Male carer changing daughter’s nappy

[FirstTimeMummyHK]

AIBU to expect the nursery to tell me in advance that a man has now joined the nursery and will be changing my daughter’s nappy? We have been with this nursery for a while and there were only female carers there. The other day I went to pick up my daughter and there was a man sitting in there and I asked the nursery manager quietly
whether he changes my daughter and she said yes he would do. The nursery manager was very grumpy that I mentioned it. I was very nice and
polite to her. I felt that her reaction to my
question was unnecessarily grumpy. I am part of a religion where it’s quite a big deal to separate men and woman although we are not orthodox. I understand that nurseries wish to preserve equality etc and I am
a huge supporter of
men taking on caring roles. However AIBU to expect to be told in advance that a man would be changing my daughter / taking her to the toilet/ wiping her private area??

Two NSW men jailed for horrific child abuse offences | Australian Federal Police (afp.gov.au)

Ashley Paul Griffith named as childcare worker alleged to be one of Australia’s worst paedophiles | Queensland | The Guardian

Male childcare worker on sexual assault charges | Canberra CityNews

You would in Australia. 3 in recent years, despite the tiny percentage of males in childcare.

I agree so much with your post and I’m sorry you were assaulted.

When I was 6 years I had a vivid memory of my old my paediatrician being absolutely enraged because I wouldn’t strip off for an examination.

He would bribe me with lolly pops if I was “good”.

I never got a lolly pop because I was never good. I admit I was an awful child who was born angry at the world and had zero respect for anyone in authority.

But even at 6 years old I knew I didn’t need to strip for him to hear my heart with his stethoscope and his anger and attempts to scare me didn’t mean anything.

Many years later (I was in my late 20’s) my mother told me that my old Paediatrician was convicted of child SA abuse of many of his patients. We had moved away when I was seven so I never saw him again - but he was my paediatrician until we moved.

Those who have never been near this evil have no idea.

If the OP felt uneasy there is a very valid and real reason for this and she is not being unreasonable.

I wonder what the professions are of these men who are high earners and working with children.

That seems contractory for most child caring professions.

As someone who was sexually abused by a male swim school teacher attending through primary school and as a mother of a infant dd, I would remove my dd from this nursery setting op.

Hmmm I’m really torn with this one. For some reason it doesn’t sit right with me either but is that sexist because we are not used to saying men in nurseries? Or care giving roles in general, they tend to be dominated by women.

Of the Australian links I posted upthread, that one involving Ashley Griffith is heartbreaking. He abused over 90 children.

Twice, people made complaints against him but they didn't lead to charges or his approval to work with children being questioned. In one case, because his colleagues backed him and said what he's been accused of doing was impossible.

He wasn't arrested - nor were parents aware of any allegations - until his huge online collection of media depicting the abuse was detected through other means.

And please don't think that rapey men, women who defend them and police who don't take them seriously are a uniquely Australian phenomenon.

I thought nurseries should have controls over this so that no single carer is alone changing a nappy anyway to remove risk of abuse/allegations of abuse
Not sure what religion it is though- my son's nursery had male muslim carers which I thought was great - i don't remember anyone objecting/questioning and the range of cultures attending was huge

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/devon/8331284.stm

https://www.bromsgroveadvertiser.co.uk/news/national/24338887.nursery-worker-jailed-14-years-manslaughter-baby-girl/

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/nursery-worker-17-who-photographed-2478799

https://www.familylaw.co.uk/news_and_comment/nursery-worker-charged-with-sexual-abuse

https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/second-worker-nursery-baby-killed-charged-neglect/

https://www.cps.gov.uk/mersey-cheshire/news/nursery-worker-sentenced-shaking-child

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2009/jun/10/nursery-worker-charged?CMP=gu_com

YANBU. This will be the next way men try to access children, working in nurseries.

Move your DD. The way the manager responded would not fill me with confidence.

For heavens sake, wake up everyone. This isn’t about saying only women can work in nurseries, this is about being aware of the risk of predators.

Unrelated men shouldn’t be changing children’s nappies at nursery.

And yes, I know most abuse happens in families, but do not override your own instincts.

So you do all the nappy changes at home? Does your husband/partner change his daughter's nappy/bathe her?

@Commonhousewitch Have you given a single thought how this idea of no single sex carer should be allowed to give single sex care to a child alone would affect fees .
This would of course affect care to girls/boys and female and male carer. It would make childcare at nursery and and child minders unaffordable .
You can't because of the law just pick on one sex .
And then you have to take into account all other care given to different areas such as ambulances , any other care like an old person waiting for a bath/shower . Do we make this person wait ??
We'll have nuns doing old persons care again .

I think your being unreasonable but I totally respect your views and feelings

but if you feel that strongly you should of moved your child immediately.

So do you get undressed in front of your husband/partner at home? What about random men you haven't met? If they've been DBS checked that's OK, right?

Or do you, unbelievably, give different men different access to your body and your intimacy based on how well you know and trust them?

Ffs why do you keep talking about your daughter's vagina. If this is real you can approach the nursery and ask for female only care for your daughter. If they wont comply with your request you'll need to get a nanny or child minder.

If you have religious beliefs then you need to make your own arrangements in line with this. You can debate the rightness or wrongness of a male caregiver until the cows come home but the nursery has a right to employ who it wants and also there is equality legislation. It’s very simple, you don’t get to impose your beliefs. Parents choose care for their children based on a range of criteria important to them. Do the same.

You're not being unreasonable at all.

A male friend of mine was starting out in early childcare years ago and he said it was very obvious that most of the mothers were uncomfortable with it so he didn't pursue the career.

You're allowed to be uncomfortable by this and as parents we are allowed to do a risk assessment and differentiate by gender.

Exactly this. It's absolutely fine if you don't feel comfortable with a male caring for your daughter but you cannot expect nurseries not to employ men. Employers are subject to equality laws which means they cannot turn a man down for a job purely on the basis he is male- that is literally the law. Yes, there are certain jobs where equality discrimination law does not apply and there are specific exemptions (eg shelters for abused women etc) but a nursery isnt one of those jobs.

Therefore, regardless of whether you feel it's right or wrong, you should make your own childcare arrangements or look after your child yourself. If you wish to have control over the gender of who looks after your child then take control and sort the childcare out yourself. It really is that simple.

That's entirely different. A vagina is an adult sex organ. And it isn't wiped when giving personal care, the vulva may be.

A baby / toddler's nappy change is a cleaning of the organs that produce human waste.

Exactly.

Also: Lucy Letby. Being female didnt stop her did it?

Even if she gets a childminder of the sex she wants she can't regulate who childminder has in her house who her sons are , who her husband is she can't even say whether the childminder has visitors or not . She is on a hiding to nothing unless she has the big bucks for a nanny .

https://www.abs.gov.au/media-centre/media-releases/97-cent-sexual-assault-offenders-are-male

So changing nappies should only ever be a woman’s job?!

As if we don’t have enough shit to deal with.

Yes but it could also be a time when an abuser chose to touch the child inappropriately unfortunately.

Using the word "vagina" to mean "vulva" is a common vernacularism in English.
Some people are language pedants all the time. Others, only when it's a way to shut up women talking about their boundaries.

You're basically saying every male is a paedophile