To dislike men who seek out foreign brides

[Hartley99]

There are quite a few documentaries about this on YouTube. The guy is usually ugly or boring or nerdy (usually all three). He claims to be ‘looking for love,’ when in reality, of course, he’s looking for a sexual partner. So he goes online and searches for girls in poor countries - often Thailand or Russia. In almost every case the girl is younger and/or much more attractive than him.

Recently, there was a documentary on channel 4, and I ended up having an argument with someone at work about it. They thought the whole thing was ‘sweet’ and funny and couldn’t see anything wrong. To them it made sense. The guy got to have sex with a girl out of his league, and the girl got to move to a richer country with more opportunities. To me it just seemed revolting. However you spin it, they are taking advantage of her poverty. They know that she wouldn’t look twice at them in any other circumstance. Apparently, after the invasion of Ukraine there was a massive spike in men looking for Ukrainian brides online. I mean that says it all. Or am I being uptight and judgemental?

I'm male, 40s, have worked abroad in SE Asia and the Gulf as a single person. I now believe that most of the Western men who go to these places alone (some are married but working away) find the extra sexual opportunities attractive and don't give a thought to the exploitative nature of what they are doing.

It made it difficult to make friends; in SE Asia every time I thought I'd found a new mate, they ended up suggesting we go to a club full of prostitutes, or a straight-up brothel. I'm not perfect, I just don't think sex is something you can buy so I wasn't into it. There were older men there with Filipina girlfriends; every so often they used to announce that they had got a "new one"', it seemed transactional.

I always felt that the sad sacks paying for a Thai bride to come over and live with them were basically the same men but without the qualifications to get a job abroad.

How exactly is it different from women in the U.K. marrying for money? If these women want to use their looks to better their lives by finding a stable man who’s to judge? Is it too reminiscent of Mr Collins and Miss Lucas?

Obviously I’m judging any men who are taking advantage.

I can't even look straight at men who go on "lads holidays" to Thailand.

My ex husband is planning to go with his married mate. Both just over 50 years of age (typical saddos!). Both retired police officers... 🤢 My years of marriage are tainted 🤮

My ex step family member got with a woman in Thailand he also had previous for being a wife beater, I dread to think what he put that woman and her kids through in a country with lax laws to domestic violence.

I remember watching an interview with a horrible man who said that most English women are unattractive and that’s why he married a Russian woman. If he didn’t have a British passport, she wouldn’t have looked at him twice.

I'm sure there was one Where the young woman came over ,was the guys cleaner and her social life consisted of watching him play dominoes in the pub... needless to say she went back home.

I can see what you're saying but it really is transactional. When visiting Thailand one of the women I spoke to said that her goal in life was to marry a Western man. I can see how some men get swept up into these situations and others go looking for it.

My own PIL are in a similar situation but married for love 40 years ago after being pen pals for years.

@ChesterDrawz then why do these men (or a vast majority of them) only pick young, attractive women to marry? They are making that judgement to begin with.

Very reasonable. One of my closest friends is Russian and one day we met up with another Russian friend of hers for a beach day. She was a beauty both inside and out but her Western husband who was in the house was horrible. He is much older than her and doesn’t let her have access to any money. She was only allowed to have pets. Just really hate seeing women trapped like that.

God forbid that women in South Asia can be trusted to make their own decisions. We must instead tell them that their opinions, views, culture and choices are irrelevant when contrasted with our worldly Western knowledge. They should just trust us to be right…

Or

Perhaps they are less hung up on looks and look more to what the man can bring overall. Maybe the local men aren’t all that. Maybe many of the men who go looking are the ‘nice guys’ who British women ignore due to their looks. Perhaps the women the men meet actually like them. Perhaps the women are gold diggers.

None of us know. But plenty in the West seem to resent men they perceive as unattractive and therefore to be dismissed actually succeeding in finding a wife and having children.

Some men will be creeps. There are plenty of married men in the UK who are, so statistically it’s going to happen. But statistically many will be perfectly nice people who just want to get on in life and build a future.

Rich older men taking advantage of their position

That is what it is there is nothing equal about these relationships

I know 2 men with Thai wives . Both met them whilst in Thailand . First one is about 15 years older , they had a child who is now a teenager . He had a stroke in his mid 50s , recovered fairly well but unable to do his usual type of job and went part time , so his wife became the main breadwinner . They have now permanently moved to Thailand.
Second one worked with my dh . He is about 10 years older than his wife . He doesn't have any children from previous relationships , nor do they , so childless.
She came over here and got her British citizenship . She does manual work . He in a well paid job , excellent pension , own house , mortgage paid off .
Both his parents are dead , he has one sibling also childless so no family to inherit anything he may leave after death.

He told my dh why not have a younger woman more willing to put in extra effort to be a good wife for a much better lifestyle and one that feels more beholden (grateful to him ).
He calls them transactional , it works for them both.

He has had a house built in Thailand and they will move out there when he retires on a very good pension in a few years .

Honestly, OP, a while ago I would have agreed with you and found it creepy and a massive red flag, but recently it's been pointed out to me that part of being respectful of other people's sexual boundaries is accepting each person's right to find anyone sexually appealing or unappealing for whatever reason, even if you think their reasons are absolute tosh or offensive, and that to suggest otherwise is deeply coercive.

