked around on their own a fair bit and got no harassment or comments. Even when I went with DH to several Italian holidays when we were young there was a fair bit of cat calling.

Anyway, the previous references seem quite good, OP. Armed with certain precautions and advice she should be ok and have a lovely time. I always feel safe in most parts of London and always have.

ClaudiaWankleman · 06/06/2024 14:00

Clapham is a very safe place. I don't understand exactly why you are so anti the whole thing.

BeGutsyCat · 06/06/2024 14:03

Todaywasbetter · 06/06/2024 13:31

If you want Actual street level information on crime use the metropolitan police crime map system if you know the postcode it will give you details of the last few years of crimes in that area the two instance as you mentioned was freaky never to be repeated crimes. The agency should give her advice if she’s not used to urban living I always feel safe in a very similar area

I don't think it's worth worrying yourself like that over low level crime or isolated violent crime. Most statistics show Westminster (where the Royal Family live ffs, as well as most poshos) and Chelsea are the 2 most dangerous/crime riddled areas in London. Practically speaking, these are probably the 2 safest places in London (having lived in a real mix of places myself – a v rough area when I first cluelessly moved here, and now SW1)...

mycatisanarcissist · 06/06/2024 14:04

Southlondoner88 · 06/06/2024 13:58

I really think teaching her to be cautious of men is ok to a point but to be so distrusting is another thing, this isn’t a healthy worldview to be giving her. There are far more likely scenarios where she would be assaulted, walking home late at night in london, going on a dating app, sleazy men on dates or in bars, work colleagues being inappropriate. These are still rare enough but why focus only on this poor dad and why don’t you trust your daughter to be able to make informed decisions as an adult? Do you think all domestic workers are out to meet a fella? I used to nanny and find this quite offensive that you would think so little of us professionally.

Not rare at all. I lived in London and was groped (aka sexually assaulted) on the tube multiple times. I was only there for 9 months. And I had men shouting sexual comments at me. I was walking home, in Fulham at around 9pm on a weekend and a drunk man tried to assault me but thankfully was too drunk to do a good job and I just shouted and ran like hell.

At age 19, I didn't know what I know now about men.

I'm starting to wonder why other women on this thread are so trusting? Have you not experienced any of this?

Life2Short4Nonsense · 06/06/2024 14:11

Cyanbadmintonplayer · 06/06/2024 13:19

Thank you.

We have done some additional research today and asked more questions.

  • The room has a lock, it’s the only room on the top floor and when she asked how much privacy she had he replied with “the room has a lock and there are not other rooms on that floor, I can’t remember the last time I went up there, child might come up occasionally but she does know she isn’t meant to”
  • He explained she is welcome to have guests but would rather they stay in her room, there are two “guest rooms” but one functions as his parents room and the other shares a floor with his DDs room so he would rather there weren’t any strangers staying there
DD reached out to both of the previous Au Pairs, both have replied.
  • First Au Pair worked for them for two years when the child was 3 and 4. She said that it was a nice place to work, she never felt at risk and only left as she was ready to go to uni in a different city. Obviously this was during Covid partially so not the exact same circumstances.
  • Second Au Pair worked for them until August Last year, she was asked to leave when the mother was terminally ill and the father took leave from work to care for her. She said that it might be different without the mother present but she never had to get the child ready for school and even at 5 the child would wake up, wash her own face and get dressed, her mum or dad would sort breakfast, her hair and help with teeth brushing. She think the hours sound accurate but was asked to babysit around once a week, usually paid £25-£30 to do so. She said the main annoying thing was they would seem a little irritated if she used a taxi when the tube was an option and she had to be quite assertive in saying they wouldn’t have made it on time if they didn’t or explain that the bad weather would have made it very unpleasant. She also explained they are one parent one language household and the dad only speaks to his child in his native language, which can feel exclusionary at times.

My concerns with the Clapham area are the only two times I’ve heard about it in the last 5 years were following the Sarah Everard attack and around the time of the acid attack this year. I don’t think I’ve heard of any similar crimes in areas I’d define as safe in London such as Richmond/Kew, Hampstead, Wimbledon etc.

DD is even more up for it now especially as the others were able to stay more than a year.

OP, I think these answers are somewhat reassuring. There is of course never a garantee. But I see no red flags here.

What is always a good idea when working aboard, regardless of the job or housing situation, is to have a way to get home. When I worked on board ships, our college strongely recommended we'd get a credit card and always have that on us, so we had the funds to get somewhere (airport, embassey) where ever.

Always have an exit plan.

BeGutsyCat · 06/06/2024 14:12

@mycatisanarcissist but the scenarios you list are in public? European cities, including London, are all extremely dangerous so DD will encounter that anywhere.

Re: the male employer (not in public), I also think generally it is dangerous, but it might be dangerous with an oblivious wife or wife in denial too. Wealthy people can be screwed up – I've read some horror stories about wives turning a blind eye to sexual abuse of their nannies/au pairs, or persecuting those girls as if it was their fault. Overall I think being an au pair is quite dangerous, but it's a tradeoff if OP's DD gets what she wants and takes many precautions.

FrappuccinoLight · 06/06/2024 14:12

OhHelloMiss · 05/06/2024 20:38

It's just another man bashing thread

The op came on here to what she thought was a safe place to voice her maternal concerns for her teenage daughter - yes she’s still a teen at 19 - and the poor woman has been attacked and accused and belittled and shamed.

