My brother has hidden my nephews rugby playing...

[touchrugby]

Asking for my brother - I think he’s in a mess and I need to tell him what to expect and how unreasonable he was. Interested to hear from other divorced parents and sports teachers/ school administrators. I’ve tried to give as much context as possible.

My brother got divorced 4 years ago. They have (had?) an amicable coparent relationship- there was no cheating or unkindness in either side. My brother just became obsessed with giving his family a good life and he worked a lot of hours. When he wasn’t working he was a very engaged parent- my nephew is hugely sporty and they were always off doing sports- swimming, tennis, football, cross country etc. Ex SIL was a SAHP but eventually got frustrated (with justification) at never seeing her husband so went back to work and divorced him. They share 50/50 custody with my brother as the higher earner paying all DNs expenses.

My brother really wanted nephew to go to this very nice private school. To facilitate this he pays all the fees. It’s a great academic school so ex SIL was pretty happy-except for the sport. They’re a big rugby school and she was adamant that DN not play rugby due to injury risks. There was a big argument about it, with my brother and DN really wanting rugby, and her adamant that he wouldn’t play.

The school offers non contact rugby and eventually they agreed DN would do that. DN is in year 9 now and it’s recently come out that he switched to full contact rugby in the 3rd week of year 7 and SIL didn’t know. It’s come out because he’s recently been made captain of the A team and a few mums congratulated her.

It seems he hated the non contact team. He’s very gifted with sport and apparently it was a team of lads who just wanted to run around for a few hours and throw a ball. The school put little effort into it and there were no matches. He asked to switch to “proper” rugby and the school said they needed a parent to approve it- and my brother did.

His argument is that his son wanted it, the school did email SIL as well, and it’s been 2.5 years.
Her argument is that he knew her stance, he also knows she’s a bit disorganised and rarely reads emails especially ones about sport which she know my brother manages (she has over 10,000 unread emails on her phone!) and that my brother conspired to hide it.

She has a very valid point about the conspiring. She has a new partner. He works Saturdays so my brother used to have DN every Friday night so they could see each other, and he’d then take him to Sat morning matches before dropping him at SILs Sat evening. Brother and DN have both, in 2.5 years, managed not to say anything to her about his rugby which is obviously duplicitous, especially considering how good he is. Brother just managed all the kit and the washing and the games and it apparently never came up in conversation.

Shes utterly furious and is going to the school Monday to tell them to remove him from rugby. Brother planning on going to the school to tell them to keep him in rugby. DN is apparently going to refuse to return to his mums house unless she agrees to the rugby and is determined to continue.

I’ve maintained a good friendship with SIL. In many ways I’m closer her than my brother as I see her more (he’s still a workaholic in his non parenting time so he’s hard to get hold of!) I heard about the odd match but nothing specific, I assumed it was non contact and frankly don’t know anything about rugby anyway. She’s very unhappy with our family as obviously our parents knew as well. My dad watches half the matches!

Does anyone know what the school might do? My brother and nephew are digging their heels in and saying he’ll live full time at my brothers and my brother will therefore get full parental responsibility. I think this is rubbish and not legal. I am worried that a nice coparenting relationship is ruined and that SIL might lose my nephew. He loves his mum but he’s obsessed with sport and apparently A team captain at a school like his is a BIG deal. He’s already playing some 2nd eleven matches as well which is also apparently important. I don’t know how to feel about what my brother did. He has absolutely supported what DN wanted. My nephew is so happy playing rugby and so good at it and still uninjured, and it’s the game played by 90% of the school. She knew sending him there that if he didn’t play rugby he’d be a bit isolated but she will not have it.

Frankly I think there’s fault on both sides, but on balance how much more unreasonable was my brother and what the hell might happen next?

Contact rugby is incredibly dangerous for a developing teen male.
The children playing are charging head on and impact is almost like hitting concrete.
Sure, they have 'sports kit' but do your research.
Search for all the children that are now paralysed, have brain damage, cannot hear properly from this sport.
This is an adult males sport and it is not for teen children.

Skiing is pretty dangerous. Just because something is non-contact, doesn’t make it safe.

Regardless, the c. 14 year old in question here wants to play rugby. He is likely extremely proud of being captain of the U14 A team. His mum needs to actually listen to what he wants and support him.
Indeed, she should consider putting on a warm coat and turning up to watch him
play.

He enjoys his rugby. Crossing the road is more risky. Will she prevent him from learning todrive when he is 17?

Rugby is played at private schools. He enjoys it. Shes being ridiculous. Yes there are risks by good training minimises thwae

This is complete rubbish. They are not charging 'head on'.

Your brother was a prime idiot. Your SIL is right to feel undermined. Effectively your brother has taught his son that is ok to lie to his mother. That is the thing that would annoy me most, and set a crap precedent heading into the teen years.

There were other more careful ways to discuss the situation and maybe make a decision for him, but I doubt that this can be done after the duplicity.

What absolutely rubbish!

Children are absolutely not “charging head on” the fact you’ve even commented claiming this shows how little you know about the game!

I'm also interested in the 'sports kits'

So your nephew plays a mainstream sport and is captain of the team and your sister in-law has an issue with him playing a mainysport for safety reasons?

Get a grip? What is this? So mainstream sport is too dangerous for her precious child who is so reluctant he has been captain of the A team? Umm total balls? Darling your sister in law is in fantasy land. Pleased your brother has some sense.

