How the erosion of LGBT rights effects female sex based rights.

[needatalk]

I've been reading various discussions and articles on this topic for some time and the conclusion that keeps popping up in my mind is the worry that my female rights will be as much eroded as LGBT rights in law.

I've seen a push in America especially Florida from activists and lawmakers, combining female and LGBT rights in the same grouping. In the UK, politicians are taking American policies. They are calling for diversity and equality to be dismantled in law. It's like time is going backwards in just on LGBT rights but on female sex based rights. Where less rights will exist for us females in the future to do subjects such as STEM or be Astronaut because of the stereotyping happening from suppose feminists who's concepts are the old typical stay at home leave the male to do the dangerous or go to work mentally.

My daughter is 8 years old and and I worry for her, to not able to have the right to do express herself as bisexual or lesbian because of erosion of LGBT rights. We all know homosexuality a long time ago was illegal and that can happen again for all LGBT rights. I worry that my daughter who loves space won't able to follow Rosemary Coogan become an astronaut which is something she dreams of because in the future people will say the radiation of space is too dangerous for females as they will get deformities in that area to prevent them for having babies or healthy babies. Science has disprove this but people are dismissing science now.

As much as I care and support about sex based rights, I can't forget the thought in my mind that my and my daughter's female rights are in as much danger of being taken away not by activists but by lawmakers who enforce sex based past stereotyping and us females lose equality which has been hard to fight for in the first place.

I'm so worried for the future for us females.

Yes I'm fully aware of that however the provision for abortions is still not adequate despite decriminalisation. And yes abortion needs to be decriminalised in the rest of the UK yet MPs are not doing this in spite of campaigns to do so. "In time" is not good enough. Hence why I think it's dangerous for the rights of women and girls for some women to be cosying up to right wing groups or voting for the Tories in their arguing for trans people to be denied bodily autonomy when they could be fighting for all women in the UK to have access to safe abortions.

That's reminded me to email my MP again.

Lots of people think gender ideology is dangerous nonsense, because it is.
When an idea is bad enough, its detractors will include people all across the political spectrum. Expressing objections isn't "cosying up" to anyone, and doesn't mean we share the diverse beliefs or political goals held by every person who also thinks men can't become women, the earth is round or that the pope is Catholic.

Scientists will always believe in science. So nobody in that field will be dismissing the scientifically proven facts.

Cranks might dismiss science, but luckily for your daughter they won't be the ones employing her if she does indeed intend to follow that path.

Just be careful of shoehorning her. Almost every 8 year old in the world is interested in space and dreams of becoming an astronaut. Very few of them still dream of it by the time career choices come around.

Where less rights will exist for us females in the future to do subjects such as STEM or be Astronaut because of the stereotyping happening from suppose feminists who's concepts are the old typical stay at home leave the male to do the dangerous or go to work mentally.

Those bloody feminists eh? Always going around trying to stop girls from becoming astronauts and arguing that women, sorry 'females', should stay at home. They're always doing that stuff, aren't they?

Its definitely attracting more people from one side of the spectrum though isn't it? Why do you think that is? What do you think about some prominent "gender critical" people who don't vocalise opposition to people who also don't believe in the rights or freedoms of women and LGB people? What about famous people who are "gender critical" and support known abusers of women? Do you think that's all good for women in the long run?

@needatalk - "Where less rights will exist for us females in the future to do subjects such as STEM or be Astronaut "

You...what? Show me anywhere that it says women/girls have - or should have - no right to study any given subject? You're confusing "opportunities" with "rights".

The problem, at least in the last century (approximately, probably closer to 80 years), hasn't had anything to do with the rights to study anything, it's the social opportunity.

If anything, we may have overshot the target in our desire to correct the balance of opportunity. In my own field, I've come across lots of female developers who are - frankly - shit at the job, having been pushed into it by the "girls can code!" advertising mantra. The result is that most male devs arrived in this career because they love computers and making them do things they weren't designed for and will work tirelessly just to solve that one last problem that's bugging them, but it seems (anecdotally, and purely in my experience) that a worrying number of female devs are here because they were told they should like it and actually end up just phoning it in because they really, really don't. The more of those there are, the worse it gets for all women in tech.

That's not to say that women shouldn't be developers - after all, I'm one myself. But it's something they should be into because they actively want to, not because they were made to want to. I suppose it's the difference between "show" and "persuade"...it should be a free choice, not putting a finger on the scale to force it - that's no longer a free choice.

Have you got any receipts for that because I don't follow. Or are you just doing this?

OP, maybe you should get involved with some of the feminist groups and discussions and actions happening right now in the UK. At least then you'd have a grasp of what's actually happening.