She loves her daughter. She’s worried about her daughter. Good for her.

Rightly or wrongly she has concerns about the set up and as usual the superior Mumsnet community has pulled the op apart and been offered very little kindness, reassurance or support. It’s sad really.

AndiOliversGlasses · 06/06/2024 14:13

mycatisanarcissist · 06/06/2024 14:04

Not rare at all. I lived in London and was groped (aka sexually assaulted) on the tube multiple times. I was only there for 9 months. And I had men shouting sexual comments at me. I was walking home, in Fulham at around 9pm on a weekend and a drunk man tried to assault me but thankfully was too drunk to do a good job and I just shouted and ran like hell.

At age 19, I didn't know what I know now about men.

I'm starting to wonder why other women on this thread are so trusting? Have you not experienced any of this?

I have lived in London since I was 23 (I am now 50) and have never once been groped or sexually assaulted on the tube or anywhere else.

Edited to add that I have spent lots and lots of these 27 years walking around alone, and after dark, and in less prosperous parts of the city.

mycatisanarcissist · 06/06/2024 14:15

BeGutsyCat · 06/06/2024 14:12

@mycatisanarcissist but the scenarios you list are in public? European cities, including London, are all extremely dangerous so DD will encounter that anywhere.

Re: the male employer (not in public), I also think generally it is dangerous, but it might be dangerous with an oblivious wife or wife in denial too. Wealthy people can be screwed up – I've read some horror stories about wives turning a blind eye to sexual abuse of their nannies/au pairs, or persecuting those girls as if it was their fault. Overall I think being an au pair is quite dangerous, but it's a tradeoff if OP's DD gets what she wants and takes many precautions.

I realise that. I mentioned those scenarios because people were saying that it's not fair to not trust men in general, and it's sexism. I wondered why people are so trusting of men on this thread? I know that we develop our attitude from experiences. Have they not had any bad experiences? I have and other women I know have had many. Maybe I'm sidetracking the thread a little. If so, apologies.

mycatisanarcissist · 06/06/2024 14:16

AndiOliversGlasses · 06/06/2024 14:13

I have lived in London since I was 23 (I am now 50) and have never once been groped or sexually assaulted on the tube or anywhere else.

Edited to add that I have spent lots and lots of these 27 years walking around alone, and after dark, and in less prosperous parts of the city.

Edited

I'm very petite (5ft). Maybe that was one factor.

I had multiple gropings in a 9 month period, usually when I was in a crowd and I had no idea who had just put their hand up my skirt or squeezed my bum.

Julimia · 06/06/2024 14:19

You can think and be anxious as much as you want but it is really your daughters decision. Can't see why a single dad is any riskier than any other family arrangement tbh.

BeGutsyCat · 06/06/2024 14:19

@mycatisanarcissist I don't think people are saying there isn't any risk at all, only it's probably not the same overstated risk as... Going into a cage with a feral lion.

Single fathers DO need childcare. There's still a good chance it's a legitimate employment/gap year/whatever OP's DD is looking for opportunity. So to say no immediately instead of doing a bit more research and taking precautions also strikes me as a bit extreme.

A high % of sexual abusers are male, but that doesn't mean a high % of males are sexual abusers...

AndiOliversGlasses · 06/06/2024 14:20

mycatisanarcissist · 06/06/2024 14:16

I'm very petite (5ft). Maybe that was one factor.

I had multiple gropings in a 9 month period, usually when I was in a crowd and I had no idea who had just put their hand up my skirt or squeezed my bum.

I’m hardly strapping- 5 foot 4.

I’m sorry you had such a negative experience but it’s not mine at all, and I can’t recall any friends telling me they have been randomly assaulted either.

mycatisanarcissist · 06/06/2024 14:22

AndiOliversGlasses · 06/06/2024 14:20

I’m hardly strapping- 5 foot 4.

I’m sorry you had such a negative experience but it’s not mine at all, and I can’t recall any friends telling me they have been randomly assaulted either.

I felt like I had a target on my back when I was living in London.

I wondered if it was just me. Then #MeToo happened and I learned it wasn't.

Although, I am glad for you that you and others have never experienced it.

I guess it explains why some people don't agree with me.

BeGutsyCat · 06/06/2024 14:25

AndiOliversGlasses · 06/06/2024 14:20

I’m hardly strapping- 5 foot 4.

I’m sorry you had such a negative experience but it’s not mine at all, and I can’t recall any friends telling me they have been randomly assaulted either.

Congratulations on your impressive immunity, but I've also been harrassed and groped many times in London fwiw. Sometimes by posh men in a nice area. Possibly my race (East Asian) plays a part as well, as posh white men (some of whom look like fathers!) think they can get away with it more with a cultural outsider? Idk. I grew up in a very safe busy city in my home country so it was/is very traumatising for me.

Regardless of the reason, I don't think it's at all helpful to try to undermine other people's experiences. London has a very high rate of recorded sexual offences (eg on public transport), so unless these men are just groping and humping the seats in an empty carriage, and it was the Tube seats that gained sentience and reported them, obviously victims exist...

These are also only the recorded/reported offences – from personal experience, police don't care and won't report it if the groping etc is too "mild" or the guy is long gone.

spriots · 06/06/2024 14:25

I am also petite and have never been sexually assaulted or groped on the tube. Yes in clubs

I am really sorry to hear of your experiences @mycatisanarcissist