To think this is outdated and needs to be removed?

[ballybean]

My son's school has an all glass isolation room in the hall with three desks, children are put there as punishment? Teachers and students walking passed

Perhaps a bit of humiliation will stop them from misbehaving and disrupting the class

Inhuman?
Really, divided opinions on that one.

Inhuman, which also means cruel, monstrous, and barbaric

Inhuman is walking up to an innocent person in the street and punching them in the face for no apparent reason.

Inhuman is getting a person to meet you in a park knowing you're going to stick a knife in them or beat them until they die.

Inhuman is pulling up along side a pensioner, jumping out of the car a ripping her handbag from her shoulder.

I certainly wouldn't say being put in a secure room, by ones own choice because you don't have the ability to sit still, be quiet and listen for half hour or so Inhuman.

Then they'll learn to behave if they don't like it won't they

It’s definitely outdated. Managing behaviour using shame and fear is short sighted and doesn’t actually change behaviour or motivate people to do the right thing in the long term. Compassion, positives and connection are what has a lasting impact.

Seemingly not.

We will have to agree to differ then. There's quite a broad range of things I consider inhuman. I'm capable of considering more than 3 things inhuman.

Unfortunately a lot of people on this thread will disagree with you and say you're not showing compassion to the kids who want to work. Because obviously you can't show compassion to both lots of children.

Quite !

One of the more common ones is a simple detention - at lunchtime or after school. I agree that this seems antiquated and extremely unlikely to prevent misbehaviour. Instead, it seems designed to humiliate the child, with no positive benefit.

Well yeah it's a pretty light punishment but these days is "harsh and cruel"
It's really no wonder children are so wild these days and unable to be controlled by schools or parent, they never have a real consequence for anything these days not to mention the over sensitive lack of resilience that goes along with it. Turning out a generation of lazy self entitled who think the world revolves around them and their feelings

That is outrageous, how is that even allowed. Are you in North Korea. Humiliating children is not acceptable. I would be taking that higher.

Maybe if pupils behaved it wouldn't be needed and teachers wouldn't be leaving due to bad behaviour of pupils. Just a thought...

Like this? Ahahaha barbaric. Poor office workers who spend all their working lives in such dreadful conditions. Not.

So it's the secondary version of the 'traffic lights', or 'sunshine and rain cloud', or whatever other act of ridiculous public shaming (primary) schools come up with - got it!

I'll be honest, I'm not sure what the answer is to the behaviour issues in school, especially in secondary schools, but it sure as anything it's humiliation. As a previous poster said, it's the antithesis of trauma-informed practice, and when you've had a reason to really look for trauma-informed schools, you'd appreciate how necessary that practice is.

I'm not okaying unacceptable behaviour - not at all, I'm a former teacher, I absolutely understand how soul destroying it can be to be spending half your day managing behaviour rather than actually educating - but public humiliation is not the answer.

Shifting the shit-show of the education system as an institution (not at individual teacher level) onto individuals has had a massive impact on pupils in general - with everything being target driven, teachers need to cram more in to each lesson, so there isn't the opportunity to build relationships to mitigate poor behaviour before it starts. Because for a lot of children - and teens especially, although they'd never admit it - having those relationships with teachers/staff makes them more inclined to behave appropriately, rather than a standard 'screw you' to anyone in authority.

Only 3 desks? That must be a good school to expect so few students in need of it! X

This.

My son was severely and chronically bullied.
He threatened to take his own life.
He is 11 years old.
The bullies were put in said isolation several times, and it's worked.
Hence I fully agree to keeping this as a punishment.
We're becoming a nanny nation, it is ridiculous. Punishment for severe bullying is needed.
Letters were also sent home, these vile kids were sent to the head, and in to isolation.
If this had not worked, they were looking at full expulsion.
And I don't care how humiliating it may be - Every action has a reaction and the sooner bullies realise this, the better.

I don't think it's degrading and humiliating. I think it sounds like a good idea.

Is this thread full of Tory MPs? Teach them a lesson! They’ll choose to behave! What an over-simplification of such a myriad of issues that are rife in school and society. If a child is sent to an isolation room, glass or otherwise, it is ineffective as a method of addressing anything other than the very immediate issue. Nowhere in the criminal justice system is there a theory or type of sentence with the aim of humiliation. I’m not sure why we would take that approach with children.

I think OP said the room was for stuff like talking in class though. I was a right goody two shoes at school and even I got told off for talking in class sometimes.

Yeah that's what the OP said... Anyway, there's talking in class and there's talking in class. Nobody's going to be excluded from class for being a little bit chatty occasionally. The kind of talking in class that might get you excluded is constantly having loud conversations across the classroom, possibly including swearing, and completely blanking the teacher when they ask you to stop. And doing that lesson after lesson while not bothering to listen or do any work. A kid who gets excluded for that will almost certainly say 'All I was doing was talking!'.

Is this thread full of Tory MPs? Teach them a lesson! They’ll choose to behave! What an over-simplification of such a myriad of issues that are rife in school and society. If a child is sent to an isolation room, glass or otherwise, it is ineffective as a method of addressing anything other than the very immediate issue. Nowhere in the criminal justice system is there a theory or type of sentence with the aim of humiliation. I’m not sure why we would take that approach with children.

I've asked this a few times on this thread, and I don't think I've had an answer yet: What are your suggested alternatives to detention and exclusion from lessons?

The aim of detention and exclusion is NOT humiliation. It is supposed to be a deterrent to discourage bad behaviour, and sometimes a method of removing a volatile student from a classroom situation, and partly a way of allowing lessons to take place with less disruption (albeit temporarily). It's not a very effective deterrent, which pretty much shows that it's not particularly harsh. I think that in the average state school, all but the very, very compliant kids would actually laugh at the idea that it's humiliating.

No, they really don’t learn. They will be the same ones in there week in week
out.

The reason they don’t learn? Because the majority of kids with big behaviour
problems have trauma and attachment issues. I work with kids who have drug addict parents, who have witnessed domestic violence, who haven’t seen their mum in 5 years. They are the ones who will be constantly in isolation booths and exclusion rooms.

I love how so many are saying ‘well if they behave, they wouldn’t have to be there’. Like it’s that simple. These kids have years of learned behaviour. Negative learned behaviour. It gets them noticed.

No, they don’t seem to have any shame as they’ve learned to hide down deep any hint of vulnerability. They will laugh in your face and continue to misbehave as it’s the only way they know.

Continuing with these sort of punishment booths really really doesn’t help. The children just return to class more resentful, less fearful and with nothing to lose. You are teaching them nothing. I’m actually very surprised at how many on MN are so unaware of effective behavioural approaches.