Would you make a complaint about these paramedics?

[WatermelonWaveclub]

I went to my GP the other day as I kept fainting when coughing. The GP said my HR was sky high. Then I coughed and fainted in front of the GP. Afterwards I couldn't move my legs properly. She phoned the hospital who said I need an ambulance. The GP got someone to get me in a wheelchair and take me to the nurse's room where I was put on a bed in a cubicle.

Anyway a few minutes later the ambulance crew turn up (3 of them). They did an ECG - ok but tachycardic. I said my legs were feeling ok by then. They did a lying and standing BP and checked I could feel both sides of my face, could hold both arms up, checked pupils etc. So they say they need to take me to hospital. They start heading off and so I follow them on foot. They're all walking ahead of me, chatting away, not one seeing if I'm ok. So consequently we get into the car park - I have a coughing fit and next thing I know I'm waking up on the car park floor.

I can't stop thinking about it. Were they at fault? Should they have used a wheelchair or at least someone walked with me? At the hospital they wouldn't even let me go to my scans etc in a wheelchair, I had to be taken in my bed. So if GP and nurse wouldn't let me walk was it right that the paramedics did?

Did you tell them you had fainted several times when coughing over several days? If so, they should have either insisted you used a wheelchair to the ambulance or at least stood next to you/linked your arm as you were walking. However, you could have also informed them that you didn’t feel safe to walk, why didn’t you? Paramedics are worked to the bone and I’m assuming since you didn’t speak up and your observations were fine, it was probably just a misjudgment. I’d let them off.

What on earth? How do mumsnetters have so little respect for paramedics that total failure to do their job is excusable? So the paramedics didn’t take a proper inventory of the patient’s symptoms, didn’t know the patient was at risk of collapse, even though the y were called by the GP because patient had lost consciousness and its the patient’s fault?

Patients are frequently not fully conscious or can not give a clear account of the problem. The paramedics need to know how to assess the patient and make the tight decision about transportation. If you can’t get the patient safely to the ambulance you flunk. The patient is not responsible for making you sble to do your job.

I have been reading your updates and have changed my mind slightly, yes they were very careless and I’d flag it with the hospital to try and ensure a similar incident doesn’t happen. I wouldn’t try and pursue anything else though, especially if no lasting injury.

Except you were fully conscious as you said before. You were examined etc.
When the paramedics came round to the GP practice you had come round from the initial episode and were examined etc. You only fainted again AFTER the coughing fit on the way to the car park.

So you had made the decision while you were conscious to walk behind them, knowing full well what your symptoms were. This didn't start at the GP practice - you went there specifically due to those symptoms. I am ashamed for you seeing as you do not want to take ownership for your own actions as well. So the blame should be fully on the paramedics and not you as well?

My issue is that she chose to also walk behind them when she knew she had these symptoms and had just had an episode at the GP practise.
The paramedics may have been rubbish but why didn't she refuse and explain that she was scared she would faint again? She was unwell, she hasn't suddenly lost her mental faculties.

@pikkumyy77 Tell me the judgements, I'm not sure what you mean, but you're probably right.

Yes, this was my thought process at first. I thought they were both at fault, but the paramedics still should have done better in any case. I changed my mind because I read one of her updates saying she had a brain bleed and wasn’t thinking straight so it might have affected her judgement at the time. Regardless, it is up to the paramedics to ensure a patient’s safety as a minimum, so I do see OP’s point.

Complain. It's important.
Ignore the victim shaming previous post. This is poor by the 3 x paramedics. (We normally only have a crew of 2, not 3 per ambulance, so it's not the norm for my crew to be 3). And requires feedback. I worked (in finance admittedly, I'm not a paramedic) for an Ambulance company for the last 3 years.

I would, OP. Simple because I think NHS workers, in some cases, get away with murder (literally) because people are too scared to criticise them.

Their behaviour was poor at best.

I'd let it go tbh. What's the point in wasting all this time and energy fretting about it when you've been so unwell? Just move on and concentrate on getting better.

It’s quite normal now for 3 to be in a crew. One is usually a student paramedic on placement.

I wish people that clearly have no actual knowledge of todays modern ambulance service would stop spouting misinformation.

Except you were fully conscious as you said before. You were examined etc.
When the paramedics came round to the GP practice you had come round from the initial episode and were examined etc. You only fainted again AFTER the coughing fit on the way to the car park.

There are plenty of situations when people can be conscious AND not fully aware of the situation or the severity of their symptoms. They shouldn't have been walking in front of her. She was in their care. You observe the patient at all times.It's that simple.

OP had neurological abnormalities in the tests done by the GP which is one reason why an ambulance was called. She was later found to have a brain bleed - that’s about as serious as it gets. In no way should she be blamed and I am shocked anyone could think otherwise. Poor OP!

The ambulance staff knew she had a very recent history of repeated fainting. They should have walked next to her or got a wheelchair or trolley. Walking next to her to monitor her ongoing is the least they should have done. Would you allow your mum or child or friend or neighbour to just walk in this situation? I bloody wouldn’t. I’d walk right next to them.

My dad was fully conscious & telling the ambulance that he'd rather not go to hospital thank you.

(Would have been fatal not to!)

How is it Op's fault?

Sounds as if she shouldn't have been allowed to walk out of the GP's tbh.

Legs feeling ok in this instance-fainting, tested for a stroke doesn't really mean much does it?

The OP had just collapsed due to a stroke that left her legs not functioning for a time. She had been unconscious. She only just was starting to recover from that when she was directed to walk to the ambulance. Her observations were not normal. Her neurological exam was not normal. She has presented at the GP reporting lots of collapses over the last few days bought on by movement. None of this suggests a patient able to walk unsupervised.

She had just had a stroke, literally that’s her brain not working properly - she is hardly to be expected to make correct judgements in this situation.

the paramedics however are supposed to

That's fair enough if she had a brain bleed prior.
I just hate when people blame everyone but also fail to take ownership of their own actions.

There's no doubt the paramedics were rubbish. I didn't realise she had neurological abnormalities or a brain bleed prior that's why I wondered why she chose to also get up and walk ... In that case then she should complain

Did they offer you an appointment in a downstairs room? I’m surprised it was assumed you’d be safe and have the ability to climb the stairs.
It sounds as though you struggled to climb them and didn’t have help or supervision to climb down them, despite there being 2 risk factors of frequent faints and a suspected stroke.
I think you said that the neurological symptoms that the doctor identified were a transient weakness to both legs. Were other symptoms identified? Stroke symptoms are one sided as far as I’m aware but the doctor was still concerned enough to call an ambulance.
I don’t understand why you were expected to make the trip to the surgery on your own in the first place and were not offered a home visit or advised to call an ambulance given the risk of fainting and falling on route.
I’m baffled, several unknown factors, which is why I’d have thought not letting you walk to the ambulance would have been the safest option.

OP didn't say she had a brain haemorrhage before she went to the GP. If she was fully conscious and attended the GP knowing what her symptoms were, why didn't she refuse to walk. That was my question.

If a doctor tells me to do something risky, I will not do it if I do not feel safe. It's easy and quick to place blame on healthcare workers - which should be done in this case, however OP should also take responsibility if her brain bleed only came after the fall in the car park.

Why didn’t she refuse to walk? Because she had a brain bleed. Do you also think America didn’t exist before Columbus discovered it?

Yes, it's true I could physically walk. But I was likely to fall. And that could have killed me. So I think it's a bit more than a minor human mistake, tbh.

That's so sad, I'm sorry.