Would you make a complaint about these paramedics?

[WatermelonWaveclub]

I went to my GP the other day as I kept fainting when coughing. The GP said my HR was sky high. Then I coughed and fainted in front of the GP. Afterwards I couldn't move my legs properly. She phoned the hospital who said I need an ambulance. The GP got someone to get me in a wheelchair and take me to the nurse's room where I was put on a bed in a cubicle.

Anyway a few minutes later the ambulance crew turn up (3 of them). They did an ECG - ok but tachycardic. I said my legs were feeling ok by then. They did a lying and standing BP and checked I could feel both sides of my face, could hold both arms up, checked pupils etc. So they say they need to take me to hospital. They start heading off and so I follow them on foot. They're all walking ahead of me, chatting away, not one seeing if I'm ok. So consequently we get into the car park - I have a coughing fit and next thing I know I'm waking up on the car park floor.

I can't stop thinking about it. Were they at fault? Should they have used a wheelchair or at least someone walked with me? At the hospital they wouldn't even let me go to my scans etc in a wheelchair, I had to be taken in my bed. So if GP and nurse wouldn't let me walk was it right that the paramedics did?

That's the thing thinking back I don't understand why they didn't at least do that knowing I was liable to faint. And yeah, I thought I was going to die.

Not all ambulance workers are paramedics. Most are ambulance crew which is a far lower level of training. Just FYI.

they may not even be being paid (SJA volunteers).

This is what I'm thinking. More training is needed surely?

Because I had come round before they noticed.

I would raise with PALS. If there was a wheelchair to hand I'm not sure why they wouldn't have used it. It's not about getting the ambulance crew into trouble, but it sounds like they could use a reminder about not taking unnecessary risks when transporting patients. Next time the head injury could be much worse for someone.

Is that some kind of excuse?

I was too unwell to be making any kind of decision. (I'd actually had a brain bleed). They were aware I was following. Whether they expected me to wait I don't know and can't really say what was said to me as I was so unwell.

No. But not everyone is a paramedic. They’re registered professionals but not everyone on an ambulance is, a
so there are different codes of conduct.

Not saying this was good care but the OP may have made several assumptions.

We are going to enter "dare not question NHS workers" territory @WatermelonWaveclub

However, yes, they were clearly negligent here.

They had been told you were fainting, that you had experienced numbness on regaining consciousness, you were tachy. Yes, you should have been watched, they aren't there to chat they're there to provide care and in this case fell short.

I would report it. You could've injured yourself falling on concrete, you're lucky not to have sustained a head injury or broken bone. I would wonder how long it took them to notice you had lost consciousness again, so would ask to see CCTV from the car park.

I do find it hard to understand. Why risk a patient falling? Can anyone tell me why they think they made me walk? I honestly, don't get it.

I think I would conplain in the spirit of constructive criticism. I expect their Trust would want to ensure training for similar circumstances is up to date, as this is exactly the sort of situation that does lead to them being sued.

You fell and bumped your head whilst under their care, that is not optimum care and should be addressed, as the outcome could gave been much worse, both from the perspective of your health, and from the perspective of their legal liability.

I hope you're feeling better, sounds like you've been really poorly.

As they couldn't guarantee you not coughing a chair would have seemed sensible.

Not looking for compensation, no. Just wanting it not to happen to anyone else. It was the last thing I needed when so unwell.

I used to work in health complaints and would raise it. Everyone acts as if complaint = expectation of public flogging and abject apologies but they are often welcomed as one of the best ways of learning. Nobody learns from things that went perfectly!

It doesn't have to be aggressive or accusative, just send an email setting out the facts, say you're not making any sort of liability claim just wanted to highlight it to consider if anything should have been done differently to learn for next time. If they did anything particularly good you could highlight that at the same time.

Tbh I'm impressed you got an ambulance within a few minutes!

What would a complaint achieve? It wouldn't guarantee better future care for other patients, because every case is treated on what they see at the time. You can't blame them for what happened.

Did they make you walk, or did you just follow them? I don't understand why one if them didn't stay with you, but I would not have followed them, especially if I thought I might fall.

I hope you are OK.

As a nurse (in a former life and a different century), I agree completely with this.

Whilst there was nothing wrong in the paramedics expecting @WatermelonWaveclub to walk to the ambulance, they should have walked with her, rather than ahead of her. Basic common sense.

In your shoes, OP, I would complain because what happened shows they need a reminder that they should be escorting the patient to the ambulance. And if they were heading off to get the chair or trolley to wheel you, they clearly didn't communicate that to you properly.

Maybe not guaranteed better future care but surely some training based on this scenario will mean they will likely be over cautious rather than under cautious in the future to avoid a worse outcome

I was extremely unwell and not thinking straight so just followed them. I obviously got the impression I was to follow but can't say what was said or they definitely wanted me to follow. But I do remember one held the door open out of the nurse's clinic so they knew I was there. Noone stopped me following.

I keep thinking did they think I was making it up how unwell I was?

Shouldn't be an excuse and it's also not true, it's not a "far lower level of training"- a technician is the grade just below paramedic. There will always be either a paramedic or a technician on the crew.

Dear God what a bizarre attitude!!

OP I would definitely bring it to the attention of PALS, for future patient safety.

Really hope you're ok, that sounds horrible.

There is absolutely not a different code of conduct between registrants and non registrants.

Absolutely not true. You can have 2x Ambulance Crew with no EMT or paramedic on board. And it’s more likely now they’re using SJA as the ambulance auxiliary in England.

A non-registrant can’t be struck off or suspended by their professional body though.

@WatermelonWaveclub I do find it hard to understand. Why risk a patient falling? Can anyone tell me why they think they made me walk? I honestly, don't get it.
I work for the ambulance service. The crew would have made a dynamic risk assessment that would have included the fact that you felt well enough to get yourself to the surgery rather than call 999 from home if you felt the risk of falling so great. We go to lots of collapses/faints/syncopes which occur for many different reasons from a simple vasovagal episode to a heart attack or stroke. They would have considered all of this. Many, many patients are able to walk after they have recovered from a faint and we would not routinely carry people as much for patient dignity as well as for our backs. I do think they should have walked with you/kept an eye on you though but they're human and as a PP said, when there are 3 instead of the usual 2 it can be easy to think somebody else is. For what it's worth, they would have thought 'oh shit!' and reflected on this already, especially if they had a student with them.