To think perhaps he deserved getting punched??

[Blouseybiggal]

Tricky one as far as I’m concerned - violence bad but this guy was being a homophobic dick so…

Friend’s brother is a bit of an arsehole, winds people up, thinks he’s funny. I have as little to do with him as possible as he’s a right wing type who always thinks he’s right and could start an argument in an empty room.

So, Jeff is in a bar with his girlfriend. A gay couple - one ‘girlie’ one more masc looking ( apparently) - stand near them at the bar ordering drinks, minding their own biz.

Jeff, loud enough for half the bar to hear, says ‘ I don’t get it. If you’re going to go for someone who looks like a man, why not just go out with a man’ at the couple.

The ‘girlie’ woman says ‘what did you say?’ To him, he repeats it, and she punches him in the face. He falls over, his girlfriend is outraged, the gay couple leave.

For what it’s worth, I’m genuinely surprised he doesn’t get thumped more often.

YANBU - he deserved that! Homophobic prick.

YABU - he’s entitled to his opinion, violence is never the answer.

It wouldn’t be self defence, if she was repeatedly hitting him then yes he in my eyes has every right to punch her back to defend himself but in this case he would have just been retaliating.

Agreed. No one deserves to be punched for saying hurty words, no matter what.

Also, she put herself massively at risk by punching him. At the end of the day he's a man, and she was very lucky (a) she caught him by surprise, and (b) he didn't decide to retaliate.

This.

The guy was a dick, but sticks and stones, assault is still assault.

If she approached him and he feared he was about to be struck he would be within his rights to defend himself.

A preemptive punch is not self defence.

He wasn't expressing right wing opinions, he made offensive remarks obviously intended to humiliate the women.

I don't agree with violence but I do feel sorry for the two women, I wonder how much lesbophobia they have put up with from dickheads when they're minding their own business.

A pre-emptive punch is self defence if you believe you are about to be struck. You do not need to wait until you are struck / stabbed / shot to defend yourself.

Is someone saying something you find offensive 'provocation'?

You'd need to explain to the court why you felt it was appropriate to assault someone because you didn't like what they said.

If everyone punched people who said stupid and insulting comments to them, it would be a total blood bath out there. It would also be a blood bath at home.

I don't think he's entitled to that opinion, but violence is never the answer. What if he'd been killed?

The answer is in the middle of your options. He doesn't deserve to voice his homophobic opinions but also punching someone is totally wrong.

He should have been chucked out, if not also banned, from the pub.

Anyone that lashes out in violence is a dickhead. No amount of fuckwittery deserves a punch and only morons think that’s the answer.

Couldn’t have happened to a nicer chap ….

I'm a woman and if I'd acted like the guy in the OP and got punched by a bloke, it would have been my own fault. Everyone in my social circle would absolutely tell me I brought it on myself too.

I don't condone violence but if you start with the hate speech, the consequences are your own fault.

Both were in the wrong. He doesn’t have to approve of same sex relationships however he didn’t need to give his opinion especially to strangers. The person in the couple shouldn’t have punched him either though. That is assault and had it been a man who had hit a woman all hell would break lose.

So trying to publicly humiliate and insult strangers' sexuality and slagging off a woman's appearance as not being stereotypically feminine enough is an attempt to engage in debate?

Anyway "Things that never happened for 100 please."

No, I just mean she doesn’t seem to find him as irritating as others do.
and yes, it happened. I don’t know why people jump on threads to be like Ah, never happened! Tedious.

He fucked around and found out. Perhaps he'll engage his brain from now on.

This made my day. Good for her!

For what it’s worth, I am gay, and this ‘you look like a bloke’ shit is incredibly common for gay women who aren’t deemed to conform to whatever some people think women should look like. I actually dress pretty ‘boyishly’ but have long hair so although I have had the usual general homophobia have avoided being called a man by randoms.

My reactions to homophobic comments have varied between being so stunned Indidnt know what to say, to being really upset, to - as I got older- seeing it coming and being ready with a retort.
Being taken aback has been overwhelmingly my main reaction, only to be angry and upset way after the fact. So part of me absolutely gets why she wanted to thump him.

If you wanted to discuss if violence is ever justified then perhaps ask that rather than inventing scenarios? Could have happened but probably did not (though I doubt it but apologies if it genuinely did)

Anyway In this scenario of yours she's enabling his behaviour as are those around him who excuse it. Said person is a known arsehole but it's his family and friends who have something to answer -why do they tolerate it around them?

I think he 100% deserved it although I don't think we'd be seeing the same answers if a gay guy slapped a woman.

I feel like I should learn how to punch just in case I ever meet a Jeff. I know I’d want to do it but would just end up missing or hurting my own hand.

@WhatWhereWho ya got me! Jeff is an alias. But very much sums up the type of man he is I reckon.
Not that he would be on MN anyway. Although I’m not saying anything that I wouldn’t say to his face at the next wedding/ birthday/ funeral Insee him at, should it come up.

Provocation is only a defence to murder to reduce it to manslaughter if accepted.

For everything else it goes to mitigation only, it's not a defence to the crime of assault.