To dislike men who seek out foreign brides

[Hartley99]

There are quite a few documentaries about this on YouTube. The guy is usually ugly or boring or nerdy (usually all three). He claims to be ‘looking for love,’ when in reality, of course, he’s looking for a sexual partner. So he goes online and searches for girls in poor countries - often Thailand or Russia. In almost every case the girl is younger and/or much more attractive than him.

Recently, there was a documentary on channel 4, and I ended up having an argument with someone at work about it. They thought the whole thing was ‘sweet’ and funny and couldn’t see anything wrong. To them it made sense. The guy got to have sex with a girl out of his league, and the girl got to move to a richer country with more opportunities. To me it just seemed revolting. However you spin it, they are taking advantage of her poverty. They know that she wouldn’t look twice at them in any other circumstance. Apparently, after the invasion of Ukraine there was a massive spike in men looking for Ukrainian brides online. I mean that says it all. Or am I being uptight and judgemental?

Its not racist. People who say that are only trying to frame it as such to shut down any negativity towards the men who are doing it. They hope that the threat of being called racist will silence those calling out the men's behaviour. See also 'bigot', used very similarly these days.

Why would it be "racist" for her to judge her brothers misogynistic behaviour?
And you, a man, spoke to another man who opined that women "appear" to happy. A scientific study if ever there were one.

I mentioned this thread to a friend a while ago. He said he knows three 'Thai brides'. One married to a police officer, another to an IT project manager and the third to an estate agent

lol

@SmelliEllie had never met this woman but can, apparently, from a distance of several thousand miles discern the true nature of her motivations and the basis of their relationship.

And that analysis is based upon what exactly, if not racist stereotypes?

Presumably she's basing it on her knowledge of her own brother and how attractive he would be to a young beautiful woman who wasn't seeing him as the least worst option compared with a life of poverty. No one is judging exploited young women here. They're judging the men who exploit them.

Your assumption that she must be getting exploited is more of the same.

I knew a couple like this. She was a lovely, clever woman from Moldova. He was autistic, not very attractive but a reasonably nice guy. She had a life she wouldn’t have had in Moldova. He had a wife he wouldn’t have been able to attract in the U.K.

Some men are lonely, lacking in confidence, aren't quite what British women are looking for. They're misfits, if you like. Doesn't mean they don't have as much right to a relationship as the next person and if taking a transactional approach and going abroad is what works for them, then so what? Providing they respect their wife and treat her fairly then who are we to judge? Marriages for love aren't all they're cracked up to be, as many many Mumsnetters know only too well.

Nobody has a 'right to a relationship'.

I'm not even sure why you'd think that's relevant.

Do you actually mean 'how dare they leave their lane and find happiness, when I think they should be lonely and miserable'?

You left out the qualifier "as much as the next person".

And this makes you look very mean spirited, even though your point that many of the men who look for foreign brides are sleazy lechers, is well made.

I left nothing out.

A relationship inherently involves another human being. Nobody has the 'right' to impose themselves themselves on another human being. I don't care how that 'makes me look' in your eyes.

"Doesn't mean they don't have as much right to a relationship as the next person"

Ie, everyone should have a chance at happiness. Unless you want to be pedantic as well.

Everyone should have the chance of a happiness that doesn't come at the detriment of someone else. Unfortunately this means there are people who will be unable to secure the happiness they would find in a relationship with a much younger more attractive person. More unfortunately still there are people who are unable to secure the happiness they would find in any relationship, because bluntly, no one wants to be in a relationship with them. To suggest that people have a 'right' to a relationship moves into the dangerous territory where men who cant find one feel the end justifies the means and they can exploit women, or worse, because they have a 'right' not to be alone and/or to the type of woman they prefer.

Since when does 'being pedantic' mean reading what someone actually wrote? And not your interpretation of what they wrote?

Spoken like a rather poor bush lawyer.

I agree with everything you have said in this post. No one has the right to a relationship full stop. Never mind the sleaziness inherent in a market for third world brides. But it doesn't follow that anyone not in a relationship deserves to be single.

I'm a physically unattractive man. I'm not looking for pity as I have long ceased to be bothered by this. Not least because I've been married for two decades.

There is an attitude on here that the bar for being a good man is so low that any man who can't find a relationship with a woman from his own background must deserve to be single. That's a myth. I think the fact I got married was a happy accident. Sure, there's someone for everyone out there - but only one for some. If I notched my bedpost, that would be one notch.

It's possible to be a good, unattractive, single man, and while I think finding a mail order bride is dubious I can understand why someone could be so gnawed by simple loneliness that they look for one.

I hope that clarifies my perspective.

I said nothing about imposition. I referenced transactional relationships, respect and fair treatment. Implicit within that is the assumption that both parties are consenting to the arrangement.

Exactly.
This has been going on for a number of years really. And I’ve been trying to push it to one side but I can’t in all conscience any longer.
I can’t judge other men who use women this way and make an exception for my brother.
i don’t know the Thai lady (he calls “girl” 🤢”. I do know him.
I don’t think he views women as whole people. In the UK this was an issue. Not many women will put up with it and it’s quite rightly looked frowned upon.
He has gone to place where his anonymity and the abundance
of women in poverty has meant he can indulge himself without judgement.
If he was moving in with her as a whole person he would have gotten somewhere she could have her kids too.
I have a daughter I want to protect and a son I want to treat women with respect.
ai just can’t see how being ok with his exploitative relationship squares with that.

I’d also like to add that my brother is actually very good looking.
I think the issue is that his mind has been melted by porn.
He has admitted this. It’s not a secret.
He started to work on it with a therapist but then disengaged.
I see this current step as him just escalating things.
I cant be a part of condoning that whilst my kids look on.
I kind of live by the rule that if I wouldn’t be ok with my kids doing it, especially my daughter, then it’s wrong.

However my brother has moved her into his one bed apartment there. Has no intention of marrying her. And no intention of creating a life with her where she can be with her children.

🤔 I wonder what’s in it for him?

I'm sorry you have to witness your brother being such a skunk and I hope you're able to tear him a new one.

I think not being attractive meant I knew very well that I shouldn't mess people around that that's been a good lesson for me.

A long time ago, in my 20’s, I was on a course with 15 people from different companies (3 from my company).
One of the guys, from Yorkshire, not bad-looking and around mid 20’s, admitted that he was looking for an Asian lady to settle down with. His reason? “They are so beautiful, and they don’t argue with their men” 🤮🤮🤮
Not all foreign bride choosers are ugly, but they do seem a bit creepy!

Makes sense. He would not have wanted a Ukrainian one on the account of not taking any crap 😂

We have a joke - a Georgian man (considered a fiery and jealous kind) marries a Ukrainian woman. He says to her that if he comes home with his hat to the left side, he will love and care for her tonight. If his hat is to the right, she is trouble. She thanks him for the letting her know and says: “when you come home and my hands are folded on my chest, I will love and care for you tonight. But if my hands are on my side, I do not care which way your hat is on”.

As with many things on MN, I don’t think the issue is as black and white as is being said. I think some men and women, go to foreign countries primarily to exploit the situation that exists. But for others, they are unable to secure the type of relationship they want or they just prefer a woman/men from different cultures who have different values and mindset etc. Also, women and men from cultures outside of the west are not necessarily poor and exploited, I do think that attitude is racist actually and more so, just ignorant.
Whether we like it or not, most relationships are transactional to a degree, what’s wrong with that being honest from the start.

And I think people underestimate the number of woman who do this too. Personally, I don’t any men who travelled abroad and married but I know 4 women who have.