Absolutely mental! How controlling! Your son isn't jumping off a cliff this is normal sport! He hasn't got a health condition! Wow! Just astonished

What with it being a 6 Nations weekend - does your SiL follow any of the countries playing rugby and cheer for any of them?

Genuine question.

oh, this thread has expanded one of my favourite quips. The answer now serves TWO questions

Option 1
How can you tell if someone is a vegan?

and
option 2:
How can you tell if someone is a private school parent?

answer:
oh don’t worry, they’ll tell you.

🤣

State schools play rugby too!!! Often very, very well, despite having far fewer resources

Because this is Mumsnet where mothers rarely do wrong but men invariably do

I think your SIL is being ridiculous. I can understand her upset and frustration but I think she needs to take a step back and think about her son’s needs. To be captain at a rugby-focused private school he must be very good, like potential to play professionally good. He clearly loves it, to make him stop would be beyond cruel and short sighted and sounds like she’ll just lose her son and that might drive a life long wedge. BUT I think you should stay out of it. Do not pick sides stay cordial with all. And in fact being a ear for your DN now I’m sure he’d appreciate that

As a parent, she shouldn't have assumed anything

Well yes, it turns out that she should never have assumed that her ex was a man of his word.

This goes way beyond the rights and wrongs of rugby. Her son has been taught by his male role model that it is ok to lie and deceive.

And now, according to some people, she is in the wrong for being gullible.

Skiing is probably just as (if not more) dangerous yet the SIL has no issues with skiing because she goes herself.

I skied as a child and every year there were people travelling back with broken legs, broken arms or worse. All it takes is one skid on the snow/ice and you're fucked.

Im sorry your brother behaved very badly. Regardless of the sport’s risks and what your DN wanted yada yada… your brother:

1. lied to his ex wife
2. taught his son to lie to his mother and hide the truth from her
3. eventually driven the wedge between him and his mom to the point that he is ready to choose a sport over his mother

This is just terrible behaviour and terrible lesson in life. Is rugby really worth it?

Whether she trusts her ex or not shouldn't even come into it.

If, as a parent of an 11 year old child, I was genuinely concerned about the safety of a sport my child was playing at school, I wouldn't just sit back, stick my fingers in my ears and not pay it any attention for the next three years.

I would be reading every e-mail, engaging with the teachers (where necessary) and attending matches so I could reassure myself that it was all okay.

She hasn't been gullible, she's purposefully chosen to stick her head in the sand and ignore everything to do with her sons' activities. And now it's come to bite her on the backside.

That doesn't excuse her ex's behaviour - of course it doesn't - but if she'd paid attention in the first place, I don't see how any of this could even have happened.

What I don't like is the idea that your brother may (apparently) be conniving with your nephew to deceive your SIL. I hope that is not happening, but it's difficult to believe it isn't.
There's far too much lying and deceit in society as it is. No good parent encourages, or even tolerates, lying or deceit in their kids.
Mind you, given our current crop of politicians and their origins, lying seems to have been a set subject in some private schools.

The type of injury is different. I for one would not ski because a) I'm not interested, and b) I wouldn't risk injury in it. But the sort of injuries you mention are not the ones most parents worry about when it comes to rugby. Basically broken bones is the most likely with skiing, but with rugby, you add broken neck and potential brain damage.

Big rugby family here, not in a million years would I or anyone else if my generation - sibs, cousins etc allow our kids to play rugby.

But that’s almost by the by. Your brother has been a duplicitous arsehole, and has involved his son. Presumably as mr BIG at work he’s been used to getting his own way, by whatever means necessary. was he this controlling in their relationship too? His needs always first? His way always the right way and ‘best’ for the family and everyone?
I imagine so.
she’ll never trust him again, and now she’ll wonder about her son too.

and as for DN loving the sport - no one will really know, will they? If his super busy father pays him attention because of rugby, is proud of him because of rugby, shows an interest. Because of rugby. The son will feel pressured, or just want his attention, to play rugby.
If dad was a tennis freak, or loved swimming g or basketball it would have been the same.

Theres been a recent study comparing rugby for children to child abuse. And much as I love the sport I find it hard to disagree.

You've worked insanely hard to get everyone on your brother's side here, including a ton of irrelevant info like how your brother earns more and (appropriately) pays for more of DH's expenses because of it.

Your brother has encouraged his son to lie and sneak around behind his mother's back to do something that she plainly saw as a safety risk for years. That is atrocious parenting and co-parenting. Regardless of the initial disagreement or whether mum was being overly protective, that was an utterly unacceptable solution - it was terrible to teach his son that lying on that scale was ok, it was destructive to his son's relationship with his mother, and destructive to his co-parenting relationship.

As for what you should do? Absolutely nothing. Stay completely out of it. This is not your place.

Rugby is a full contact sport with all that entails - head injuries being the most worrying. I don’t know a rugby player who hasn’t had multiple concussions- they do have a long term affect.
Broken bones, nose, sprains skeletal damage are actually less worrying though can have long term consequences

I LOVE rugby but unfortunately it is going to have to change.

I’d best tell my 9yo daughter - the best tackler in her mixed sex team by miles - that you need a penis to play.

Is your brother a misogynist? That’s the vibe I’m getting.