No phone for secondary school

[StillCreatingAName]

AIBU? I feel like I might be missing something obvious on this one, but honestly why do children need to take a smartphone to school? It’s baffling me as to why there appears to be parents on auto pilot buying their children smartphones (£££) now in year 6, ready for year 7 as though it’s part of a uniform policy (and then sharing their purchase on the class WhatsApp, give me strength).

Is this all just a fallout from lockdown times, people were sort of forced into screen life, so now there’s more children at secondary school with them, who may not have ordinarily had a phone until older?
I’m expecting dc to walk home with friends talking and socialising without the inclusion of a screen or mindlessly scrolling social media instead of listening to friends. I can see where a basic phone might be needed to contact home, but that doesn’t mean the phone should be out of school bag anytime during school hours should it, but maybe I’m just being naive, time will tell 🤷‍♀️?

AIBU to say children don’t need to get a £££ phone for starting secondary school? (It goes without saying they don’t need it at all for primary school, IMHO)?

It's lazy thinking saying that this is just life now. Yes it's life for adults but it doesn't have to be for children and young teens. Things can change and the evidence suggests it needs to.

I'm a secondary teacher and would happily see students not have smartphones. We set homework on Google classroom but there's absolutely no need to access it via a phone. It works much better on a laptop or desktop. I think most parents have genuinely no idea what their kids see and get up to on their phones. I spend my life dealing with the fallout, which is why DD won't be getting a smartphone until she's Y9 at least. Jonathan Haidt has done some very thorough research on how smartphones have caused a collapse in teen and tween mental health, which provides empirical backing to what I've seen for myself over the last 15 years of teaching.

Year 6 is last year of primary and most children turn 11 during that school year. You can figure out all the others relative to that one by adding on a year of age for every year of school.

I disagree with most, agree with PatFussy, I see it as essential, apps at school, forming friendships. I feel that parents who don't comply, (and it's easy to get a cheaper older phone) so their children a disservice.

Totally agree in theory but as others have said, their timetables are on there, homework etc.
Ours also have their bus pass as a qr code which is needed for the school bus.
The positives have outweighed any negatives to be honest. Things like being able to navigate train/bus times when they missed school bus, online banking when they went on school holiday and therefore didn't need cash.
Not sure if this is a boy/girl issue but mine are boys and not interested in social media (exc texting friends via WhatsApp) so phones haven't had negative impact. The Xbox however....!

Thank you!

I was at school during the seventies and early eighties. I left school with the sixth form of 1984.

I clearly remember people holding out against computers in schools (or anywhere really) because they had always managed with pen and paper so nothing needed to change. That went really well, didn't it??!! Why is it that we hold out against technology in this country in this way? As if we don't think that it is the future and would rather hark back to some "good old days" - maybe saying we didn't have it, so our children don't need it (or some such bollocks).

My Dad was rather like this and really didn't "do" change much at all. My mother is a little more progressive, but still doesn't really get it. No online banking or much in the way of internet for her. She does have an Alexa now though, which she likes for listening to the radio, the weather forecast, asking it for the time and listening to audio books (she can no longer read due to age related eyesight issues). So she has sort of seen some advantages that this can have for her now, but remains very limited in her use of it. As for smartphones or anything else, she asks me and my sister to look everything up for her, which we do.🤣🤣

If parents could see what I see in class you would be clamouring for the banning of phones in school and colleges... The catch 22 is students are not allowed their phones in class.
However it's hard getting them off their phones and they do have them in class.

Phones now also mean ear buds, u tube and so on and students can sit in class and be watching what they like.

Of course they can be told to stop but without removing the phone and with one teacher's, how do you police that and teach and deal with all the usual behaviours?

Schools won't admit this (obviously some of are much stricter than others), but it's an abomination on our younger people.

It's a blight on their lives.

Going to and from school, fine but really all school and college should have government backing to ban phones in class.

Unfortunately the chances are your child will need access to apps for subjects, homework, sports etc. The chances are all of their sports will require WhatsApp. As will their friendship groups.

By all means control and ensure you oversee the phone but if youns decide to not provide one then be aware there will be social consequences. Price wise I've never spent more than E100 and they have lasted years.

DS (15) uses his phone for
Bus Pass
Access school timetable
Accessing homework portals a d messages from teachers.
WassApp groups for - Orchestra, DoE, Explorers
Music composition app (gcse music)
Guitar tuner app
Keeping in touch with his friends.
Kindle app

They are not allowed their phones out in school, unless told by teachers for a specific purpose, and never at break time.

It is useful for keeping j. Touch with him after school sometimes, as he relies on a pretty shaky bus service.

DD(12, Y7) uses her phone for

Access school timetable
Accessing homework portals a d messages from teachers.
Keeping in touch with her friends

At DD's school, they have their phones in at the start of the day, and get them back at home time.

Although. Dd walks to school, Stevie a social butterfly who will ring to tell me she is going Tom x/y/z 's house straight from school, or for fibrin out where she is at times!

Both children have one phones of dh and mine's
Neither child has any social media

Those saying needed for school homework… it’s the same for my kids now in primary. So why not just access via family iPad/computer?

It's the 'fear' imo. I'm 'only' in my early 40s but I admit I'm way behind with the apps. And DD is 12 so is going to have lots of different stuff. But trying to ignore tech is (for want of a more elegant phrase) 'pissing in the wind'. It's not going anywhere, so (imo) we need to teach kids to use/work with it, rather than avoid it. Sorry for all the brackets!

@BingoMarieHeeler because they use it in class at times also. I don't see how it is practical for them to manage the necessary apps on a shared device. Mine has a school iPad and a smartphone, it is literally used as a ticket and information for his clubs, homework, gym pass, lunch account, library access qr codes etc

It wouldn't be possible to use a shared device as everything in the schools and clubs is created with a mobile user in mind.

It’s good to read some specifics on what they use it for at school. But correct me if I’m wrong, all apps can be used on other devices and it sounds like a dc could even-shock, horror- write down the homework in class if they didn’t have a smartphone with a specific app on, but could still submit homework later at home via an app, or complete it on a laptop?

It depends on the general thing in the class though I assume? DD will be starting secondary in sept, and will have a laptop. So I assume it's all going to be recorded on that. It's alien to me, but it just the way it is now.

Someone else mentioned family computer.
The issue with laptops/computers is that less and less families have one and are even less likely to replace/purchase one unless they are needed for another purpose (like a parent's work).
Same with tablets, while they are more popular, and a lot of families do have one, if you have to purchase a device anyway and funds are limited it's better and more cost effective to just get the smartphone (especially if you have one lying about anyway) that does everything than having separate devices.

That's the real advantage of a smart phone. It's small, portable, doesn't have to cost loads and replaces the need for several devices/tools.

Of course, some kids have it all and it's the expensive stuff too, but that's a different thread.

Also having multiple kids at various schools with various amounts of homework can make it hard to navigate with just one device.

The homework is usually uploaded to the app to avoid taking time from class. Do your children need a phone to access their lunch credit, library or gym?

It really will depend on your particular school, it wouldn't be possible in ours. I know in some classes they use the phones to participate in surveys, online assessments etc so whilst the school may be able to support an alternative access (school device?) do you want your child an outlier?

Depending on your child that may not be helpful to them.

I have to ask - why are school timetables on an app? Does it change weekly?

They don't need a cool phone, but they do 'need' a smart phone. They will be hugely disadvantaged if they don't. Apart from just being seen as odd/weird, they will soon be unpopular if they can't keep up with friendship groups and make independent social arrangements.
They also need homework apps, bus timetable apps, bus ticketing and live update apps, things are often not printed in schools, so they are asked to photograph worksheets etc. They should be able to call the police, childline, a taxi, even you. You might want to track them. They will likely want to read on it, listen to podcasts and audiobooks, have an online calendar, calculator, list their contacts, use word, read the news. So most of these things can be done in other ways, but why would you want to make life more difficult for them? If you can afford a it, buy them a bloody phone! If not I guarantee before the first Christmas, some other parent will have given them an old one or they will have bought one from someone at school.

Smartphones can be locked down to only give access to what the parents wish - DD (y6) has one, but it doesn't have an internet browser on it (chrome or similar), nor does it have YouTube. She can't install anything without DH or I approving it. She uses it for messaging friends, playing games (on specific apps), reading books online (Libby), maps. It also means we can see where she is on the way to/from school. We will slowly allow her more apps, and I realise she'll need an internet browser at some point, but this works well for now.

She does homework on a laptop (and I realise we are lucky to be able to provide one)

Some schools operate on a week1/week2 basis. Then you have the accelerated days or off time table days, the random changes of classroom (posted on the app) , they alternate things like art/d&t/food tech and so on.

My DS needs a smartphone for secondary school as his school bus pass is a QR code that changes daily and that's generated by an app.

That must be a right pain in the arse!

I am mortified to admit that despite trying, I have no idea how to work QR codes prepares for inevitable flogging