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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to ask how anyone affords to have children?

197 replies

NameChangedAgainn · 07/03/2024 23:04

DP and I are in our early 30s and people keep asking when we're going to have children, we're on the fence but we can't work out how anyone on our salaries can afford to have children. We're aware time is running out as it were (both my mum and nan hit perimenopause by 40 so aware that it's looming).
Am I missing something obvious?
My salary is roughly £1800 after tax, NI, pension and student loans. DP's is similar. Full time childcare for one child would ruin us financially at £400pw around here (and that would involve one of us working less hours to do pick ups as it closes at 6pm, so one salary would drop, the only way I could make it work would be to do 4 days work over 5 days).
We don't have £400pw spare after mortgage (£1300), bills, food and transport (£1500 if we cut to no eating out or buying lunches and really budget). The money we currently have spare per month (realistically this is a few hundred, but if we cut back to the bare bones as above it would be almost £800) is mostly eaten up in saving for small emergencies, holidays and events (e.g. The clutch went on the car recently, the washing machine needed repairing the next week, then it was MIL birthday the following week).
Benefits calculator (I never thought we would ever have to claim benefits) says we would be entitled to £18pw.
The best case scenario seems to be us being about £1000 short every month and having no spare money for any unexpected costs. We are trying to save at the moment but don't have enough to even get through mat leave.

So as not to drip feed:

  • We have no parents or family living anywhere near us that could help with childcare, we had to move away from family for work and then further away again to be able to afford a house.
  • 23 years left on the mortgage on a small 3 bed mid terrace in a relatively non expensive area.
  • We have one second hand car that we own outright and share.
OP posts:
NameChangedAgainn · 07/03/2024 23:57

mydrivingisterrible · 07/03/2024 23:54

I was going to suggest the SAHP route too

SAHP was the goal, but one salary plus benefits isn't enough for our outgoings.

OP posts:
Hereyoume · 08/03/2024 00:00

zendeveloper · 07/03/2024 23:15

One of you will have to become a SAHP, and another find a higher paid job, this is probably the only way it would work.

Wow!

Amazing the OP has NEVER thought of something so easy and attainable. Well done you for pointing it out. You've single handedly solved child care for everyone.

Could you please now turn your attention to the Cost of Living crisis, and after that see what you can reccomend for World Hunger, Ukraine and Global warming.

🙄

FusionChefGeoff · 08/03/2024 00:02

They earn more than you. Your pay is relatively low and if you're both on that then it will be difficult.

Hereyoume · 08/03/2024 00:05

Lesina · 07/03/2024 23:48

I guess the pertinent question is do you want children?

if so you will make it work.

if you want children but don’t want to compromise life style, it probably won’t :)

And please do explain how "make it work" will pay their mortgage?

NameChangedAgainn · 08/03/2024 00:06

Sorry I'm trying to keep up with replying to comments but I'm struggling!
Someone said somewhere it comes down to whether we want a child as we would just make it work. Unfortunately, we have planned our finances out for the next few years and without getting into significant debt we can't seem to make it work.
We have also thought about riding out the cost of living crisis in the hopes things get easier, continuing to save to get us through the expensive years (although savings then impacts what UC we would able to claim too) and seeing if it happens when we're late 30s.
The car is a necessity we're not willing to compromise on - it would be a long walk with laptops and work files to the nearest train station for our office days, and the train costs more than petrol, and would mean a longer commute. The car is also how we visit family and we would feel very isolated without it. Other luxuries we have cancelled in our hypothetical calculations - holidays, eating out etc.

OP posts:
user1492757084 · 08/03/2024 00:06

Just adding that as you are in your early thirties you don't have much time. If you want kids, have them. You can not get your most fertile years back and IVF is expensive - both in money and emotionally.

Think left of field..

