DP called me a middle class racist

[Whoswhoof]

Just now. Discussing the upcoming election. Both always voted labour. I said I’m voting Tory in the upcoming GE for a multitude of reasons, some of which come under the bracket of gender identity, kids sex ed, general tightening of illegal immigration, not taxing private schools. I explained you kind of just have to vote for the party that most aligns with your beliefs as you’re never going to agree with all of them (I don’t agree with a lot of Tory policies, but the ones that are important to me are relevant)

DP then jokes “So you’re a middle class racist now!” Then says only joking. DP will be voting labour.

Aibu to think this is quite out of order?

edited for typo!

Ha ha. Yes, they have millionnaires of different skin colours in their cabinet.

Immigrants wanting to deport immigrants is ironic, yes.

But OP is clearly from a family that had the privilege to be able to move here "legally", and doesn't give a stuff about anyone who doesn't have those advantages and has risked their life to get here.

Exactly. People repeatedly saying UK needs immigration (so let’s let anyone in who wishes to come) isn’t helping anyone.
Controlled, possibly points based immigration is an entirely different matter.

Immigrants wanting to deport immigrants is ironic, yes.

PP said her grandparents were immigrants. I don't think anyone, even immigrants, supporting immigration control is ironic.

If they did things the legal way, paid money, took years, now pay taxes, then...?

Pretty much everyone wants some immigration control except for a few, anyway

You re not being ridiculous, cookie. Op has obviously forgotten about the Windrush scandal which left many of her gp’s generation being deported because they were suddenly “illegal”.

It’s interesting how ridiculous we think things are - until they happen. it would take the election of a far right leader who decreed that a British citizen was one who could trace their ancestors back four generations for @Whoswhoof to also find herself being deported as an illegal.

Reading through your posts you sound like the worst kind of ‘rags to riches’ person who now wants to pull up the ladder behind themselves and protect only their own interests. Which is essentially, the Tory approach - low (ha) taxation and low social support.

The notion you’d deprive the 93% of children at state schools the help desperately needed as you find it ‘appalling’ private schools would tax those rich enough to afford it is a clear expression of this.

If my partner were to vote Tory I would genuinely leave them as it would mean our value were completely misaligned. To me, voting Tory at this point means you’re only interested in yourself, but also a little bit stupid as they’ve not even managed that bit right.

Reading your posts has actually made me feel really upset. We’re all humans and we need to learn to raise each other up not punch down for ourselves

We do have a points based immigration system. That's why we have huge amounts of legal immigration under the Tories. Their post brexit points based immigration system. As usual, they have made a pigs ear of it.

Deporting immigrants to Rwanda as the Tories want is not a balanced and sensible approach to immigration control.

Labour is not planning to open the door and welcome everyone in.

Under the Tories we have ridiculous levels of uncontrolled immigration and no plans to deal with it other than this batshit, probably illegal and cruel scheme which has so far resulted in nothing happening at all, and also we had that fun time when they sent a load of taxpaying, settled Windrush immigrants to countries they hadn't been to in decades.

If you hate immigrants and want them to be let in indiscriminately but then treated terribly, vote Tory. If you are an immigrant and feel like you'd like to shake things up and take a risk on randomly being sent "home", vote Tory.

If you want immigration but with checks and balances, vote Labour.

Just what I was going to say.

What you’re after is hard to achieve. I assume something similar to Aus?

You can but they are pretty hardcore. Oddly on threads on here people say it’s a good thing when Aus do it, well the one the other day for example

If you want immigration but with checks and balances, vote Labour.

Do you mean the elite border security idea?

sorry, i’m not following- your grandparents were immigrants, their generation was utterly screwed over by the tories and the windrush scandal, yet you’re voting tory because you want less of the thing that is the reason you’re here?

I just don't know understand how someone who has consistently voted either Labour or Conservative as an adult can change horses, so to speak. The core values of the two parties are so fundamentally different that it would mean changing one's beliefs completely.

No. There are very specific reasons that small boat Channel crossings increased entirely unconnected to general migration movements.

How do you think we get landslides on both sides?

Many switch

This is exactly the sort of attitude that completely alienates floating voters.

Again, Tory voters are not necessarily stupid or immoral, they may well just believe in a different route or a different version of “better”.

