Page 12 | DD has been removed

Flojoloco · 2024-03-06T00:24:53+00:00

DD is 15 with additional needs. Things have been getting progressively difficult. Today she told her social worker that I hit her and there is a bruise on her face so they removed her. There’s a strat meeting tomorrow and I’ve no idea if she’s coming home or not either way it’s a mess. I either lose my DD or she’s at home and I’m scared of her lies. She’s 5’8” and 14+ stone, she has massive temper tantrums/meltdowns and puts holes in doors etc. I have no doubt if I ever hit her she would paste me. She lives a charmed life but she’s not very happy at the moment and that’s impacting massively. I would never hit her. I’ve no idea where the bruise came from. If she bumped her head on something or deliberately smacked herself in her face. I haven’t seen her but the photo on SW phone didn’t look like a bruise, she just looked blotchy. Either way we need help.

WhatNoRaisins · 06/03/2024 18:03

At least with staff you'd have multiple people doing different shifts. I've never been convinced that the model of one carer potentially doing 24/7 care is healthy in any situation.

Waitingforsomethinginteresting · 06/03/2024 18:06

@Withinthesewalls your post is basically excusing abuse towards parents if the child is disabled. I think that is morally repugnant. If the alternative is the child is in an "institution" so be it. If the disabled child harmed anyone other than her family you know she could well be convicted of a crime. Why is it ok to harm her mother? I repeat no one should have to put up with abuse I think it's disgusting that you believe there are exceptions to that.

FleurdeLiane · 06/03/2024 18:11

Compassion and support is required for all parties; no one is at fault. But of course, people like a narrative that neatly apportions blame and shame on individuals.

That said just because no one is at fault doesn't mean both people's rights, needs and safety don't need to be considered. Mothers are humans with rights, just like their children, and if a significant degree of harm is being caused within a relationship, different solutions need to be found that keep everyone safe and healthy.

Withinthesewalls · 06/03/2024 18:11

WhatNoRaisins · 06/03/2024 18:03

At least with staff you'd have multiple people doing different shifts. I've never been convinced that the model of one carer potentially doing 24/7 care is healthy in any situation.

No it definitely isn’t. There should be so much more support- it’s both awful and absurd that parents (usually mums) are left to suffer like this.

pootlin · 06/03/2024 18:26

Waitingforsomethinginteresting · 06/03/2024 18:06

@Withinthesewalls your post is basically excusing abuse towards parents if the child is disabled. I think that is morally repugnant. If the alternative is the child is in an "institution" so be it. If the disabled child harmed anyone other than her family you know she could well be convicted of a crime. Why is it ok to harm her mother? I repeat no one should have to put up with abuse I think it's disgusting that you believe there are exceptions to that.

💯

pootlin · 06/03/2024 18:27

FleurdeLiane · 06/03/2024 18:11

Compassion and support is required for all parties; no one is at fault. But of course, people like a narrative that neatly apportions blame and shame on individuals.

That said just because no one is at fault doesn't mean both people's rights, needs and safety don't need to be considered. Mothers are humans with rights, just like their children, and if a significant degree of harm is being caused within a relationship, different solutions need to be found that keep everyone safe and healthy.

So true.

TotoroElla · 06/03/2024 20:00

Flojoloco · 06/03/2024 07:54

@Soontobe60 we’ve been searching for the answers for 2.5 years.

Following covid, transition to high school, puberty she became more and more aggressive.
She appears to have ADHD and ASD which we are in process of assessment and are expecting a formal diagnosis in the next few weeks. That was hard enough to get my head round and now this.

I didn’t know I had a choice. The SW said she had to take her so I agreed. Maybe if I said no she’d still be here or maybe I’d have a stand off with the police and that would have been worse.

I tried to get her in to residential school last year for 4 nights a week (state boarding). They offered her a place but then when school provided a reference they withdrew it and said they couldn’t meet need.
She’ll behave like the sweetest child at least for a few weeks.
I’ve just got to wait for the outcome of the strat today.

At the weekend when I supposedly assaulted her we’d been out both days I spent over £100 doing things with her. On Monday night we went out for a meal. She was chatting away about school etc. Yesterday she’d been home an hour, chatting away to me, no issues. Laughing and joking. She’d rang the SW from the school bus home. When there was a knocked at the door she panicked but she stuck to her story.

I couldn’t see a bruise looking at her. But the SW took a photo in the light and it did look like a shadow but more of a blotchy complex near her temple.