Take in a lodger
Take in ironing
Sell all excess stuff
Main earner work over time while kidis small
Claim all benefits that you can
Wear a heated blanket and save of heating
Eat beans, rice and mince
Holiday in the back yard
No more bought coffees or lunches
Rent out house and move in with family for one year

You will work it out.

underthebun · 08/03/2024 00:07

Re tax free childcare the cap is 2k a yr

underthebun · 08/03/2024 00:08

Lots of couples aren’t affording it & it’s one reason for the low birth rates

NameChangedAgainn · 08/03/2024 00:10

FusionChefGeoff · 08/03/2024 00:02

They earn more than you. Your pay is relatively low and if you're both on that then it will be difficult.

We do earn about 10% less than the average salary. We have been looking for better paying jobs but struggling. We do both enjoy our jobs and live pretty comfortably (not lavishly admittedly) without children, but can't help thinking that we're doing something horribly wrong when all our colleagues say we should be able to afford children.

OP posts:
Peaceandquietandacuppa · 08/03/2024 00:11

Historically yes, but won’t you get help now the rules are changing??

From September 2024, 15 hours of free childcare will be extended to all children from the age of 9 months.
From September 2025, working parents of children under the age of five will be entitled to 30 hours of free childcare a week.

underthebun · 08/03/2024 00:13

From September 2024, 15 hours of free childcare will be extended to all children from the age of 9 months.

It’s not actually free though as many nurseries make you pay for additional hours as they can’t afford to operate the scheme & it’s only 38 wks of the year.

JobMatch3000 · 08/03/2024 00:14

Can you breakdown the £1,500 you currently spend on food and bills. That seems high.

The nursery years we afforded but putting all grocery spending on a credit card and paying it off when the bills dropped with the funded hours.

Peaceandquietandacuppa · 08/03/2024 00:14

Also could one of you change jobs/hours? Me and my partner stagger our days so I work Mon-Fri, he works Fri-Weds. it means we need fewer childcare days, though a bit shit that he works weekends. We’ll change back in a year or so.

ancienticecream · 08/03/2024 00:15

How much would you have to live on each month if you took £1427 off your monthly spending money after mortgage and other non-negotiable bills?

51 weeks per year x £400 = £20,400
Take off the £2,000 from tax-free childcare and £1,274 from Child Benefit annually, making nursery costs £17,126pa. Divide that by 12 for a monthly invoice figure, and it's £1,427pcm.

You'll have Jeremy Hunt's 30 free hours before too long, so you can adjust your figures accordingly. That said, average nursery prices will be going up no doubt to stop childcare providers from going under due to lack of funding.

fluffykittens208 · 08/03/2024 00:16

NameChangedAgainn · 08/03/2024 00:10

We do earn about 10% less than the average salary. We have been looking for better paying jobs but struggling. We do both enjoy our jobs and live pretty comfortably (not lavishly admittedly) without children, but can't help thinking that we're doing something horribly wrong when all our colleagues say we should be able to afford children.

Its honestly hard to say who can afford children. Sometimes its also about timing. If you lived with fanily for 10 years and had a giant deposit on a modest place which you bought when interest rates were low, then overpaid for a few years, then you are in a better place to afford a child than someone on the same salary.

Compare that with a 33 year old renter who just bought her first home (a family sized home) with her dh. She could honestly earn double the salary of the person in the earlier example and my bet is she cant afford either unless on a top 6% salary.

Peaceandquietandacuppa · 08/03/2024 00:16

underthebun · 08/03/2024 00:13

From September 2024, 15 hours of free childcare will be extended to all children from the age of 9 months.

It’s not actually free though as many nurseries make you pay for additional hours as they can’t afford to operate the scheme & it’s only 38 wks of the year.

True - but we switched to a childminder for our 30 free hours and she didn’t require so much extra pay. At private nursery we would have paid £300 extra and with childminder it was £0! Less overheads etc to cover I guess…

vanillaclouds · 08/03/2024 00:16

I took a huge pay cut and worked in hospitality, but the pay cut meant I saved on child care because it was flexible I worked evenings and weekends which was full time around dh work.
It's only until they start school and those few years flew by and I actually really enjoyed it.