It’s absolutely laughable that you seem to think you are of superior intelligence when you are completely unable to comprehend that others may have different views without reverting to black and white stereotypes.

So it’s appalling that some parents may have to take their children out of private school but it’s ok that the NHS is on the backbone of its arse with people dying on trolleys on corridors, it’s ok that 30% of children in the Uk are living in poverty, it’s ok that people fleeing war and torture are being blocked from entering the country and plans in place to deport to Rwanda- a country with a poor human rights record? It’s ok that street homelessness is a lifestyle choice? The appalling treatment of the Windrush generations happened under Tory rule.
I understand your husband’s viewpoint- I don’t think I could remain in a relationship with someone who voted Tory - ( with the current Tory party). It would mean that their priorities and their moral compass would not align with mine. I don’t agree with a lot of Labour policies but the Tories have decimated this country. And I can’t even bring myself to discuss their actions during Covid . Immoral, cruel and negligent are the mildest terms I can come up with. You say you grew up on a tough council estate but now are clearly financially very stable. Time to check your privilege ..

Because there are a lot of middle-ground voters who most of the time lean in the same direction but once in a while are tilted slightly the other way by current circumstances.

The tribalism of UK politics is one of the reasons the system is utterly broken and unfixable. Turnover in government is driven entirely by the middle-ground in a very few marginal seats. Most votes cast don't end up contributing to the outcome - and this encourages apathy and ignorance of politics and current affairs.

At the moment both of the parties are pretty central, so there really isn’t a huge amount between them. This has tended to be the case e.g. with new labour, apart from the Corbyn fiasco.

People often don’t like to admit this as it doesn’t fit the evil baby killing tories narrative.

All party’s in history allowed men in woman’s prisons because
No single party clearly stated than only biological women were allowed in womens prisons.
The issue with trans women wanting to be in woman’s prisons is a very recent thing pushed by Stonewall and transwomen.
If an issue doesn’t exist how can it be legislated against.
Imagine in the early days of single sex prisons anyone in Government thinking ‘oh, maybe we should define what a women is ‘.😳

Only recently, under the present Government, has there been a need to do this

No, the Torys are not "pretty central" at the moment. Stop kidding yourself.
Have you looked at who's in the ascendent in the party at the moment?

Funny how many pro-Tory NHS employees who hate the NHS pop up on threads like these, all saying similar things which don't ring true at all to me as an actual NHS staff member. Almost as if they're making stuff up to suit their own agendas.

I have never had a meeting about pronouns or toilets, and I work very closely with the EDI and HR teams (I'm a staff disability champion, in a voluntary role which I do outside the hours of my substantive role) so you'd think if these were happening all the time I'd have noticed. Most of the work the EDI team do is collecting and analysing data that they're told to by the government. For example looking at whether a particular ethnic group has higher rates of particular illnesses, worse outcomes etc. Why certain sections of society have decided to believe that they spend all their time on trans related work I do not know.

My substantive role revolves around data and finance. We have to make nearly 70 million in cuts this year, dictated by the government. 70 million cut from an already struggling service. So yeah, I really have no time for the obvious lies and manipulations that the NHS is responsible for it's problems.

Yes, they are. You might not like it because it doesn’t fit with the “hard right racists” narrative but the current (and recent) conservatives are centre right.

But the thing is, who a family somewhere decide and can afford to send over is not always necessary the type of immigrant the UK actually needs.
You are talking about asylum seekers here, but in your previous post it sounded more like you were referring to economic migrants.
These are surely two separate groups?
Genuine asylum seekers deserve help whether or not they bring the required skills for the local job market.
But if you say “the UK needs immigration” I would assume you mean people who can work in shortage occupations?

Yes. I am a hospital consultant of 25 years. The idea that we have time in a busy MDT meeting to discuss pronouns is ridiculous.

The GPs I speak to are at the end of their tether. There is funding for ‘additional roles’, so pharmacists, dieticians and PAs etc. But they are not allowed to use it to hire a new GP. Which is what all staff there think is needed. They have excellent young GPs wanting to start work but they can’t hire them with that money; it is ring-fenced for other staff.

There are too many other problems to list. But I would say 80% are due to the government.