I'm not in the same situation as you but Covid and then high school transition/puberty has been really difficult and traumatic for my ASD DD. It was then that difficulties became more apparent too. So that could be your 'answer'...although not an actual solution.

TotoroElla · 06/03/2024 20:02

Sorry posted too soon. Sorry if I've missed it...has she had any therapy?

I know things are so tough now. Sending best wishes to you all.

TotoroElla · 06/03/2024 20:31

GreenRaven · 06/03/2024 09:07

yes, but offering respite care is voluntary! I don't respond very well to people trying to tell us we don't offer enough. We get "expenses" but the costs are normally higher, sometimes FAR higher than the expenses. Offering respite has cost me thousands.

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She's not saying individual volunteers aren't offering enough. She is simply saying the system offers very little. That her child who it is agreed should get respite care 18 months down the line has had none and looks as if they won't get any atall. Surely you can understand how difficult that must be? That respite should have to be down to volunteers is a scandal in itself!

TotoroElla · 06/03/2024 20:56

Coshei · 06/03/2024 10:02

The same is true for other metal health conditions and some personality disorders, none of which get a free pass.
If she enjoys the attention these situations cause then there is a good chance that she provokes them on purpose. I hope that this is a wake up call for her and that the OP puts herself first for now so that her daughter experiences some real consequences.

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Why would she provoke them on purpose if she doesn't understand consequences?

TotoroElla · 06/03/2024 21:45

Abeona · 06/03/2024 11:03

OP, let me tell you a true story. I have a second cousin born in the 1960s who was recognised as having special needs. He's now nearly 60 and hasn't been diagnosed, but his GP and others who work with him all say they regard him as having ASD. After he left his SEN school at the age of 16 he was offered a place in a MENCAP community house. He tried it for a week, didn't like it and when his mum went to visit she didn't like the fact that they were all sitting watching TV during the day. She withdrew him and brought him home. Not long after this her husband died and she spent the rest of her life living with her son. She put on a brave face but it was clearly hell and there were times when he was violent and abusive to her — but by that point he was an adult and her problem to manage because there was no help anywhere for her. Her only option was to throw him out and she couldn't face the thought of what might happen to him. She died in her 90s a few years ago. Her last 20 years were particularly awful: he bullied and coerced her into giving him access to her money and spent every penny they had. No one helped. He was in his 40s and deemed to have capacity to manage his own life — even if he did it really badly and caused her hell in the meantime. The police didn't want to have to deal with him because they'd have to have him formally assessed and that costs money and takes time. Social Services were hopeless.

I tell you this because later in life my aunt had massive regrets about bringing him back from the MENCAP shared housing. My mum used to do what she could to support her and after Mum died I'd visit a couple of times a year and do what I could — including calling SS and various charities and begging them to help. My aunt always used to talk about the kind of life she might have had if she'd made a different choice. Every time she wept.

Others have already pointed out that this situation might turn out to be something positive and not the disaster it initially seems to be. You've got your daughter this far. Perhaps now it's time to think about the kind of life you'd like for yourself.

But unfortunately SEN schools with no diagnosis (even rare with a diagnosis) and supported accommodation following on just like that...is in the past.

Coshei · 06/03/2024 22:01

TotoroElla · 06/03/2024 20:56

Why would she provoke them on purpose if she doesn't understand consequences?

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“if she doesn't understand consequences”
After this situation she might understand. At least I hope so for the OP who should not have to endure this treatment. There are limits and if the OP and her other child are in danger because of the older daughter their safety needs to be considered more than if has been.

TotoroElla · 06/03/2024 22:24

Abeona · 06/03/2024 13:04

The disability needs to be diagnosed and treated, as with any other. Not punished.

This is a serious question, because perhaps I've missed something — new developments in this field, maybe. What treatment for ASD do you have in mind?

I ask because I have an adult cousin never formally diagnosed with ASD but very clearly ND and in special education from 6 until 16. Now in his 50s and widely interpreted by HCPs as being ASD but never offered treatment.

Some treatments my DC/DN have had -

OT for motor skills
OT for sensory issues
Play therapy
DBT
Physio therapy
SLT
Referral for anxiety
Support with social skills

TotoroElla · 06/03/2024 22:34

Loveagingernut · 06/03/2024 13:42

Stick to your guns!

All parents have parental rights when their child initially gets removed. This does not stop a child from being accommodated!

A DC can be in foster care and you still have (or share) PR. But this is what SWs do...will make you jump through whatever hoops they want, but if you dare to ask for any support they'll tell you - that's your responsibility!