I'd say seen as you're the one quoting me twice now without actually opposing any of my points that it's you doing that, no? Do you not have anything to actually counter what I said? No, because you don't have your examples of them critiquing the right wing parties and their actions against LGBT people and women do you? And you know your fave supports abusers as well. God some posters on here act how teenagers used to post on twitter a decade ago their "memes".

Who critiquing what 'right wing parties actions against LGBTQ people and women'? What 'fave'? Itd be easier to have a discussion if you said who and what are you talking about.

The actions being taken against women right now are removing sex based rights and language, including the rights of lesbians to be same sex attracted.
Its indefensible. Its not inclusive, its not kind and its not progressive.

And there you have it. Three women who believe in sex, not gender. This is a bad faith thread.

I'm sticking with my opinion that 'LGBT' is a construct.

Do the vocal prominent GC campaigners loudly and unequivocally criticise the right wing parties attacks on LGBT people and women's bodily autonomy when they express support for these GC campaigners? No in fact you rarely see some of the GC feminists using their large platforms for anything other than anti trans stuff so no suprise they don't get around to highlighting the dangers of right wing groups and their attacks on women's bodily autonomy. Are there not numerous GC posters on here posting their support for the Tory party regardless of how deadly they have been for women in this country and encouraging people to vote for them because they agree with them when it comes to denying rights to trans people? The same MPs who won't decriminalise abortion are being praised and voted for by "feminists" because they publicly attack trans people.
I think you know exactly who your GC fave is and I don't think anyone should be a celebrated "feminist" when they support men known to abuse women.

You're talking about Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull aren't you?

Why can't you just say it? She's not fucking Beetlejuice.

Yes, gender critical views cross political lines. I disagree with many of KJK's views outside the basic fact that men can't become women.

I also don't completely align with Julie Bindel, another prominent gender critical person who can hardly be accused of trying to erode women's reproductive rights.

I also don't completely align with JK Rowling, as much as I applaud her speaking out for women and using her considerable financial clout to to do amazing things.

Your forced-teaming game is poor.

Lmao no I wasn't actually but thanks for bringing up another one who is supported by right wing groups. I was not mentioning names because tbh there's too many to pick from so it's interesting to see who people name for themselves.

Speaking of JKR do you applaud her for supporting abusers? How many anti trans tweets doe she have to write to make that okay? Do you not think she could use her financial clout to help women in other ways than using it to attack trans people? Not even using her words to denounce support for example from right wing senators who don't believe in abortion who quote her publicly? Is she using her platform consistently to call for full decriminalisation of abortion for example? More than she's using it to argue with random trans people online?

Do you think there is no risk to people not publicly and loudly critiquing the actions of the right wing who are attacking women's rights? There are prominent GC campaigners who do not do this because they know that right wingers are boosting their tweets and posts online and they don't want to alienate them -yet.

Speaking of JKR do you applaud her for supporting abusers? How many anti trans tweets doe she have to write to make that okay? Do you not think she could use her financial clout to help women in other ways

Like this?
https://philanthropicpeople.com/profiles/j-k-rowling/

Aye, sure you were 😂

I've never seen JKR post an anti trans tweet but I'm sure you'll point us to them. Or do they go to another school too?

Another one who can't counter any points or answer any questions then. Such an interesting contribution for everyone. Thank you!

What rights do you think trans people are being denied?

I've heard this statement made many times and it's always by people who do not seem to understand what the debate is about.

Gender reassignment is a protected characteristic under the EA 2010. You do not need to have a GRC or any medical intervention to be protected from discrimination by this law.

In contrast a trans person can apply for a GRC and be given a new birth certificate which aligns with their identity. Who else in society can legally obtain a fabricated birth certificate?

OP I think you are missing the main reason that the religious right is gaining traction, it's a backlash against accusations of bigotry against anyone who understands the material reality of biological sex, thinks single sex spaces are important and that children should not receive experimental medical treatment which has lifelong consequences.

The gaslighting and bullying by trans activists has done the recruiting for the religious right, which I agree may have long term consequences for women and anyone LGB.

All your points were nonsense though. Those tweets?

So you are doing the 'if you agree with anything a right wing person says, you're in bed with the right' thing? I think GC campaigners are busy being GC campaigners, not making comment on other people's views on other issues. People are allowed to agree with each other on some things, and disagree on others. That's normal. Purity spirals don't generally lead anywhere useful.

You seem to have equated wanting women's sex based rights, with 'denying right to trans people ' or 'attacking' transpeople. Transpeople have the same rights are everyone else, but they, like everyone else, don't have the right to try to force others to believe what the believe. Me saying I don't believe what you do, is not me attacking you. Plurality of views is allowed, in a democracy.

I still don't know who this 'fave' is who supports men who abuse women. JKR? Maya Forstater? Kathleen Stock? KJK? Helen Joyce? No idea.

Another one who can't counter any points or answer any questions then.

Is asking you to post these anti-trans tweets not countering a point?