I'm not entirely convinced of this point of view, but I'm giving it a go to see if I've been having the wrong attitude in the past. So I guess in this case, I would be fine with finding a man with this pattern of behaviour sexually repellent (although that's irrelevant as he wouldn't be interested in me anyway) but would try to respect his pattern of attraction/repulsion as equally valid and not judge him negatively for that.

I agree that it’s creepy and raises difficult questions about patriarchy and what society values in men and women.

But as PPs have pointed out if both parties go in with their eyes open and are clear on the fact that this is a transaction I don’t see that it has to be exploitative.

Theres a massive difference between blokes going to SE Asia because they want underage girls and know it’s more tolerated there and a bloke who by British standards would be considered boring or nerdy finding someone he clicks with who happens to be Thai and who is prioritising security and money over other factors.

I have been on holiday in Asia & I have seen high street agency shops that advertise women "they will look after you & your family"

I have also known decent men, that have married foreigners & had long, loving marriages.

Some Asian countries are very family oriented & wish to have children & family. In some cases their situation allows for some spare money to be sent home to help with education, health, better living standards for their wider family.

If you could have a better life, would you do the same thing ?

Have you actually travelled abroad to various countries & experienced their cultures ?

Most people in these countries are very hard working & there are no Government benefit systems to rely upon.

Secondly, some people cannot help being born "ugly" or "nerdy". I would marry someone kind & loving over someone beautiful any day !

Op your thread seems to have been written from a perspective of little world wide experience

I think there is for some guys a seedy intention with seeking out foreign brides etc. But there are probably many who just want love and to feel like someone wants them. I mean your comment about "out of their league" is just frankly a bit nasty. If a person is wanting love and intimacy and not getting it here - what do you suggest? They stay single and have no relationship? Just to satisfy your moral compass?

Depends on the man, but I suppose a lot of men do it because they can't attract women here for whatever reason.

There's a huge surplus of single men nowadays which is one factor.

There are gay couples too

A lot of heterosexual relationships are what I'd call "mutually exploitative" and depressingly it's often centred on a mutually convenient arrangement of the man bringing money and stability, the woman bringing looks and domesticity. Sometimes in those situations genuine affection and companionship can still flourish.

I'm talking about heterosexual relationships between British people of course, as actively promoted throughout this very site, which is obsessed with a) women looking good and getting surgery if necessary to do so, b) a man's salary consistently being deemed more important than his character when it comes to dating and marriage, c) the prevalence of traditional gender roles - woman looks after the home, man provides. Any time you post against any of those things you get shouted down.

I don't know any examples of the mail order bride phenomenon IRL and don't judge anyone else's relationship without knowing them, but if as described at its seediest by PP then it's just an extension of a dynamic you see up and down this country.

(I'm part-Asian and any man who thinks Asian woman = subservient character is in for the shock of his life, frankly)

Don't you hate the women who go on holiday looking for a toyboy...
Usually they are ugly, boring old hags with saggy tits and thigh skin that droops to their knees, and they are a bit thick. But they go and find a young native man who 'services they use'.
You see OP, like it or not, it works both ways. Women exploit men in foreign countries too. What makes them any better?

It can be grim, and it can be fine. My ex-FIL was a bit of both, oddly. Took to going on extended holidays to Thailand in his 50s and would bring various 'girlfriends' back, much younger than him and didn't speak sufficient English to work so just waited on him hand and foot before they inevitably tired of it (or he of them) and went home.

A few years later he met a lovely Thai Woman similar to his own age here, she'd come over with another bloke who'd physically abused her so she'd left him, but she spoke good English, liked the UK and was already working so had stayed. She was independent, smart and took no shit. I believe they're still together.

I agree some women go abroad to find love, relationships, flings, marriage too

Everyone searching for happiness

I agree that 'shopping' for a bride is creepy.

What i would say, however, is that Western men do have cache in Asia. A man that is 5'9" in the UK might be considered short, but in a lot of Asian countries he would be tall. There is also the novelty/exoticness of being different. Western men might also have much more liberal and modern attitudes to women as equals. A job paying £40k here isn't 'rich', but in a lot of Asian countries that's a huge amount.

There will be plenty of western men that have simply worked/travelled in Asia and found love.

You might perceive the woman as 'out of their league', but conversely the woman might consider herself to be living a fairytale.

Given the dismissive attitudes of the OP towards geeky, boring and unattractive men (as she sees them), I can understand why those men might give up on British women and try their luck abroad.

Honestly, I would hang on to your scepticism about that point of view. Because unfortunately there has been a deliberate misappropriation of a very valid argument (that women don't owe men sex and are entitled to refuse based on their preferences, and to persuade them otherwise is coercive) to suggest all preferences are valid. This is a dangerous and slippery slope at the bottom of which lie those who argue its 'valid' to be attracted to children and animals. The men we are discussing may not be able to help their attraction to disadvantaged women half their age, but when that results in exploitative behaviour we shouldn't be validating it. People do indeed have the right to their preferences but decent people wouldn't act on them if it caused another harm, and that's the line.

What makes them even relevant? The OP has started a thread about men exploiting women. Do you have any defence of that? Because making reference to women and their appearance in (far more) disparaging terms than applied to the men on here is entirely irrelevant. I bet typing that out gave you a little buzz though, didnt it? Not often you can find a justification for spewing out that sort of misogyny on MN without getting deleted.