TotoroElla · 06/03/2024 22:39

Coshei · 06/03/2024 22:01

“if she doesn't understand consequences”
After this situation she might understand. At least I hope so for the OP who should not have to endure this treatment. There are limits and if the OP and her other child are in danger because of the older daughter their safety needs to be considered more than if has been.

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Oh this situation will cure her autism will it? It's all very well with the 'shoulds' and 'needs'. They don't help the OP and neither does demonising her DD. All of us with SEN kids understand only too well the lack of services. It doesn't change facts such as their neuro diversity or learning disabilities.

TotoroElla · 06/03/2024 22:43

Waitingforsomethinginteresting · 06/03/2024 18:06

@Withinthesewalls your post is basically excusing abuse towards parents if the child is disabled. I think that is morally repugnant. If the alternative is the child is in an "institution" so be it. If the disabled child harmed anyone other than her family you know she could well be convicted of a crime. Why is it ok to harm her mother? I repeat no one should have to put up with abuse I think it's disgusting that you believe there are exceptions to that.

She wasn't saying that atall. This child hasn't even been formally diagnosed yet and it's off to the institution for her.

You'll need to pay a lot more taxes if you want them all rounded up and sent to institutions.

Original poster

Flojoloco · 06/03/2024 23:04

I’ve only just got DD home. She got in my car than jumped out in the middle of the street. She was running around in the dark. The story has grown over 24 hrs. She’s now saying I abused her for 7 years. She was so vile. She was shouting at me that she will make sure I lose my job, my house and everything. She was saying I’m a sad loser who has no friends because everyone hates me. She said I should go and kill myself because there’s nothing left for me.
my dad has to drive out and convince her to get in his car and she had a bath at his and some food and then seemed to calm a bit and then we were talking about holidays and cajoling her along until she came home.

OP posts:

GreenRaven · 06/03/2024 23:08

I would have left her in the park and called social services and told them where she was.

Are you OK?

Tryingmybestadhd · 06/03/2024 23:14

Flojoloco · 06/03/2024 23:04

I’ve only just got DD home. She got in my car than jumped out in the middle of the street. She was running around in the dark. The story has grown over 24 hrs. She’s now saying I abused her for 7 years. She was so vile. She was shouting at me that she will make sure I lose my job, my house and everything. She was saying I’m a sad loser who has no friends because everyone hates me. She said I should go and kill myself because there’s nothing left for me.
my dad has to drive out and convince her to get in his car and she had a bath at his and some food and then seemed to calm a bit and then we were talking about holidays and cajoling her along until she came home.

This is so heartbreaking OP . Do you have cctv at yours ? Outside your home too ? I would invest in some ( Amazon has them for less than £20 each . I do worry you will end up in trouble because she lies so much . Your child needs help but you need to be able to help her safely too . Please contact social services and tell them what happened . Contact the school and tell them what happened and the police . Try and get them on your side

TheSquareMile · 06/03/2024 23:30

I feel so sorry for you, this is awful.

I wonder whether Coram Child Law Advice could help you.

Something I think they would be able to advise on would be whether you could draw on either legislation or case law to establish that your daughter needs to be educated at a residential school where her very clear needs could be addressed. This option would keep her safe and you too.

If you are able to contact them, do make it clear just how severe the current situation is and what is happening.

Your description of what has happened in the last few days is very worrying.

https://childlawadvice.org.uk/clas/contact-child-law-advice/

Dontjudgeme101 · 06/03/2024 23:32

I am so sorry op that you are going through this. 💐💐💐

Coshei · 06/03/2024 23:32

@TotoroElla ”Oh this situation will cure her autism will it?” Again. I never said this, and I see no point in engaging any further with you if you decide to twist words around.

@Flojoloco I’m very sorry to read your update. I second what pp said and it might be good idea to record conversations with her without her noticing. Keep safe and please keep in mind that her nasty words are not true, and “just” an expression of her frustration. That doesn’t excuse them, but remember that you are doing a better job than most of us would.

MrsElijahMikaelson1 · 06/03/2024 23:33

Get some nanny cams and have them everywhere recording to protect yourself

WhatNoRaisins · 07/03/2024 07:01

I agree with PP, cameras and legal advice if you can afford it to keep yourself safe in this situation. Hope you're ok this morning.

Spanglemum75 · 07/03/2024 07:48

Email social worker relating what happened, just so there is a 'paper' trail. Will she go to school today? How is she at school?