To want every women in England to vote Tory at the GR

[Hurrydash]

So I don't agree with Angela Rayner's description of the Tories as scum, but I get her drift and if she'd been more tempered in her language I probably would have bought in.

HOWEVER

For me - and actually should be got everyone - the only real issue at the next GE is freedom of speech/women's rights.

I see Labour as the destroyer of these and so must vote against them. The only meaningful way to do this is to vote Tory which I am reluctant but prepared to do.

Is this unreasonable?

Happy to be convinced - for real not just words - if there is evidence Labour (Starmer 1 in 1000 women have a dick) may see the light before the GE.

He.

@Moonmelodies

............................nothing to do with being given less money from the Tories 🙄

TBF at least the tories have been consistent with this approach, what with so many councils becoming bankrupt.

The Tories will paint it as council incompetence - nothing to do with them starving them of funds. The Tories, really are just awful.

For me - and actually should be got everyone - the only real issue at the next GE is freedom of speech/women's rights”

Rubbish. I’m a nearly 60 year old woman. Child poverty, homelessness, NHS waiting lists are my top 3, each issue affecting huge numbers of people.

I have never voted Labour before but I’m keeping my mind open until I read a full manifesto.

Manifesto also has to be giving a damn good explanation of how they are going to make changes. It isn’t good enough to simply say ‘we’ll more funds into XYZ’, I want to know HOW they will use this money to make improvements.

So one party can't protect women because they don't know one when they see one

And one can't protect women because they dont think they are worth protecting

Devil and deep blue sea there really

Since the parties are equally bad there I will vote on other factors

How are Labour potential Holocaust deniers? The anti-Semitism of some of their past - and perhaps present - members is completely unacceptable. However, it’s a massive leap to go from the anti-Semitic views of some of their members and then suggest they are potential Holocaust deniers.

Is there any real difference between the Tories and Labour on the trans issue? Genuine question.

The Tories seem to be trying to sort out the unfair system of child benefits, especially the discrimination against one income households (often single mothers). Admittedly, they've had a decade to do this, but I don't think it's clear that one party is for women and one against.

@ArcticOwl You're another one who simply doesn't get it. It's not personal feelings about 'Transfolk', it's personal feelings about men in our spaces. It's about men. Males.

And if you think voting based on the impact of womens human rights is so 'blind and stupid', then I say what is blind and stupid is you thinking it's NOT worth voting for. Why do you think so little of women that you don't believe we deserve human rights and that we are 'blind and stupid' for wanting human rights? WTF is wrong with you? I can't even....

When that one issue has so much impact on a person they vote based on it, that is not stupid.

You thinking voting on an issue that has so much impact on someone is 'stupid', is what is stupid.

One issue voting can be extremely wise.

Smaller parties have to be the way forward. Neither of them can be trusted to do the job.

No one is implying any such thing, @BelfastBelle05 , you're being hyperbolic.

If the Tories are so on the side of women then why did they invite an anti abortionist to give a speech and give him an award. Don’t forget lots of Conservative MPs are anti abortion and anti choice both not good for women!

https://amp.theguardian.com/global-development/2022/aug/09/uk-government-award-anti-abortion-figure-sam-brownback-edited-reproductive-rights-statement

@SoreAndTired1

BUT WHAT ARE THE TORIES DOING RIGHT NOW THAT IS SO GREAT FOR WOMEN?? THEY ARE IN POWER NOW AND HAVE BEEN FOR THE LAST 14 YEARS

sorry for caps lock - can't be bothered to re-type

Hard to get an impartial answer on this as clearly feelings run very high on both sides of the gender debate and both sides of the left/right political divide.

Labour have said they will modernise the GRC process which although isn't self ID many people are concerned it is very close to self ID.

Conservatives have made little actual legislation on the gender debate but have made small steps such as issuing guidance to schools.

There are politicians in both parties who are on either side of the debate. Conservatives probably have fewer pro-gender ideology MPs and voters, but the current 2nd favourite to succeed Sunak is Penny Mordaunt who firmly believes TW are women (while the slim favourite is Kemi Badenoch who is firmly against gender ideology).

If it is an issue that could swing your vote you'll probably have to wait and read the fine print in both party manifestos.

When was I patronising? If you think being pleasant and chatty is patronising you must be an absolute fucking gem.

If Labour get in because I vote them in, then I've blood on my hands when they continue to support the decimation of Palestinians.

I'd rather a single meaningless protest against something I believe in, as opposed to voting to keep tories out when to me it's like getting out of ted bundys car, just to accept a ride home from Fred West.

Anyway, thanks for you excellent input and invaluable advice.

They’re definitely not the way forward. Nothing would ever get done because they’d never get agreement on anything. Mind you, I’m really looking forward to a very small Tory parliamentary party.

You know that beloved trope on here, where someone says that there are transphobes posting on MN, and then the response is a faux-concerned request for evidence?

The repeated equating of transwomen and rapists on this thread is an example of the transphobia that is left to stand on MN.

Why on earth would anyone vote for a party based on just one issue?

Tories stand for the opposite of every other issue I stand for except that they recognise that biology defines sex. I would fuck myself and the increasingly vulnerable population by voting for them.

It's about MEN being rapists. MALES. How does pointing out that men rape women, remotely equal 'transphobia'?

Please explain your reasoning. I could come at misandry, malephobia, menphobia. But I genuinely don't see where transphobia comes into an issue of Male Violence.

This.
Another 5 years of Tory rule and more of all this is much more of a threat in my eyes!
No thanks.

I'm astounded that anyone believes the Tories on any issue, whatever your stance on the matter. They'll say anything right now not to be annihilated, and if that involves throwing vulnerable people under a bus, they will, whether it's women, trans people, the working poor, the unemployed, the sick, the disabled, fuck 'em all. If there's a divide and conquer available, and enemy to focus on, they'll do it. It's cheap, nasty politics. Don't trust them to focus on women's issues for a second.

I've just read on a previous post that sore and tired is in Australia (think I've got the right poster, apologies if not ) so not sure they really get what being under this Tory Government is like.
Despite being so vocal about it on the thread 😕

I think what @ColleenDonaghy is saying is that on MN, and in offline conversations, one can often find that people are suggesting that transwomen pose a threat to against women just because they are trans. I think Colleen is saying that this is incorrect and misleading. I think it can do lots of harm as it creates a climate of fear and makes transgender people a kind of modern-day bogeyman.

I won't ever vote Tory.

However, I'm not voting labour either. They've made it clear they don't want my vote.

They also can't give a reason to vote for them. They're just banking on the not tory vote.

I've spoiled by ballot for the last few years.