NameChangedAgainn · 08/03/2024 00:20

ancienticecream · 08/03/2024 00:15

How much would you have to live on each month if you took £1427 off your monthly spending money after mortgage and other non-negotiable bills?

51 weeks per year x £400 = £20,400
Take off the £2,000 from tax-free childcare and £1,274 from Child Benefit annually, making nursery costs £17,126pa. Divide that by 12 for a monthly invoice figure, and it's £1,427pcm.

You'll have Jeremy Hunt's 30 free hours before too long, so you can adjust your figures accordingly. That said, average nursery prices will be going up no doubt to stop childcare providers from going under due to lack of funding.

Edited

We would be in the negative by several hundred pounds each month. I hadn't actually realised that the tax free childcare was only £2k.

OP posts:
Peaceandquietandacuppa · 08/03/2024 00:26

NameChangedAgainn · 08/03/2024 00:20

We would be in the negative by several hundred pounds each month. I hadn't actually realised that the tax free childcare was only £2k.

But say you had a baby 9 months from now, then 9 months mat leave (which is tough when you are on SMP! But you can use annual leave at the end) from then you’d get 30 hours childcare

Yes it may not cover all the cost but a good chunk of it and you could use tax free childcare for the rest.

Pickled21 · 08/03/2024 00:26

The cost of living is a huge issue. We didn't have that at the time we started having kids which is probably why we could have them. My dh was on a low salary like yourself but I was on 3x higher which helped. His job has always been incredibly flexible though which is worth its weight in gold as I have to work core hours. We managed by holding off on trying for a baby for a year in which he got a promotion and a car. We lived frugally whilst I saved for a deposit. We bought in a small commuter town and our mortgage is half yours. I had to go back to work after 9 months with both sets of mat leave. We waited 4 years to have a 3rd child and by that point dh had two promotions and I was able to go self employed dropping to 16 hours a week. His flexibility means he was able to compress his hours so we didn't need childcare for dd2 compared to her siblings but that's because I work a Saturday.At one point we had 2 kids in childcare for 2 days and my salary just about covered the childcare until we got free hours when they were aged 3. It was better for my mh and career longterm though to keep my hand in rather than become a sahm.

Long term I'd be looking to retrain in an area with a more competitive salary and move areas. Short term I'd spend some time literally pouring over your finances to see where you can make cuts. Once the child gets to 2 you will get some free hours (depending on where you are in the UK), before then it will likely be a hard slog requiring sacrifices.

mollyfolk · 08/03/2024 00:27

We had a child first and then we were like - oh my god the price of childcare!

just keep in mind that your salaries might go up (depending) the years were childcare costs are high are short and the time frame were you can have a child is limited.

vdbfamily · 08/03/2024 00:30

I would suggest for the pre school years that one of you leaves current job and is SAHP but works a couple of evenings and maybe a weekend day doing something completely different. You can earn£11 ph working in a supermarket. My 17 year old earns£300 pm working at local shop getting just over£5 ph. It all helps.

mydrivingisterrible · 08/03/2024 00:34

Could you move on to an interest only mortgage for a while?

Shallana · 08/03/2024 00:34

I think it comes down to your income being low relative to your living expenses. Based on your net monthly income, you can't be earning more than £30,000 each which is quite a low salary if you both have degrees and are early 30's.

If you've no family close by or ties, could you not consider moving to a cheaper area of the country? We pay less than half your mortgage for a large 3 bed detached, childcare here is in the region of £225 per week, even if you had to take a pay cut it would be far more affordable.

NameChangedAgainn · 08/03/2024 00:39

Someone asked for a breakdown of the £1500 bills - this is it, I've assumed we can shave the phone bills and broadband down when the contracts are up for renewal. The car savings is just what we put aside each month for the expenses we pay out annually if that makes sense.
The dental plans are cheaper than paying for appointments (been waiting for an NHS dentist for years).
Food feels like a lot but good prices just seem to have sky rocketed, it is based on us making all meals from scratch.
Home insurance was required for the mortgage.

AIBU to ask how anyone affords to have children?
OP posts: