Stuck between parents and DH

[clawcliphurts]

My DH doesn't get on with my parents, they don't really particularly like him either. I am stuck in the middle as I love my parents even though they can be awkward and love my DH. I am tolerant of people and I can honestly tolerate most people - he says life is too short to "only tolerate people". So I am now presuming the only way forward is to see them without him being involved. He can't understand why I can't see how cold and rude they are- I find them very loving and I have never known any different.

He was brought up in a very different way and I find his family so het up and formal but I don't begrudge spending time or seeing them. Both my siblings got divorced last year and my DH is convinced its because of the in laws. He says he should have ran years ago when he first met them. I' ve told him I won't choose and he needs to be more tolerant - he says life is too short to "just be tolerant" and that he can't have them hanging over him for the rest of his life- I asked what he meant and he basically said "he needs to seriously re-evalaute our relationship" so I said what because of them and he said "totally" - they are ruining his life. AIBU? They have never done anything personally to him they are just very very different people.

Just wondering how you eat a cake in your family, OP, if sitting down and cake on plate is something extraordinary?

Your niece's celebration sounds fine. Its a different way of doing things and your DH can have have his own views but sulking and being weird about it is not on. He seems to have anxiety as does his mother and possibly more MH issues.

Perhaps a family or couples therapy could help. Is he able to see at least sometimes that your families are just very different and not everyone in the world is bound to live the way his family does? I have a similarly rigid person in my family and its not fun.

The main point of this thread in that OP's husband is being inflexible and extremely unreasonable. He needs to live and let live a bit more. If he's bullying OP to go no contact he is being abusive and it's important that she continues to see her parents when she wishes.

Yes because he thinks they are rude people and he shouldn't have to put up with their rudeness. No one should. It is not controlling to have boundaries. He has decided he has had enough of trying to tolerate people he doesn't like. He isn't asking her to choose. He is going to decide for himself.

He has been going along with this for 10 years. Everyone has their limit.

I allow my parents to use our bathroom but DH will not use his mums bathroom as he was brought up to use public conveniences instead of using toilets in relatives houses.

If the above is true, then I suspect that is just the tip of the iceberg. Very odd.

You think material gifts is the only way to show love?

Maybe your parents come over too frequently uninvited but your husband sounds awful. Hyacinth Bucket. With a major chip on his shoulder. <shudder>. Also, not using the toilet at your parents’ house? Wtf.

Is the not using someone else’s toilet a cultural thing?

Thinking it's rude to use someone's loo is extremely weird.

But they aren’t rude? Their behavior is well within normal bounds and is considered perfectly polite in many families.

And no one is objecting to him having whatever boundaries he wants: but he can’t enforce them on his wife and children.

No. But what other love are the grandparents showing them?

In your opinion. In other people's opinion, not even offering someone a seat when they visit is not "perfectly polite". Talking only about yourself is not "perfectly polite". Ignoring your grandchildren is not "perfectly polite".

He isn't enforcing anything on his wife and children. What he is doing is the exact opposite. He is basically saying, "I know I have no control over you and your family, so I need to decide for myself if I want to continue to be a part of this."

OP hasn’t said anything about them not showing love and we can only go on that. We know the children are extremely comfortable in their grandparents home. Unloved children don’t behave like that.

Material gifts aren’t always love, not getting gifts isn’t withholding love. What an odd take. OPs parents sound like perfectly reasonable boomer parents who are enjoying their retirement having brought up their children within a relationship where they are all extremely comfortable with each other. The relaxed atmosphere doesn’t scream of neglect or withholding emotional interactions. Everyone is very comfortable with each other (except the bonkers husband). My mothers side of the family is like this.

The other granny shows her affection in a different way also very acceptable within their relationship. My father’s side of the family are like her. Neither side fucked things up by making demands of us or the other people based on rigid perceptions of what is proper.

It’s ok for kids to have different relationships with different people and to receive different iterations of love and affection from different people. There is no one size fits all and they’re learning a good lesson in tolerance form that. It’s a shame their father can’t do the same.

Not buying gifts may be an ethical decision by the grandparents or may be they think they’ve contributed enough and don’t want to anymore. That’s ok too. Theres enough plastic crap on the planet, kids have enough toys etc. There was no mention of perhaps money in bank accounts etc that was all deemed irrelevant in the OP and it’s OPs own anxieties around what she perceives as normal and acceptable that makes her fake the presents from granny. That’s her hang up and a strange societal understanding that spending money on gifts is a measure of love and that’s not true.

The problem here is your DH's inflexible attitude and fixed ideas. His idea of "normal" is not everyone's "normal". Most people in long term relationships tolerate ILs they don't agree with out of respect for their partners. He's not being fair on you.

It sounds like a different sort of family dynamics but your DH sounds completely inflexible and not realising different families operate differently. Yours as you say are more relaxed when you can drop in whenever but it is take them how you find them and have to chip in and help on social occasions. I would say more families are like yours though than his although it doesn't sound like they are great grandparents. We have young grandchildren and when our DD and her family come over we do offer food and drink and play with our granddaughters and buy birthday and christmas presents for them. Seems strange if they are well off for them not to do that. Do they buy anyone Christmas presents?

Your MIL sounds like she enjoys hosting and is a little bit OCD with housekeeping etc. The not using the toilet is quite honestly ridiculous. What I would find intolerable is him essentially saying you have to choose between your family and him. They probably do not like him if he doesn't make them feel at home. What on earth is the issue with your mum making a cup of tea? We do that at our DDs house as they do at ours. I would say that we don't drop in unannounced though as they have an autistic DD who struggles with unexpected visitors even family. Is your DH neurodiverse?

Both my siblings got divorced last year and my DH is convinced its because of the in laws.

Bet it's 100% nothing to do with your parents. Your 'DH' sounds like a potentially abusive bellend trying to force you into not spending time with your parents TBH.

TBH OP, you sound like you had a good relationship with your parents (despite their 'quirks'). If your parents were awful people, I might get it. But they're not...so I really don't understand your husbands issue other than it being reverse snobbery/jealousy at best and attempts at isolating you from your family at worst.

Seeing your updates it seems you are not actually listening or engaging in anything that’s being said, you are adding different versions of the same thing slanting it so the wife’s side is the negative and the husbands is the positive or “normal” side.

what is you actually want from this thread op? From my perspective it looks like what you want to see is an excuse to tell him he is right and see less or none of your family.

i will say though that I should have added to my last post that yes I do actually get the annoyance he would have at your family dropping in unannounced or using a key when unexpected I would hate that too.
im not saying don’t have family round or that the toilet and kettle is out of bounds but I do like a bit of notice so I can get ready for visitors. Ie get a bra on and make sure the place is more tidy than not etc 😂

My mind is still boggling from not using the toilet in someone's house. What do you do if you're caught short? Go on a desperate hunt for a public loo?

But looking at the bigger picture, my family (working class) and DH's family (middle class)were very different from each other too, although it was my family where things were very informal and DH's family where life was a lot more structured. However, when visiting either set of parents, both DH and I happily adapted to the different modus operandi in each home, as did our children. And when both sets of grandparents got together in our home they were all perfectly happy to accept that we did things a bit differently from either of them. Isn't this just what everyone does all of the time, both in work and social situations?

The OP's DH has a big problem - how likely was it that he was ever going to find a partner whose parents did things exactly as his parents did, let alone agreed that it's rude to use someone else's loo! I wonder whether he isn't just using this as a ploy to introduce a pre-planned 'get out' strategy, while craftily scapegoating OP's parents as the real marriage-wreckers. If I were you OP, I'd come straight out and ask him if he is really angling for a divorce and I certainly would not be choosing his comfort over contact with my family!

@Yalta I think you make your own doilies ;) You could try places like Portobello Market in London or Etsy I would think.

Your husband sounds like a hideous prig to me. It's fine for people to have different styles, but to think you and your family's way is The One True Way and everyone else should fall in line is closed minded and twattish. Also very presumptuous to think he knows better than you why your siblings marriages broke up. And just generally an arsehole. What exactly do you find attractive about this chippy parochial wanker?

Just thinking a bit more about this thread, how is OPs husband going to react when the children are teenagers and they want to bring friends in and out or have them stay over?

Thats simply untrue. Their behavior is well within normal bounds and he is not simply deciding what he can tolerate he is chastising and verbally degrading OP for her parents perceived flaws.

The MIL has very severe Anxiety, Agoraphobia, and OCD around food, hospitality, and toileting. This is not an unusual set of mental health issues. The knock on effect on her children is also quite common. I am currently treating an elderly woman with the same profile and her two adult children basically split from the mother with one accepting and repeating the mother’s pathologies and the other rejecting them as too life limiting and painful for the grandchildren to exper. Exactly the situation for OPs DH and his sister.

Im not saying the MIL isn’t a nice person—she is! But its also not necessary to demonize OP’s parents in order to make sense of the DH’s loathing of them. The DH is incredibly rigid and rejecting of anything that is not just like his mother’s pattern of behavior. That is a problem for him—its not generated by reality. No one HAS to be so upset by the fact that other families do things differently. Its a choice he is making or, if not a choice, a spasmodic and unconscious response to social interactions which call into question that which must not be questioned which is mummy’s pathology. His response to OP’s family’s natural/casual interactions is not unlike the child of alcoholics discovering how odd social life with tea totalers is. He can’t tolerate it because he either finds it frighteningly different or it activates too much shame when he realizes how odd his mother’s household is.

I'd like to amplify this post. All of this.

I don't think this is black and white really. Your two families have different ways of behaving. His family is obviously more formal and yours more relaxed but then they forget birthdays and don't engage with the GC so it's not all good there either. MIL is over doing the hosting and your family might be under doing it or making no effort in other people's opinions. All families vary.
Personally, I like warning of guests and if someone just turned up let alone let themselves in and helped themselves I'd be a little surprised. That doesn't mean we're all walking on eggshells just there's a respectful boundary and I'm the same in their homes. Tea or whatever is offered as soon as someone walks in the door so no-one has to help themselves, want to use my loo? Just ask or say and I'll tell you of course, you know where it is. If you're more than a day visitor I'll tell you to help yourself to certain things (but not my choc stash!) and not wait for me to offer. Longer visits have a different vibe.
Sure, the toilet thing is weird and doillies went out with the plague but none of this should be deal breaking. Is your DH trying to control things or is he just a bit stiff and judgmental?

OP, when you call to see your parents do they look pleased to see you and do they greet your husband so he feels welcome? I still think he’s out of order but I’m trying to see every side and wonder if he feels like a spare part in their house. Even so he could always stay at home while you visit, he doesn’t have to try to stop you seeing them.